MovieChat Forums > Mongol (2008) Discussion > Genghis was worse than Hitler

Genghis was worse than Hitler


Genghis declared war, and took many rich cities with frightful bloodshed. The Mongols swept across the Iranian interior, leaving a trail of destruction in their wake. Whole cities were put to the torch and mass killings of women and children as well as fighting men were common.

Mongols killed many civilians. Just in Merv and Urgench(Gorganj) about a million civilians were slaughtered.
During 1220–21 Bukhara, Samarkand, Herat, Tus, and Neyshabur were razed, and the whole populations were slaughtered. the total population of the Persian Empire may have dropped from 2,500,000 to 250,000 as a result of mass extermination by Mongols and subsequently famine.The results of the Mongol invasion for the Iranian economy were disastrous. The well-developed networks of qanat irrigation systems that had previously made possible a largely continuous pattern of habitation across large areas of Iran were laid to waste, leaving a series of isolated oasis towns in its place. Furthermore, since the population had been decimated, Iran was left without the workforce required to recover itself.
The library of Alamut was put to fire, denying subsequent scholars the knowledge that could have unlocked the secrets of the Ismailis and the schools and libraries founded by Nezam al-Molk were also destroyed. It is said that the schools at Nishapur burned for months before all of its treasures were finally consumed.



The Mongols were sometimes called the Tatars, which is actually a corruption of the Chinese term for one of the Mongol peoples. In Roman mythology, however, Tartarus was the Roman equivalent of Hell. There were famous to make towers out of Peoples head.
The Mongol subjugation of Russia was brutal and humiliating and contributed greatly to that sense of tragedy that so deeply imbues Russian culture and art.

Like the Seljuks before them, the Mongols were very open to the cultural influences of the civilisations that they had conquered. They were practical enough to admit Persian scholars, physicians, jurists and soldiers into circles of the highest rank.




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Frankly, this is nonsense. For starters, at the worst massacres, Genghis was not even present, nor did he order them. Rather, his sons took care of them. By the standards of the time, Genghis was one of the most enlightened and merciful rulers and the Siege of Bukhara shows that.

Genghis never had anyone slaughtered based on them being 'lesser beings,' but rather if they opposed him. On the flip side, he was incredible merciful at times and many cities prospered under his rule. He developed free trade, universal currencies, postal systems, enlightenment and learning in his empire.

I advise reading Jack Weatherford's book on him.w..it's certainly enlightening

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Ventrue you know he did not develop universal currency throughout the empire and that the postal systems in Iran were thousands of years old. You know that he found little use for learning and that he burnt librarys and cities without thinking. Why are you just leaving stuff out.

In one city he ordered the 100 most intelligent people to be picked. Then massacred the rest, all 250,000 of them. That was a khwarazm city I can't remeber the name of. Begins with O. That reminds me, much of southern Iran and most of Iraq are desert because of the mongols. The irrigation systems in the area never recovered so the land reverted to desert and never went back. The downfall of Islam into extremism started with the mongols also as all muslim learning was annihilated and isolated oasis communities as the man says, were all that was left centralising and polarising the faith which has left Middle Eastern Islam in the state it was in the 1200's a never evolving religion.

Genghis Khan is responsible for many of the worlds ills.

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I don't even need to read your post. Hitler killed millions upon millions of innocent people for no reason but hatred and evil.

Genghis killed those who opposed him, the same as nearly every ruler who has ever had half as much power as him

This is just a foolish and disrespectful thread to even start

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To the OP - SO what? What the Mongols did, pretty much every warlord and conquerer in the past did as well. Even big old Muhammad(not the bear) indulged in massacres of his enemies.

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I think you should actually learn how much a trillion is before trying to use it in any sort of argument.

If you disagree god will reach down from the heavens & bust your chops. That's science.

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So much for the laws layed down in the movie:

436
01:29:04,840 --> 01:29:09,440
Mongols need laws that
will unite them in a tight knot.

437
01:29:09,720 --> 01:29:13,800
For the pillaging to stop and
mothers to want to bear children.

438
01:29:14,240 --> 01:29:18,240
The mongol punishment
will be one - DEATH!

439
01:29:35,760 --> 01:29:40,560
To the one to raise a sword
on children or women - DEATH!

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I'm Kurdish so Mongols more then likely killed plenty of my people too but I can't hate Genghis anymore then Alexander the great or Cesar. While it's not pretty to see how they got their power, almost always winning because of the tactics they used instead of actually size since no Mongols army was ever bigger then I think like 200k or maybe 20k, honestly don't remember, he knew how to use every soldier he had and I have to respect him for the power he amassed just like I respect everyone from Cesar and Alexander to Napoleon and even Stalin. From almost nothing to huge mass of power. They all killed many, soldiers and civilians, whether it was by their orders or not.

I can easily hate one of his Grand-sons who declared war on Islam and sieged Baghdad, then when he got it is men killed pretty much anyone they could with death toll ranging from 90,000-1,000,000 civilians and soldiers alike. His men also destroyed the Grand Library of Baghdad which was one of the greatest libraries of the time. Since my people are pretty close in range to Baghdad now and then, it's likely many of them were killed in all times of Mongolian rule, especially since we don't like being oppressed by any other culture.(today kurds are fighting Turks and Iranians, and one large victory being Saddam taken out of the picture)

The world could've stopped him but they didn't team up and by the time they realized what happened he'd grown too powerful with soldiers from too many lands he'd conquered. I might respect Genghis but I sure as hell don't like him. Who the hell would other then people from Mongolia.

Evil triumphs when good men do nothing
http://profile.yuwie.com/saberspeed

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You are a moron who's been duped by the Western (losing side) of history about Genghis Khan. I'm not saying GK was an angle, but can sit back and let you say Alexander was one either. Having "the Great" at the end of your name doesn't make you great. So Alexander was killed and conquer more humanly, is that it? I thought killing is killing. So it come down to the simple fact that you're racist, white guy versus Asian. White guy kills and conquers Asian, he becomes Great and "ruled with respect." Asian guy does it, he's a rapist and murder. Yes, and none of Alexander's army, not a one, burn, pillaged or raped anybody, gentlemen killers all the way, because we all know smiles and sunshine will always convince people to give over their land just like that. Give me break. Oh, sorry, I hope I didn't keep you from you Neo-Nazi rally. Yes, white power, dude.

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Genghis was a badass, and anyone who says differently is a liar.

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Mercilessness, rape, pillaging and murder are terrific tools of war. They are about as unpleasant as I can imagine, but as tools of war, they are the best.

Your enemy, if left alone out of a sense of honor or mercy will slit your throat while you sleep. It's kill or be killed. Revenge fantasies would consume my every thought if I was a boy who watched my parents killed. My enemies would be best off to kill me, too.

Ancient times were nothing like modern sensibilities. There were no liberal cultural elites from New York City in ancient Mongolia.

This is the problem with the USA facing jihad. It's 10th century, iron tools, nothing to live for thinking versus liberal NYC yuppie girls and boys with kids in prep school. If it wasn't for the technology advantage of the USA, the NYC yuppies would be 6 feet under with jihadists dancing on their graves.

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hmm, Mercilessness, rape, pillaging and murder are still terrible things which should be condemned, no matter what the age of history we are speaking of.

The only thing that as acceptable in the past, that is not acceptable today is aggression and conquest of another land.

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Your right. We have superior weapons now, economic, cultural, ideological weapons, targeted killings (drones too). But has the u.s won any wars?

Lost vietnam war, korean war (due to creating north korea and communist china), afghanistan war and iraq war.

The only war the u.s won was against japan, and it used 2 nuclear weapons.

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It was ancient times so it's okay because during peacetimes conditions improved right? lol.

Their tactic was terror.

On the BBC documentary about Genghis Khan they mentioned records from witnesses who entered Beijing a month after the Mongols sacked it and Genghis Khan left the city for his Army to begin their victory pillaging/raping. They noted that the earth was greasy with human fat and blood. Sounds alot like Nanking with the Japanese. Also read alot of accounts of Mongol atrocities against the people they conquered. I.E. In Russia, young nuns were rounded up and raped while others were forced to watch etc.

That's like what if Japan remained in control of Asia after WWII and it prospered during peacetime lol. 1000 years later people remember the leaders of Imperial Japan as heroes.

He is a great person in history if you don't think about all that stuff though...I'm sure he's had his share of rape...er I mean "embracing the wives and daughters" of his conquered foes.....he's badass lol.

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I remember reading a quote of ghengis khan saying that "the greatest joy comes from *beep* the wife of my enemy in his front of his face"
now thats badass

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This probably would be better suited for this forum http://filmcrave.com/movie_page_talk.php?id=8165&page=1

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Arguements like this one, and a host of others, are of course silly, even if they allude to great import by mentioning the death of innocent millions. In fact history is a complex brew and its perception is a result of the combination of these components.
On the other hand these discussions are actually usefull if they provoke anyone to actually do some reading and look for the facts, the archaeology, the natural history, that underlie all great historical drama.

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Excellent point douglucchetti. After viewing Mongol a few days ago I've already reserved two books from the library (of course there are many more). I chose one on Genghis Khan and for the other,'The Secret History of the Mongols' - the book the film is supposedly based upon, purportedly told from the Mongol side as opposed to the Russian or Chinese side as are most other accounts.

Indeed, history, as you say, is fraught with complexities. It's accounts are often subject to the prejudices of the beholder. Some claim that accounts of Genghis' brutality is the manufacture of the people he conquered. I hope to learn both sides of the story.

Have a better one...

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King Richard let the third crusade, in shich the knights were responsible for mass killing, raping, and reportedly occasional eating of innocent civilians.

Therefore, I claim the British Empire, and Christianaity, as being worse than Hitler.

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As far as I am aware Christian Europe were the ones crusading in the Holy Lands. Not the British Empire, which did not exist then.

To label Christianity in itself to be worse than Hitler is a little bit silly and disrespectful.

Lets face it millions of people throughout history have been slaughtered in the name of religion and not just by Christians.

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More people have probably been killed by Christianity than anything else.

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I was just trying to point out that, accusing the British Empire of being worse than Hitler because of its involvement in the Crusades is just plain ignorant.

I would agree with you, in theory, that more people have been killed in the name of Christianity, but I'm no historian. Being English, you tend to hear more about English/British history, which does heavily involve Christianity. There were several empires/civilisations that did their fair share of conquering and killing before Christianity existed. Also when Christian countries were discovering new worlds they infected people with everyday diseases that wiped out millions of indigenous peoples. But I wouldn’t have thought that was intentional.

Don’t get me wrong I think that millions of people have been slaughtered world wide in the name of Christianity, but other religions have also been responsible for wholesale slaughter too. The difference is these millions of people were killed over centuries and by different rulers, not by one leader in the space of a few years. As for Genghis being worse than Hitler, who knows? I don’t know enough about Genghis Khan and this film didn’t give me any clues.

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well for a start Genghis Khan united the waring tribes into 1 people just like saladin in the midle east, the mongols were oppresed by the edge nations like the chinese,the chinese and arabs were butchering the mongols taking them as slaves ect. so Genghis Khan got a bit pissed at them all and decided enough was enough.
ok he killed lots of people, but like someone else said so did the crucades mass slaughter in the name of christianity, in the 3rd crucade richard lined up all the women and kids outside some city and killed every one of them it took a full day the city had already surenderd but he wanted to show saladin who was boss so to speek.
and after all the slaughter done by richard and the other crucaders saladin let richard go when he was defeted, i dont think richard would have done the same.
and to to it of the real reaon why the crucades happend was for money and treasures in jurusalem, a small factor was the religious significance.
people calling Genghis Khan worse or as bad as hitler should look at thir own history.
hanable killed 1000s with his elephants of war and his armys (not oliver reed movie) alexandrer the great we still call him great although he killed millions, the romans wanted to rule the world they killed everyone who opposed that, the spaniards or conquistadors (however its spelt) wiped out the aztecs mayans ect, the uk owned lots of contrys in its comonwelth days through force mostly.the slave trade unknown amounts died systematic murder all in the name of being british, india 1000s died under british rule to british swords and guns.
america first thing they done was almost wipe out the indians (native american),
the japanese look at nanking ect.
american again how many died in nagasaki and hiroshima due to the american bomb,and isrial first thing they done was invade everyone around them and last year over 1000.lebonise men women and kids dead in about a month or less.
so no Genghis Khan was not worse than hitler but theres plenty almost as bad as hitler but i think hitler takes the prize as worst man in history and he was white.





'n ddrwg blaidd (BAD WOLF)

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Why do people argue about history but know absolutely nothing about what they talk about? (Not all of you in the thread btw)

Stalin was FAR worse in terms of sheer killing numbers than Hitler. Ghengis Khan was put in the bloodthirsty, rapist light due to history being told by the losers and not the winners as it occurs most frequently throughout history.

I am not condoning all his actions nor am I even saying he was a saint, but his methods were those used by any warlord and much of the time it was not even ordered by him.

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the current world population is not even close to a trillion

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