MovieChat Forums > Tekunoraizu (2003) Discussion > The Texhnolyze symbolism reader thread

The Texhnolyze symbolism reader thread

posted 17 years ago by NRTOOD
13 replies | jump to latest

OK, I decided to make a little reader based on the symbols i remember from texhnolyze (I saw it a long time ago), some thoughts are mine some I found on the net. Of course everybody who knows something is welcome to join in and add what he knows to the thread.

OK

Texhnolyze = Techno Rise, get it, there is such japanese company that produce electronic gadgets, if you dont believe they are related to texhnolyze, read their company profile.

The train (in the beginning) - drive to the dark, the hopeless faith of the people of lux.

The lizard (ep1) - just like the lizard is sprouting i'ts tail back when it's being cut, Ichise will get hes arm and leg back.

The rats - again, the masses of lux are trapped in a cage and cannot escape, their fate is the responsibility and guiltiness of the doc, after all she invented texhnolyzed limbs.

The dragonfly - symbolises irresponsibility and unreliability in japanese culture,
perhaps meaning the lack of stability of events to come, and the unreliability of ichise and doc considering that ichise will ruin everything and concerning that doc want to give the disc with the information on ichise to kano.

Pictures similar to the yellow emperor book of internal medicine (ep 14) - Symbolises the doctor intention of helping through texhnolization to reach balance love and evolution (similar to the taoist search after true happiness
through unification with the tao)

The colors black and white - the color black symbolises sad cases ( usually funeral) and the white color usually symbolizes happy events (wedding, birth etc) in japanese culture. The white background always appear in the series when someone is in a deep rage, and black appears in the series ,well, all the time
, now, since japanese wearing a white tie in a funeral which symbolizes ascension of the deceased to heaven the color white can symbolize bad and good,
bad in the case that the rage of the people of lux is a bed thing that can only lead to the end of lux, and in the good case it is like the taiji symbol (ying and yang) the black color is always the negative and the white color complete the black by symbolizing rage that will lead to liberation (ascension to heaven)
through death of the people of lux, although in chinese culture the colors black and white symbolizes exactly the opposite, white is death and black is the color of heaven, see, yin yang.

The scissors (ep 9) - when yoshi kills mana, I dont know what that means when she cut flowers with them, but when yoshi kills her she throw them, they fly high in the air go down and land strongly on the floor, means the fate of yoshi and the brutal stop ( the shape the scissors landing, strongly and open, means he will turn his place to kano) in his plan, now his killing tomorrow he will be killed, today his plan is successful, soon she will fail etc.

Thats all i know and sorry for my english.

also, does anybody think the creator put a little bit of nietzsche in yoshi, i mean from the "war is forging" point?

[–] poushkine 17 years ago

I sure should rewatch it - been too long since. Thank you for your observations.

I do agree with Yoshi -> Nietzche's prspective, I see him as the character, who comes from a stale synthesized "western" life, which has gone so static, that people don't live anymore, so Yoshi thinks that through chaos and fighting mankind can come once again get some blood pumping...

In general, each character and place there are striving for salvation of mankind, each following a certain philosophy of life.

Doc believes in love+technology sort of salvation - so there goes image of mother (also Ichise's mother)...

Onishi, I believe is the kind of charismatic leader with Japanese shogun value system, perhaps with addition of samurai code of honor... Katanas that organo uses certainly are a dead giveaway. So in the end killing the pole is symbolic of sepukku, as I see it.

Ran is probably somewhere along the lines of Nastrodamus and Gabe will probably mirror religious society based on faith (I think a parallel to ancient Egypt could be made here).

City itself, I think is where we live now - present day present time in a grotesque form. At the same time it might be seen as a metaphor for purgatory.

Kano is the human modification (technological and genetic) -> evolution of humanity through scientific means symbol. Unlike Doc, who supplements people with texhnolyzed parts. Kano is not interested in love or even reproduction. Naturally inhumanity of this surfaces. He is brought up on Onishi's legs, which possibly hints towards where his way of thinking comes from: traditional society values, which turn out as "weak legs" for him.

I think Ichise is exactly the main character because he is not representing some system of values, being in a way the only living character. Closely so is Lakan leader (forgot his name).

Lakan leader(s) - rebelous youth, who is keen on destroying and sort of having fun through it, but is unable to grow up: it does not create. Possibly representation of anarchy.

Anti-technolyzed guys (forgot their names again) - I guess those are your socialists...

Lux - as I said earlier - western values arriving at their end - stale unlife, where nothing happens and people are like dust, ghosts of their former selves.

Would be happy to discuss this further.

[–] NRTOOD 17 years ago

Boy, not much to add here, good job poushkine.

Kano - I think Kano is the mad artist symbol, why mad artist? because he is overpowering his emotions through means that are in contrast with the nature of the body, that is, extreme texhnolaization (like an artist in extasy (extasy = means that are in contrast with nature) through the work on his art). Kano said he done all this because he wanted to see how far the human conscience can go through texhnolyze, so my theory is that Kano wanted to push the conscience of everyone to the limit through texhnolaization (conscience in this case is the internal feeling or feelings of the heart). The next level of evolution, eternal plant state, in this state one's conscience, one's own feelings are not in existence, the ego is off (the ego is composed of feelings), so the shapes are apathetic to theirs and others feelings. Kano wanted to turn lux and the shapes into works of art, lux has united with the upper world, now they are the same (both indifferent to their feelings), lux is a work of art in the head of Kano (he now controls it, designs it(the still shapes), and bring lux and himself to the state he wanted them to be) that's why he said that lux is fruitage of his mind. Kano brought the conscience of the people of lux to the maximum, the conscience exploded, and now Kano and lux have no feelings, now they are eternally mad, thats why Kano claims before ichise he is the only sane person left, it's a criticism on buddhism really, a religion that claims that the ego is insane and the way to cure it is to demolish the ego, Kano is the opposite way.

Organo - maybe organo are more like the yakuza than the shoguns.

Ran - I think run is like the ancient rage prophets (don't know how to call them in english) of israel. Only she tries to escape this prophecy and don't tell the masses of lux until later on.

Alliance (anti texhnolyze guys) - Maybe like you said they are socialists or some working class movement, or maybe they are like one of the new cults or religions of japan, or if we take this into the extreme, they might be some primitivist anarchy movement, after all they rebel against technologic invention, but they don't say this so i don't know.

Touyama - I did'nt succeed to find something he can resemble.

Can you explain the "week legs" part more broadly i don't get it.

Ok that's all

[–] twitchy_BASS 17 years ago

I wanted to elaborate on your post and maybe further some of the ideas that you presented as i have had some similar ideas. forgive me, but my shift key is broken so i will not use many capitals in this post.

Shinji/Racan- Essentially the whole organization if posited on the idea of ontological anarchy, an idea that is related to Max Stirner. The fact that they come into this group of their own freewill and the group lacks any enforced order hints at the idea that this group and organization is based on transcending their subjectivity in a sense. the people who make up the group of their own freewill become a part of this collective not because of slavery to some moralist cause but to further the evolution in their ego, through a sort of completion via the other individuals. there seems to be a subtext of this furthering of the individual ego through voluntary collectivism not to reach the object per se, but nonetheless go further than they could as a mere subject.

The Union- They are your standard moralist revolutionaries, in the contemporary era they could be related to marxists or social anarchists, but in the 18th century classical liberals had the same qualities. they seem to represent any sort of group dedicated to a cause at a religious level, be it the environment, god, equality etc.

somebody on here mentioned that yoshii was a nietzchean, which I would agree with but only in a really superficial sense. at the surface level he represents many of the ideas of the master morality but nietzche is far more nuanced and his influence on this series is a lot larger. I would even go so far to say that the racan group had very nietzchean ideals, especially with the issues of furthering of the ego and an approach not related to conventional morality.

this film in itself is nietzchean. all of the characters have very particular drives and represent different manifestations of humanity and the psyche. this parallel to psychological determinism is very prevalent in nietzche. somebody could make an argument that the entirety of lukuss and gabe were merely a symbolic representation of the human mind trying to find a specific purpose.

[–] NRTOOD 17 years ago

Nietzschean themes in lacan, maybe, as im not sure they are aiming at any kind of "superman".

The Grandmothers - The grandmothers are the root of this world of texhnolyze, sitting like some kind of buddhas in a place above lux meaning they are above this world and represent reality in the purest non intellectual form. They created the father who they used to concieve Kano. In front of the gate to Kano's opera hall there appears a orb who blows up anybody that's want to enter the gate, this is the third eye chakra (notice the orb aim his laser beam into onishi's third eye in episode 18, besides, THREE grandmothers and the THIRD eye) the basis of the ego or the window of consciousness in hinduism and buddhism (and sometimes in taoism), the cubes around it rapresents the people of the city, when they are entering into themselvs they are entering the gate to the root of the world is opening. When Onishi and Shinji come to them they say "is rain storm or wind coming to us, we don't have those up here" meaning that the mind of them is completely still like in meditation, they are unconscious to the things going in the city and from there they can see the whole world (like a verse in the Tao Te Ching), they tell Onishi and Shinji to go to the upper world to warn the people there from Kano, Kano hears about this and murders them, murders the root of the dream, which explodes the conscience of the people of the city, the people of the city are in rage. Ichise is like a pawn in kano's hand, he is like an emerging link between the grandmothers and the prophet Ran, both help in the process of enraging the people and so libarating tham, the death of Ran, the death of Kano, the death of the people of lux, the death of the ego of the shapes, the death of the grandmothers, they are liberated by death (through the death of the shapes is the death of the ego not of the body and the death of the people of lux and all the others is a complete death (see liberation from the circle of life and death in buddhism and immortality of the body in taoism)) Kano is the king of this reality, kill him and you kill the dream finally, ichise is the finall liberator of humenity and that is why he destroys all and is being all alone in the end, kill kano and the mothers you are liberated from any false reality and into true reality (whatever this may be). So here i gave an example of how the end can be a good end rather than bad as it seems on first sight.

[–] mrbeeshee 17 years ago

since the series is about the end of humanity's evolutionary cycle, to me when people felt rage that meant that they felt emotion, and emotion is something that was hard to find in lux. i think that people were getting back in touch with their humanity through rage, since rage is humanity's most primal convention.

[–] Eva_Yojimbo 17 years ago

Kano mentions in the end that the city is "in his mind". I'm not sure whether to take this literally or not, but if one was to take the approach that the entire content of Texhnolyze's world is the creation of one man's mind, much of the symbolic nature of the people becomes evident.

Ichise - our animalistic instinct and drive. The side of us that we try to shun, but embrace only at are darkest.

Ran - Vision. Our vision of the future and an ability to change things.

Onishi - Stability, strength, logic.

Doc - Our reliance on technology as a way to evolve.

Kano says he gave everyone texhnolyzed bodies to free us of our mortal thoughts because outside of reality we should have no limitations. The city becomes the purgatory in which we are all trapped in. It can also symbolize the mind as a whole. I wonder if the surface represents a kind of goal that is as intangible as the ghosts in it? Perhaps a forgotten past as well. A type of spiritual counterpart?

This explains why when Ran dies, the city goes insane. Without vision we are trapped in our present with nothing to light the way. The monolith is multiple things. The monolith has been used in film for years (going back to 2001) to symbolize inspiration and a type of awe and wonderment that drives us to achieve. It could be the same in Texhnolyze. Even the material that is needed to produce Texhnolyze is only produced by the dead that lay under Lux (what is that telling us?).

There's more thoughts I have on the series, but I'll leave it here for now...

[–] mrbeeshee 17 years ago

episode three contains an homage to 2001 space odyssey, after ichise opens his eyes on the table from after his surgery, doc is eating her dinner, and she spills her wine glass, just like the final scene from 2001. the most obvious interpretation, i think, is that doc has now transcending the final frontier for the human race - texhnolyzing who will later become the last man on earth. this symbolizes just like in 2001 how man's tools and technology has finally caught up to them. did anyone else catch this? what do you all think?

[–] Eva_Yojimbo 17 years ago

I saw 2001 after I saw Texhnolyze, so I didn't notice that but I believe you're correct. In 2001, I think the most popular interpretation of that scene was the miscommunication between mind and body (Dave reaching for something he doesn't need and accidentally destroying what he has). This has alot of relevance in Texh where there's a definite mind-spirit/body theme.

[–] NRTOOD 17 years ago

Ah, i forgot, there is a fansite of texhnolyze and there they have interpretation to the series by one of the groups that translated texhnolyze in bittorrent, just look at the faq:
http://somehow-someday.com/Texhnolyze/index.php

[–] NRTOOD 16 years ago

Eve Yojimbo, please tell me the symbols you think you extricated from Texhnolyze. I also browsed your notes on imdb (Phew, you sure write alot) and i saw you are an avid Evangelion fun (and avid film fan in general), i saw Evangelion not so long ago for the first time. And i must say that it is a lot more complicated and laden than texh (or at least it seems so after first viewing). the only meanings i remember i extricated from there is that this angel in ep 16 (which swalowed shinji) is probably a qlipa that causes to schizophrenia and that all of the girls around shinji (Asuka, Misato, Rei) are probably part of the pesonality of shinji's dead mother. I really should watch it again, not because it is too complicated but because it too much to remember in one go.

[–] Eva_Yojimbo 16 years ago

Eve Yojimbo, please tell me the symbols you think you extricated from Texhnolyze.

It's been a while since I saw it, and I really need to watch it again. I'm now thinking that perhaps Lukuss is some sort of unconscious state. The "surface" seems to represent consciousness, and the idea that it is so fuzzy and ghostly seems to be showing Kano's break from consciousness.

I've extracted some ideas, but putting it into a complete whole is difficult.

Ichise kills Kano: Instinct will destroy us?

The flower: Humanity. The search for meaning, beauty, in a world of mental
decay. It's the flowers that lead Ichise out of maze-like tunnels.

Shinji kills the beings who produce Raffia: This, I find, is most interesting. Shinji/Racaan seem to be the will to anarchy. So anarchy destroys that which sustains us?

The monolith seems to be the central point of the city. Perhaps the unconscious equivalent of the ego? Destroying it drives the city insane. It's Onishi that destroys it, and is killed afterwards... I have no thoughts on that.

There's also that bit about the "changing eyes" and how both Ichise and Doc have the eyes of their ancestors. Again, no real thoughts, it just seems an important bit that I don't know what it represents.

It's the people from the surface (consciousness?) that drives these people underground to Lukuss. Reality driving one insane perhaps?

I also think Kano's relationship with Ran is an interesting one. He refers to her as Theoria, and those bits of their voices floating in the rainbow pool also has me baffled.

The constant motif of the train tracks. The train speeds ahead only to break through a dead end in the final episodes. Hmmmm.

I also browsed your notes on imdb (Phew, you sure write alot)

Which ones?

and i saw you are an avid Evangelion fun (and avid film fan in general),

Definitely.

i saw Evangelion not so long ago for the first time. And i must say that it is a lot more complicated and laden than texh (or at least it seems so after first viewing).

It definitely is. There's so many layers to NGE that 9 months, constant writing, discussion, and reading later and I still don't think I have it all figured out.

the only meanings i remember i extricated from there is that this angel in ep 16 (which swalowed shinji) is probably a qlipa that causes to schizophrenia

The shadow angel in ep. 16 (Leliel) seems to be a representation of Jung's concept of The Shadow (look it up).

and that all of the girls around shinji (Asuka, Misato, Rei) are probably part of the pesonality of shinji's dead mother.

The women in Shinji's life seem to represent various stages of life. Shinji should be in his sexual stage now (pursuing Asuka), but due to his mental trauma he keeps seeking to return to the comfort of his mother (represented by Rei - The amalgamation of Yui's DNA and Lilith's soul, the two "mothers"). Returning to the Eva is akin to returning to the mother's womb, and of course there's a strong theme of motherhood throughout the series. And Instrumentality is like the ultimate representation of everyone returning to the origin of life inside Lilith's Egg. Only to be reborn into a new world.

I'd recommend going here:

http://evageeks.org/

Check out the forums (especially ANF archive) and the Wiki to get some good information on the series. If there's anything in particular you're looking for, let me know.

I really should watch it again, not because it is too complicated but because it too much to remember in one go.

NGE is as complex a work outside of literature or music as I've encountered. By the end of my first experience I had NO idea what I'd just witnessed but I knew it was something incredible. My appreciation for it has only grown in leaps and bounds with time as I've uncovered its many intricate layers.

Last Films Seen:
Sunrise 10/10
Battle of Algiers - 8/10
Shrek 3 4.5/10

[–] NRTOOD 16 years ago

The flower: Humanity. The search for meaning, beauty, in a world of mental
decay. It's the flowers that lead Ichise out of maze-like tunnels.

agree, also they are produced from the dead people of lux. which, flowers are things which humens consider beautiful, but they are live things which were produced from dead things, which in turn become texhnolyze, thats means another ying yang, death leads to life and life leads to death which in turn gives life to another. It seems it is like this in the monotheistic religions, in christiandom, jesus sacrificed himself to pay the sins of men, and in judaism the priests sacrifice some animal to god in order that other humans can live.

The monolith seems to be the central point of the city. Perhaps the unconscious equivalent of the ego? Destroying it drives the city insane. It's Onishi that destroys it, and is killed afterwards... I have no thoughts on that

Onishi is the will for order and the will to live in lux (ego), and the monolith is the source for life and death because it represents a monolith of a tomb and at the same time it maintains the power of all texhnolyze (the source in the east is always something beyond consciousness), ran represents death, because she sees one. so destroying the monolith is the end of lux and plunging into the real reality, which is something completly different, this is the beginning of the end of lux, that's why onishi is destroyed.

There's also that bit about the "changing eyes" and how both Ichise and Doc have the eyes of their ancestors. Again, no real thoughts, it just seems an important bit that I don't know what it represents

This is simple, their ancestors of ichise were criminals who were banished to lux so this is a trick to show us ichise endevour to change into a civilized person. As for the doctor her ancestors were from the world above and now she adapting to lux so her eyes color changes (it is known that geographic place changes men facial features). This is a circle, for doc is dead at the above world, and ichise is dead at the end.

I also think Kano's relationship with Ran is an interesting one. He refers to her as Theoria, and those bits of their voices floating in the rainbow pool also has me baffled

what bits of voices floting in ranbow pool?

The constant motif of the train tracks. The train speeds ahead only to break through a dead end in the final episodes. Hmmmm.

I said that in my first message in this thread.

It definitely is. There's so many layers to NGE that 9 months, constant writing, discussion, and reading later and I still don't think I have it all figured out

Maybe, usually there is too much ties to unstitch for one person in this types of work.

The shadow angel in ep. 16 (Leliel) seems to be a representation of Jung's concept of The Shadow (look it up).

It seems true, but that still doesn't disqualify what i said, in cabalistic terms it is maybe a qlipa. If the shadow represents unconscious weaknesses and instincts, the qlipa being the ooposite from sephira represents the "defiled" unconscious drives and instincts of shinji's personality, his bad universes, they can be merged.

The women in Shinji's life seem to represent various stages of life. Shinji should be in his sexual stage now (pursuing Asuka), but due to his mental trauma he keeps seeking to return to the comfort of his mother (represented by Rei - The amalgamation of Yui's DNA and Lilith's soul, the two "mothers"). Returning to the Eva is akin to returning to the mother's womb, and of course there's a strong theme of motherhood throughout the series. And Instrumentality is like the ultimate representation of everyone returning to the origin of life inside Lilith's Egg. Only to be reborn into a new world.

Ok, agree. Maybe they also represnt shinji's will for regretion (the troubled shinji) and later his reversion from it, in the end as the instrumentality complete itself and the return to lilith egg and the return to his mother's womb (all the same) he states (indirectly) that he doesn't want to lose his self, his ego. But maybe i am just scribbling, because i don't remember anything from the series and the movies, so i have a couple of more viewings to do before i can say something.

I'd recommend going here:

http://evageeks.org/

i will, when i will have the time and zest to go.

I also browsed your notes on imdb (Phew, you sure write alot)

Which ones?

too much to remember, i also was reading your reviews in amazon, and i see you like haibane renmei too, so i have a recomendation for you, Mushishi (the anime series not the movie (i did not see the movie)) if you thought haibane renmei was divine, you MUST see this.

[–] Eva_Yojimbo 16 years ago

death leads to life and life leads to death which in turn gives life to another.

Yep, I think we're in agreement on this especially.

ran represents death, because she sees one.

Some interesting ideas, though I think I disagree with this part. Ran's ability to see the/a future seems more representative of something more than just death. Is it the killing of her that begins to kill the city, or the killing of Kanno?

This is a circle, for doc is dead at the above world, and ichise is dead at the end.

Aha. I thought maybe there was more to it than that.

what bits of voices floting in ranbow pool?

Those parts near the end where you can't see them, but you see this kind of kaleidoscopic rainbow image with Kanno and Ran talking to each other.

I said that in my first message in this thread.

You mentioned it going through the dark but not the final one of it bursting through the dead end, which I found interesting.

Maybe, usually there is too much ties to unstitch for one person in this types of work.

Oh, it's definitely a community project. I've had alot of help, but the problem with NGE is that people seem to disagree on what the hell they saw.

It seems true, but that still doesn't disqualify what i said,

Not at all. The concepts in NGE relate to a great many things, and researching them is interesting, and that's why NGE tends to draw some interesting fans with expertise in varying areas. Zugzwang is likely the most famous "NGE esotericist".

Maybe they also represnt shinji's will for regretion (the troubled shinji) and later his reversion from it, in the end as the instrumentality complete itself and the return to lilith egg and the return to his mother's womb (all the same) he states (indirectly) that he doesn't want to lose his self, his ego.

No, you're actually right. He does end up deciding that returning to a kind of "collective unconscious" state isn't worth abandoning a painful, individual existence.

i have a recomendation for you, Mushishi

I will definitely add it to my growing list. Thanks.

Last Films Seen:
Double Indemnity 9/10
The Lost Weekend 8/10
The Killing 7.5/10