MovieChat Forums > American Gun (2007) Discussion > If you are against guns, read this

If you are against guns, read this

posted 15 years ago by ggr2003
13 replies | jump to latest

Jefferson, with some help and advice from Franklin and Adams had incredible foresight and wisdom when he wrote the Declaration of Independence, and did not write this part for the heck of it... "That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, (That being the right of Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness) it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness."
Because of this responsibility we have, as Americans of our 50 States, and districts, and territories, Mr. Madison wrote and rewrote the Second Amendment to our Bill of Rights – The Right to keep and bear arms. With specific wording so the rights of the individual, (what a republic stands for...) Our Republic defends individual rights and also keeps us safe.
Second Amendment - The Right to keep and bear arms.
"a well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."
Many debates over wording have been twisted and turned, but when you look at 1st drafts through to the final version, it is plain to see that we were meant to KEEP as well as BEAR arms if necessary. (Earliest versions had the religious objectors protected from having the right NOT to keep or bear arms!) It was realized that this could be used by religion to disarm the people, and was left out.
WHY HAVE I been so long winded on this subject... there are over 10 million dead Jews, Gypsies, Homosexuals, Catholics and anyone else HITLER did not like when Hitler made everyone turn in any firearm to the state in the late 1930's Germany. You don't hear or see any Israelis talking about getting rid of or turning in their guns. They learned a hard lesson.
Thank you, Mr. Jefferson and Mr. Madison for looking out for my Rights.

[–] ggr2003 15 years ago

I am so right!

[–] sisterdebmac 15 years ago

Yeah, zzzzzzz. I'm a bleeding heart liberal with two guns who loved this movie. Wanna talk about that?
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[–] HeisenbergsLastStand 15 years ago

No, it is saying that people who are against certain ideas such as guns do not have the right to take or limit the rights that the person can have pertaining to that idea, in this case guns. For me, the Second Amendment says what it intends VERY clearly. For anti-gun people though, they are the reason Amendments such as the 9th are in place.

"Every time there is a bang, the world's a wanker short." -Billy Connolly

[–] sisterdebmac 15 years ago

So I suppose you're part of a well-regulated militia then?
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[–] HeisenbergsLastStand 15 years ago

Actually, I am. From about two years ago.

"Every time there is a bang, the world's a wanker short." -Billy Connolly

[–] geoh777 13 years ago

The supposedly "well regulated militia" (the various national guards) are all controlled by the federal government (note that they wear the uniforms of the U.S. services). That's why they are always deployed to the U.S. government's "trouble spots" (e.g. Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan). So, when they are all deployed, they, and their guns, are gone and being killed, wounded, made into PTSD cases.

Is it possible to see how federal entanglement neutralizes any "the National Guard is the well regulated militia" idea? ...and why there needs to be a body of men and women with their own weapons who are ready to perform the functions of a militia?

Militias were all local civilian forces in the beginning of this country.

Today, the federal government is highly suspicious of any militia of any size at all. Also, the federal government's "limited warfare" concepts and repeated and costly "blunders" have led to "slow meat grinder" conflicts, actual defeats (Vietnam), and such to the point that the American people are tired of conflict, guns, and so on. This has extended to the point that the people are essentially anti-war and consequently anti-defense, and a major result is that the "well-regulated militia" has a problem: lack of participation.

Now, the major problem of firearms is criminals with guns. But, you are still much, much more likely to be killed or injured in an automobile accident, to the point that anyone who frets about guns is an idiot if he does not take a defensive driving course where there is actual driving involved with an instructor aboard. A good defensive driving course where the student pays attention and actually applies his knowledge to his daily driving is the best way to prevent a disaster in his life. However, this takes a concerted and continued effort, instead of spending 45 minutes writing a fear-driven letter to her or his member of Congress, and consequently is seldom done.

[–] buckshot69 14 years ago

Thats an excellent point I hadn't considered.

Mother Juggs and speed, is it mother Juggs and speed?

[–] rlburns666 12 years ago

This is idiotic. Do you honestly think if the Federal government really wanted to take away your rights and impose a totalitarian police state, that your guns would be able to stop them.
No ones trying to take your guns away, just to make it a little less likely that they will end up in the hands of some whacko that will use them to shoot up a school, post office, church etc.
The NRA and the gun manufacturers love it when a Democrat is in the White House. NRA membership and gun sales skyrocket when they stir up the paranoia of far right kooks who believe that them evil Demmycrats are comin to take away their weapons.

[–] zwolf 11 years ago

I'm actually pro-gun, but here's my problem with your argument:

What if I don't trust the judgement of the people who think they're "protecting us from the next Hitler" or whatever? Because all too often, the people making these arguments are delusional idiots.

A lot of religious whackjobs have guns, for instance. I'm no friend of religious fanatics - they're not good people, and they're not acting in my interests. So, should I trust their judgement about the government when they also believe in a lot of other ridiculous, illogical, and silly stuff?

Or, extreme right-wingers who think everyone left of George Will is some kind of "socialist" who's trying to destroy the Constitution or some other such bulls**t? I don't trust their judgement, either.

Almost every "militia" group I've seen has been unreasonable, ill-informed, crazy, and full of wrong ideas. So, I'm not feeling "safer" because they're protecting what they think is our "liberty."

Hell, I've got my guns to protect myself from most other gun nuts, because so many of them are such idiots.

In other words, don't do me any favors.

[–] sisterdebmac 11 years ago

Brilliant post, zwolf. Love it. You really nailed pretty much how I feel. And yeah, I've got a handgun. So I'm not anti-gun. I am, however, anti-gun-nut.
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