MovieChat Forums > Inside Deep Throat (2005) Discussion > Is anyone else offended by the reviews p...

Is anyone else offended by the reviews posted?


It is simply grotesque to refer to a woman's autobiographical
recounting of torture, humiliation, and rape as "juicy." Linda Lovelace
is a hero to women today because she had the strength to escape her
hellish life despite the psychological damage that often keeps women
trapped due to their decimated self-image. She accepted the inevitable
derision and mockery she knew she would face by confronting her
tormentors and speaking openly about their brutality. She was in no way
trying to titillate morons who read it for the smut.

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>>>It is simply grotesque to refer to a woman's autobiographical
recounting of torture, humiliation, and rape as "juicy."

I don't think "juicy" is usually used to mean "sexually arousing". When you're talking about gossip or an expose, the word usually means something like "very interesting".

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How about you see the movie before making judgemental posts?

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How about you see the movie before making judgemental posts?

Bansidhewail wasn't criticizing the film or comments about the film. He or she was criticizing comments about Linda Lovelace's book.

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Have you actually seen the film? Have you actually seen that she went on to star in several other films and was even modeling nude shortly before her death in 2002? Linda Lovelace was NOTORIOUS for contradicting herself, but I will admit that in the film her acting and the look in her eyes seems to be void of meaning or enthusiasm, but that can be passed for bad acting very easily. The film made her the heroine that she is simply because women saw the freedom they felt she expressed in her role and sought to seek it themselves, even more so that they got the chance to exercise a constitutional right to see the movie in the first place.

Clearly she is enjoying herself in many of the scenes of the film. The film required ACTING, and gee, if she was drugged or forced against her will, she sure did hold her own pretty well. She even starred in the second damn one! And why crusade against something you sold yourself into in the first place? It may not have been her choice to star in "Deep Throat," okay, but how about the countless titles to come after it?

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The point isn't whether you believe Linda Lovelace was raped. The point isn't that you are entitled to whatever opinion you may have on that topic, nor that there will NEVER be an answer to that question, because it is something that no one who wasn't there will ever know, and no one who was there has any credibility to comment on (one is dead and was hardly taken seriously when she did speak, and those who are still alive would be crazy to say anything other than what they always have, and that doesn't make it any more or less true, just impossible to prove one way or the other). The point IS that whether or not 100% of her story was objectively true to all those who were participants in the many many horrors she describes having gone through, they are in fact horrors, and even if they were chapters in a Dean Koontz novel instead of an autobiography, they are not sexy, not juicy, not exciting. They are to be taken seriously as subject matter even if the poor woman herself never was, because for god's sake, rape and psychological torture are not cool, and it's horrifying that people don't seem to think of it that way.

And how is it we live in a society that has learned to feel sorry for the poor, underpaid billionaires, taking the sides of the ballplayers who go on strike, or the Hollywood stars who feel that they should make more just because someone else has, or the CEOs who get platinum parachutes while they lay off all their workers...yet Linda Lovelace was cheated out of a reasonable paycheck when she starred in the movie referred to over and over as the most profitable film ever, and there has been no kindness or pity toward her on that point even?

If you only live in movies, maybe you don't really live at all (Harvey Danger)

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I wonder how well does "bansidhewail" know Linda Lovelace. That she has been performing those "rapes" before <i>Deep Throat</i> came along.

"rape and psychological torture are not cool"
Does that include falsified or falsely labeled "rape and psychological torture"? Nobody here knew if anybody pointed a gun to her head to make her perform sex acts. According to the filmmakers, she did it willingly and probably enjoyed it. But people can change their minds about things. Just as there are people like yourself that choose to see only what they want to see.

On the plus side, Linda didn't go to jail for being in the movie. Harry Reems did. But that is apparantly not important to bansidhewail. People choose to see only what they want to see.

The only offense here is that you don't with the reviews. For some people, it's personal.

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Unfortunately for everyone of the anti-porn crusaders that held up Linda Lovelace's "auto-biography" as prove that the pornography industry is "evil", Miss Lovelace recanted 98% of her story and was planning a comeback to the industry shortly before her early demise from cancer.

The "auto-biography" was a fabrication by her own admission, fueled by regret over money and an over-zealous editor that would not release the original book.

Ms. Lovelace was inducted into the adult film Hall of Fame posthumously and the award was accepted by her daughter who said that she only wished that her Mother had lived long enough to set the record staright and make up for all the people her lies hurt.

I found the Passion of the Christ to be easily one of the most violently offensive films ever made, but I still support Mel Gibson's right to make it.

In closing, chew on this. If your so offended by the subject matter, why did you visit the page in the first place?

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I'll second that.

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Lovelace's torments in life (if that's truly what they were to her) were at her then-husband's hands, not some low budget filmmakers.' People with an anti-porn agenda choose not to focus on that.

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"I found the Passion of the Christ to be easily one of the most violently offensive films ever made, but I still support Mel Gibson's right to make it.

In closing, chew on this. If your so offended by the subject matter, why did you visit the page in the first place?"

Amen, brother. I hated "The Passion" just as much for the same reason. Not because I'm against violence in movies (in fact, some of my favorite films are ultra-bloody), but because Gibson manipulated and guilt-tripped viewers in becoming "better believers" by making it so viscerally graphic and almost masochistic (yet many devout Christians ignored the kind of violence that they'd usually protest about any other movie, TV show, or video game).

But as far as porno goes, here's my two cents:

If these women (or men) are over 18, participating under their own free will, and being vigilant of possible pregnancy or STDs, then let them do it. I have nothing whatsoever against porn. As sleazy as it may be, it's still freedom of speech and expression. And sure, it may sometimes objectify women, but also keep in mind that these women are choosing to do porn, and therefore know of the possible consequences, good or bad.

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CANCER???? I don't know what rock you have been under for the last 3 years or what drugs you have been taking??? Linda died from a car crash. She was on life support for almost 2 months... Her family (Son and Daughter) pulled the plug.
Planning a comeback months before she died? Proof of that? She was on unemployment and almost pennyless just before her car crash. Just before her death she was STILL outspoken AGAINST the porn industry. There was talk that she might pose nude but NOTHING ever came of it.....
Ron Howard payed Linda back in 96' for the rights to her story to be put on film. I bet she wouldn't have been happy about what Ron bank rolled if she would have lived to see it.

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Am I offended by the review(s) posted? No.
I am more offended by your attempts to shame people with your rather short sighted and obviously poorly researched posts.
It seems rather ironically obvious that the review you mention shares some of your views. Yet you fixate upon "juicy" and assume that means erotically stimulating. A previous post clears that up for you.
Good luck with your myopia.

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re: "Jenna Jamison, another soon to be washed up porn star"

huh?

i was at Internext and AVN expos this year in las vegas, both of them adult expos, and i met Jenna Jameson, and she is definitely not soon to be washed up, i have the photos of hundreds of her fans around her, and it was difficult to even get an autograph.

may i ask how did you come to that conclusion about her so-called soon to be career demise?

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Well, Jenna is a businesswoman first, a porn star second. She has some coin, so I doubt she'll ever be washed up. She's made most of her money off nude dancing, not to mention her book and other marketing gimmicks. While many others do, I don't think Jenna falls into the drugged out category.

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I just saw this film, and saw HBO's documentary on the high-class photographer who shot all the porn stars in clothes. HBO's stuff tends to be kind of glib, very glossy, and often not very focused. (Compare with some of these laser-like documentaries like "Bukowski".)

But I see some nits to pick in your (Benji's) message.

"There have been many before her that have claimed to be "businesspeople." People whose first career choice in life is to undress and screw on camera are usually not very good businesspeople."

You can edit that sentence any number of ways and it still works.

People...are usually not very good businesspeople. Certainly not the people I've met. ("First career choice", well, it wasn't in most cases.) Are porn players any better or worse than, say, an average group of 19-22 year olds that suddenly come into a lot of money? Maybe. If you normalized for substance abuse? Probably not.

"Almost everyone in the porno industry winds up broke and washed up."

Again, this works editing out "porno": Almost everyone winds up broke and washed up. Maybe it's not true of the populace as a whole, it is probably true for any group of people who don't lead conventional lives, mainstream, low-budget and porn actors not excluded. Just scan IMDB's death list for people who have died in Canoga Park. (The rich and famous don't die in Canoga Park.) Check out Veronica Lake, Frances Farmer, hell, Judy Garland: Show biz ain't kind.

"Nobody is going to pay to watch you copulate at 35 or 40. Live long enough and you will see this. Traci Lords seems to be the only person that has hung on for any length of time and this is because she is the first porn star to make a successful transition to legit work."

The most famous men in porn have been working for 20-30 years, so that's certainly not the case with men. The HBO documentary on the photographer had Ron Jeremy (52) and Peter North (48).

And I can't seem to flip through my cable channels without seeing Nina Hartley (45), Marilyn Chambers (52), Veronica Hart (48), fronting a movie or being interviewed--and a quick scan of their IMDB listings suggest that people WILL pay to watch them copulate at 35, 40, hell, 50. Further bolstering this is the fact that IMDB links to web sites for many of these women where, yes, you guessed it, you can pay for the privelege of watching them copulate.

This "documentary" also showed Georgina Spelvin, who started fornicating on film in her late 30s. According to her IMDB bio, she retired from adult films at 47. She's pushing 70 and does, in fact, seem to be retired.

Not to say that porn is easy or "just like" any other business. One thing repeated over and over again--by the successful women, no less--is that it's a very tough business and it changes a person.

But it's probably not safe to make sweeping statements about people involved in the industry as a group, without doing a whole bunch of research.

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One of the things that people seem not to know is Lovelace actually started working in the "adult" industry (Not as a performer) again before her death. The documentary I thought was very good and did not make anyone look good or bad. I would recommend anyone who was intrigued by this film to read the Book "The Other Hollywood" which also show the business for exactly what it is

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You should take a look at Jenna's book. "How To Make Love Like A Porn Star". It's a GOOD insight into HER world. Very good reading.
And by the way... She is a MULTI-Millioniare buisnesswoman.
Check out www.clubjenna.com
You could say drink, drugs, and crime are in any business. Pro athletes, regualr movies stars, and even Presidents.

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I was nearly about to post the exact same thing you did. I think those limitations the end of a porn star's career are long gone. I think that we are in a time where porn and even stripers are more accepted and celebrated than ever, not looked as down upon as before, but infact have the opportunity to venture out and have success beyond their years in porn. Jenna IS a BUSINESSWOMAN who is successful~ No matter if the people who have watched her in porn (like it as they might have) discredit or disrespect her because of what she choose as a profession... not respecting her (not talking about as a person but as a businesswoman) or not approving doesn't make it any less of the truth. Further more I can't imagine Carmen Electra nor Pamela Anderson ending the way as described either... they started in the sex business (striping)for many years, they turned their name soley into a business that continues to pay, because, lets be honest, they really dont have any talent.
So I think the statement that all people of the sex industry are going to end up the same way, washed up, ect... well that could be said of everything. It's not really the way it has to be now.

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Not really. Asia Carrera was a harvard student, and classically trained pianist. She used porn as an investment and did quite well. I think the times of the 70s had a lot of burn out, drugs and sex. It was a very difficult time. The porn of the time was political revolution as well as a way to make money in a horrible recession that the Vietnam War contributed to, as well as the gas crunch. I think there are some smart business people, or else there wouldnt be a porno industry at all. the drugs thing was sort of a way to placate yourself, and it made the transition into it easier. they may have thought it was like Dionysius back then. They really felt empowered at the time. A lot of wealthy people indulged in porno, invested in porno and are more involved in it than you would think. Many people are manipulated into bad business decisions (like, Annabel Chong, for instance). The lifestyle of drugs would ruin you in anyfield - athletics, politics, business, anything. The porn thing was over emphasized. In Europe, it is really no big deal. Its america's attitude toward sex that ruins. And as for the no one wants to watch you copulate at 35 or 40 - what about the M.I.L.F. motif of American Pie? and the Graduate? Several people were famous doin it, and talking about it at an older age - hello? Ruth Westheimer?

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bansidhewail is clearly a lesbian feminazi.

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I read Linda Lovelace's autobiography and I have seen deep throat. So that makes me qualified to log an opinion.

Linda Lovelace wrote a book because she needed money. She accused her former boyfriend of everything under the sun except the JFK murder. So she loses credibility there. She could not act, but then most porn stars can't so she is in good company there. The films that she did were not all that great. I don't see her as anything special when it comes to giving blow jobs. She was extremely over-rated in my opinion.

If Chuck Traynor was such a brutal monster, then why didn't Marilyn Chambers write a tell all book about his abuse considering that she was the next woman in Traynor's life once Linda spaced out and moved into the Twilight Zone? How is it that Marilyn Chambers went on to make a better and more lasting place in porn than Linda? Why is it that Marilyn Chambers looks so damn good today for her age if Chuck Traynor was such a brutal monster?

Could it not be possible that Linda Lovelace was born into this world a perpetual victim, with no clue about anything? So when the money ran out she did was most people like her do...write a tell all book.

As far as I am concerned she is way over-rated and too much valuable time is being spent discussing her since after all she is dead and it's a moot point.

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Yes, I am. Other folks here are missing the point. The point is not 'is Linda Lovelace a liar or not'. The point is this: is a book about being raped something "juicy"? No. The book may be true, it may be false, but either way it's not "juicy". The book is horrific and it's gross. If you find it juicy and a turn on, then there's something wrong with you. Even if Lovelace is a liar. (And I say this as someone who like sexually explicit material.)

Think about it this way - let's pretend that Schindler never helped any Jews, that Schindler's List was entirely made up. Would that make Schindler's List 'juicy' or anything like that? No. It would make it false, but still horrific. It's the same thing. If you see Schindler's List or read Lovelace's book and you think it's 'juicy' then there's something wrong with you.



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Well, I would agree with you only in that Ordeal was rather disgusting and not at all arousing, but I and others believe the book was largely trumped up and sensationalized by a woman who regretted her choices in life, and an author (McGrady) who did his best to enhance the ugliness. But none of us were actually there with Ms. Lovelace, so we have to make up our own minds as to what we choose to believe. Focusing exclusively on the making of Deep Throat, Lovelace had mostly good things to say about those involved.

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