MovieChat Forums > The Chronicles of Riddick: Dark Fury (2004) Discussion > Widening the gap, instead of bridging it...

Widening the gap, instead of bridging it...

posted 20 years ago by Ardath_Rekha
22 replies | jump to latest

Be warned that there are a lot of spoilers below, regarding both Dark Fury and The Chronicles of Riddick. I'm going to assume that you have at least seen Pitch Black.

Intended as a bridge, of sorts, between Pitch Black and The Chronicles of Riddick, Dark Fury does manage to set the stage for a number of upcoming plot points in TCOR, but at the same time, it actually undermines the credibility of a great deal of the film. Especially, it undermines the credibility of "Kyra" as an extension of the Jack that Pitch Black fans knew and loved.

Set almost immediately after the skiff launched from the Pitch Black planet, we see our three survivors -- Imam, Riddick and Jack -- caught and towed in by a merc ship. Although Riddick attempts to pass himself off as Johns, his voice print is on file and he's identified almost immediately. The ship is reeled in and the mercs on board attempt to capture Riddick, many of them dying in the process.

It is, in fact, a threat to Jack's life that ends up being the decisive factor in the battle, forcing Riddick to surrender. Despite his attempt to claim that she means nothing to him, he's unwilling to let her be harmed. This sets the stage for a fascinating interaction between the two characters during the rest of the film, as Jack's faith in -- and loyalty to -- Riddick only grows. When he is separated from Imam and Jack, she calls out a promise to him that she won't leave without him, a promise that she means wholeheartedly (it's not just teenage grandstanding).

Later, when Riddick and the others are thrown into a combat arena and pitted against an alien species, Jack's initiative keeps Riddick from getting killed, and she even helps him to his feet at one point. During their flight, she makes a determined effort to keep up, struggling against the physical limitations of her youth and smallness but not struggling against any lack of will or character. "I can keep up," she promises Riddick. "Maybe someday," he answers.

Still, he remains unable to simply abandon her, instructing Imam to get the two of them to the flight deck and then using his own blood to draw searchers away from them so they'll have a clear shot. Jack remains determined to help him, demanding from Imam how they can possibly do so if they just run away.

When Imam is knocked out and Jack is captured on the flight deck, it's Riddick's arrival that saves them; again, Riddick enters into battle to protect Jack as much as any other reason. The battle is wonderfully "choreographed," and pay special attention to where Jenner drops his gun...

When the denouement arrives, and Riddick is about to be killed by Antonia Chillingsworth, his captor, that gun is used against her. By Jack. A Jack who looks both stunned and a little horrified by what she's just done, but relieved that it's not Riddick who's been killed. She clings to the gun in the aftermath, going so far as to take it to bed with her in the escape craft. Imam worries that she's in danger of becoming like Riddick.

(As someone who has worked with war refugees, however, I disagree with that assessment. Her behavior during and after that plot point was more in keeping with someone doing an extraordinary thing to survive, and not with someone whose personality was going to be altered irrevocably by the act.)

Characterization is dead-on in all three performances, probably because all three of the original actors were used and, in spite of the limitations imposed by animation, the affectionate brother-sister chemistry between Vin Diesel's Riddick and Rhiana Griffith's Jack is palpable. This makes what then happens to the character of Jack afterwards an even harder, more implausible, and more bitter pill to swallow.

After all, in both Pitch Black and Dark Fury, Riddick had to abandon Jack at critical times, but in each case he returned to protect her and her faith in him was absolute. By the timeline established in The Chronicles of Riddick, though, she barely waited around on New Mecca after Riddick's departure before loss of faith and bitterness set in, and she took off in pursuit. Imam's remarks that "she never forgave (Riddick) for abandoning her when she needed (him) most" completely contradict everything we'd ever seen in Jack's character. Even when she'd truly believed that he'd abandoned her for good, in the cave on the Pitch Black planet, there was no bitterness on display. I also find it incredibly unrealistic that Imam wouldn't have been able to find and bring her back, given his devotion and concern for her in both Pitch Black and Dark Fury.

Worse yet is the person Jack has become. Kyra is the antithesis of Jack in virtually every way. She blames Riddick for her own actions, for example. And worst of all, where Jack would have had to have been dragged, kicking and screaming, into the Necromonger ship, Kyra simply ran for it, not even bothering to check and make sure Riddick wasn't okay. Maybe five years can change a person a great deal, but if they wanted Jack's fans to buy that she could have turned into that, they needed Rhiana in the part more than ever in order to have a prayer of selling it. It's also incredibly hard to conceive how a girl who already knew the value of protective coloration -- namely, disguising herself as a boy -- would advertise her femininity in a prison as tough as Crematoria, where looking like a supermodel would be an invitation for gang-rape, and where all that hair would be a weapon against her in combat.

While not perfect -- Dark Fury is as bad as The Chronicles of Riddick in terms of trivializing Carolyn Fry's sacrifice in the first film, worsening it a bit by having the injuries Riddick had sustained, and which had forced Fry to sacrifice her life rescuing him, no longer existent -- I would say that Dark Fury is definitely superior to The Chronicles of Riddick, especially in the way it treats the original characters with a respect entirely lacking in TCOR. They're multi-dimensional human beings in Dark Fury, not mere plot devices with pulses, caricatures of their former selves, which makes it ironic that this is the cartoon and TCOR is not.

If you love Vin Diesel, this will be a fantastic addition to your collection, along with going to see The Chronicles of Riddick. If you love Imam, Jack, Rhiana Griffith, Keith David, or Pitch Black, you might want to seriously consider skipping the new movie altogether and buying this instead.

[–] weywag 20 years ago

very nice review man, i thought the same things when i saw cronicles of riddick. Well thought out and everything, i got to give you props.

[–] Candylyn 20 years ago

SPOILERS

>>Imam's remarks that "she never forgave (Riddick) for abandoning her when she needed (him) most" completely contradict everything we'd ever seen in Jack's character.

This is something else that didn't sit with me too well. Why would Imam be so judgmental about Riddick abandoning Jack "when she needed (Riddick) most"? Wasn't Imam the one who thought Jack was in danger of becoming like Riddick?

At the end of "Dark Fury", Imam was implying that he wanted Riddick away from Jack as not to influence her. Yet in "Chronicles" Imam's tone and comments regarding Riddick's decision to leave Jack behind were very judgemental and condemning. Especially when he commented about Riddick leaving New Mecca to it's fate the same way he left Jack to her own fate.

I believe Mr. Twohy wrote both scripts, or at least had input and he directed "TCOR", so why have Imam come off that way? If Imam had not said that he was concerned about Jack's future to Riddick then I could have understood Imam's tone with Riddick upon his return. But considering Imam's comments at the end of "Dark Fury" his behavior just struck me as odd.

As for not mentioning Carolyn, yeah that was a little grating. But Riddick didn't tell Jack Imam was dead either, what gives?
Love,
Candylyn

[–] 20 years ago

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[–] sef_769 20 years ago

"After all, in both Pitch Black and Dark Fury, Riddick had to abandon Jack at critical times, but in each case he returned to protect her and her faith in him was absolute. By the timeline established in The Chronicles of Riddick, though, she barely waited around on New Mecca after Riddick's departure before loss of faith and bitterness set in, and she took off in pursuit. Imam's remarks that "she never forgave (Riddick) for abandoning her when she needed (him) most" completely contradict everything we'd ever seen in Jack's character. Even when she'd truly believed that he'd abandoned her for good, in the cave on the Pitch Black planet, there was no bitterness on display. I also find it incredibly unrealistic that Imam wouldn't have been able to find and bring her back, given his devotion and concern for her in both Pitch Black and Dark Fury."

I disagree. When you have someone that young, I think it is believable that they would do such a thing as leave and become bitter.[Even when she'd truly believed that he'd abandoned her for good, in the cave on the Pitch Black planet, there was no bitterness on display]. For one, she held hope, but he did come back not too long after and it was Frye who went after him so she had reason to hope. Also, I never got the impression that Imam was that devoted or concerned for her.

Another reason I think she would have is that after leaving the planet and after the encounter in Dark Fury, she would think that that would have solidified a bond between them where he wouldn't leave her IN HER EYES, but being that young, not understand the reason why Riddick would leave her behind and certainly too stubborn to try to.

[–] Ardath_Rekha 20 years ago

It all rings false based upon her characterization and behavior in Pitch Black and Dark Fury. Jack was very socially-oriented. She wanted to impress Riddick but she was not obsessed with him and spent a great deal of time with everyone else, including people she knew disliked him, namely Shazza and Johns. Had she truly been engaging in immature obsession, she would have refused to have anything to do with them once she was aware of the hostility (and they were hardly hiding it).

In order for Jack to become Kyra, not only would she have to stay in a state of arrested emotional development for five years, she'd have to backslide. It would require profound personality disintegration. She spent what, a few days, maybe a week with Riddick, and he became the center of her universe? That's about as credible as the idea that, between the ages of 12 and 17, she became a master-fighter, able to keep up with a seasoned Furyan Warrior, despite also being enslaved and imprisoned during that period of time.

As an original character, Kyra would be okay if still a little on the unbelievable side. As a continuation of Jack, Kyra has zero credibility and is writing of the lousiest sort. I'd wonder how it was possible that the same creative team could destroy their own beautiful creation so comprehensively, but then again, the same creative team isn't involved. Ken and Jim Wheat, not David Twohy, created "Audrey," and it was when Rhiana was hired -- and they discovered that they had (in Vin Diesel's words) "the next Julia Roberts" on their set -- that her character was deepened and made the complex and interesting Jack. Apparently the character's IQ ran right out the door with the exclusion of Rhiana and the Wheat brothers.

[–] FieryMaid 20 years ago

I really agree that Dark Fury only served to make Chronicles more confusing, but I do have some additional thoughts:

Riddick, Imam, and Jack are supposed to have been on the ship for about two months before the merc ship picks them up in Dark Fury, therefore, Riddick's injuries have healed.

In Pitch Black, Jack IS obsessed with Riddick. She sneaks up on Paris and puts a boomerang around his neck. She shaves her head and finds some goggles so she can look just like Riddick. And Jack only associates with the other survivors because they won't let her associate with Riddick. Remember Fry telling Jack to leave when she's talking with Riddick, remember Jack asking if she can talk with Riddick after the "deal" has been struck and Johns and Shazza can't say no fast enough? Come on, Jack is completely obsessed with Riddick. And she doesn't have absolute faith in Riddick -- she notices him continuing on with the cells when Imam's last boy stops when his leg is cut. Jack is the first to realize that Riddick left them in that cave to die and isn't coming back. Even in Dark Fury, when the merc is threatening to kill Jack, she starts to cry when Riddick responds that Jack isn't important to him -- just a cover story. Jack is smart enough to realize that while Riddick is more human after Fry's sacrifice, he still has his own moral code and his own rules, and, therefore, kinda unpredictable.

As for Riddick abandoning her, yes, I am very upset that Dark Fury shows Riddick and Imam stating that it'd be better if Riddick left so Jack won't become like him and then in Chronicles Imam blames Riddick for leaving. I don't think they were worried about her only because she killed that merc, Jack already had tendencies to be like Riddick -- sneaking up on Paris, being able to hear Fry before anyone else did, she was a tough cookie from the get go. But it was clear she idolized Riddick, and Jack spent a bit more time with Riddick thank you think -- it was at least two months before the merc ship, and then who knows how much longer before they got dropped off at New Mecca. He made a lasting impression on her and she wanted to be just like him. It made sense for her to be a crazy, angst troubled teen (come on, she and Imam really wouldn't have got along well enough for her to stay with him) who went looking for Riddick and got seriously sidetracked (jailed). Now, about the rest of her skills (she already had some skills, five years is a long time to develop them, especially when everyone is after you when you're a slave and in jail I'm sure there's lots of opportunity for practice) and her hair (long hair is definately a liability) and how she dressed (by that time she could afford to dress like that because she HAD skills and because she finally had assests she didn't have as a 12 year old, besides, it was a hot planet :) ), that I can say is a bit far fetched, but this is a movie and there is going to be some fantasy elements. Not everything is going to be perfectly logical.

I personally liked Chronicles better than Dark Fury. Dark Fury was just weird.

You're fouling up my chi

[–] 20 years ago

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[–] FieryMaid 20 years ago

I don't agree that Jack's obsession with becoming a killer like Riddick was cute when she was younger, and I agree it's pretty weird even when she is older (I think she's supposed to 17 or something, and I know many 17 year olds who aren't even close to mature). However, many tramuatized kids grow very mature in handling things and firguring things out, but are two year olds emotionally. I think it would help if we knew a bit more about Jack's background. My take on Jack's background is she's had a rough life, she's seen some pretty bad stuff, and it's hardened her and I don't think she really had much in moral training. Why do I think this? She expects the worst from people. She expected that Fry would leave her in the ship if she told anyone she was bleeding. She expected Riddick had abandoned them in the cave.... So why would she fixate on someone like Riddick? Riddick is cool. Riddick handles himself, and Riddick doesn't allow himself to get hurt. That can be a very strong draw to someone who has experienced a lot of pain and most of it through her weakness as a kid, a girl, whatever. So even if she's only known Riddick for three months or four months or whatever, what Riddick IS and/or represents to her doesn't take much time to be planted into her mind.

I do think five years might be stretching it, but really, a lot can happen in five years. I just think as long as something is plausiable, I can gladly suspend my disbelief.

As far as knowing Riddick and still expecting him to stay, women and kids do it all the time and Kyra is both. I am amazed that women will steal a married man, and then expect that man to stay faithful to them. They know that man is not a faithful partner and they know that first hand. Yet they tell themselves, I'm different, the circumstances are different, yeah RIGHT. Kids do it too. Mom won't forget me this time. Dad won't lie to me this time. People delude themselves frequently, especially regarding things they want.

I keep my expectations low -- then I can be pleasantly surprised. You're fouling up my chi

[–] 20 years ago

[deleted]

[–] FieryMaid 20 years ago

Yes, it certainly seems like Kyra's character wasn't very concrete. But I do have to defend Twohy in the fact that 7-10 minutes were cut from TCOR due to pre-screenings. Aparently, the more plot-driven and character driven parts where "confusing" so they cut them out. I'm waiting for the Director's Cut, and then I'll make my final judgement.

I keep my expectations low -- then I can be pleasantly surprised. You're fouling up my chi

[–] cindel-1 19 years ago

seems like we put more thought into her than Twohy

This one statement, of everything you've said in this thread, touches on every aspect of my problem with Kyra.

I wanted to meet interesting and stimulating people of an ancient culture... and kill them.

[–] igniggutmcfly 19 years ago

It seems like only a few of you actually know what your talking about.

Somebody mentioned Jim and Ken Wheat. Although it is true that they created these characters and the original draft of the pitch black script, many things were changed when Twohy got on board the production.

For instance, Riddick was a female part. Twohy changed this because he felt that a girl wouldn't be menacing enough.

The monsters were going to be ghost soldiers I believe. This was changed for budget reasons.

My source is www.pitcherblacker.com

Why she left. Imam tried to take care of her but he had a life of his own-new wife-and would most likely have attempted to convert her to Islam. She is constantly in search of father figures and Imam simply wasn't what she was looking for. The mercs she hooked up with were what she was looking-but only for a little while. She felt abandoned by Riddick and went looking for him, expecting the mercs would teach her how to survive and make money-"they said they'd teach me the trade..."-until she found him. Although, Imam had seen where Riddick might go, and would probably have told her where to find him. The fact that she didn't could mean a few different things.
A)Imam didn't know she had left
B)She got sidetracked with the mercs
C)She expected that he wouldn't still be there.
All the merc ships have info on various convicts. She may have known this(having been on at least one merc ship before)and expected to find some updated facts.

Kyra says that she was sold as a slave. In the Riddick trivia subtitles on the DVD, it is said that her new owners tortured her and she killed them all.
This explains why she is in prison. She never wanted to be a murderer, she simply wanted to be tough. In pitch black, she pretended to be a boy because she was traveling alone and she felt that it would be safer for her if everyone thought she was a girl. It is assumed that she was abused at her home-"Tell me, did you run away from your parents...?"-and she wanted to get as far away from them as possible. In Crematoria, she uses her sexuality(as mentioned on the commentary) to get the guards closer for attack. Twohy even says on the commentary that she wouldn't get raped in prison because she was too tough. However, it is likely that she was raped while in slavery.

Imam and his comment. He never specifically blames Riddick. He merely states that she blamed him. He sounds angry, but that's because Riddick seems indifferent on the subject.

I think that you guys are making the mistake of trying to fit the Riddick universe into the world that we know now. Everything is different for them. If you recall from 6th grade science, a year is the term which describes the amount of time it takes for a planet to completely revolve on its axis once, I think...
Anyway, that means that a year would be a different length of time for every planet. A galaxy would most likely choose one length of time and have all the planets say that it is a year. What I'm getting at here is that what they think of as 5 years could be 7 or even 10 years as we would know it.
People might mature faster and under different circumstances with them.

Sorry for this hugely long post, but it wanted(as opposed to needed)to be said.

[–] njaalbear 19 years ago

"If you recall from 6th grade science, a year is the term which describes the amount of time it takes for a planet to completely revolve on its axis once, I think... "

Actually, Earth's revolution around the sun is approx 1 year (more precise time can be found here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year#Astronomical_years) ... and the revolution on it's axis is a day. Time measurements (in the real world/universe) we even judge the other planet's off our own system of time, for example mars has an axial rotation of 24 hrs 39 min and change. So, one would have to know the regional time reference in the Riddick universe to know how long Riddick was away to make Jack take off. *shrug* Semantic games can be played all day ... what it all boils down to is this: someone involved in the writing made a mistake and either no one caught it until after the movie was released or they did it intentionally because they have future plans for one or more of the characters and they don't want to reveal everything at once (think Empire Strikes Back ... "There is another Skywalker ... ")

Anyway ... good points by all, don't mean to jump all over ya igniggutmcfly.

[–] igniggutmcfly 19 years ago

I knew somebody would correct me because my knowledge of science is nonexistent. However, in Pitch Black, Fry comments on the rock samples being 22 years old, if no one knew of this planet, then how could they know what year the planet was on? The only way this is possible is for there to be a commonly known amount of time that represents one year throughout the galaxy.

My point is that their galactic year would most likely not be 365 earth days.

[–] Jake-219 17 years ago

Just another quick note: a few have taken Imam to task, for first wanting Riddick out of Jack's life (in "Dark Fury"), and then deriding him for having left (in "Chronicles").

Years have gone by. Keep in mind that time changes everyone, not just kids. It isn't inconceivable that Imam's opinion about the whole thing, especially if he'd eventually felt more guilt about what happened to Jack, would have changed over time, and hit upon Riddick.

Besides, as someone wisely mentioned a few posts ago, these are only movies...and not even top-drawer movies, at that.

Still, they are a lot of fun, and it would be nice if they came up with another one. (I'm certainly curious about what Riddick will do with his new empire!)

[–] gjieuh 19 years ago

ardath, those are not the only problems of continuity i found myself having a problem with between the films and i've finally found a place i can complain about it. (harharhar) people i've talked to don't agree with me but i have problems with the difference in the style between PB and TCoR. PB reminded me of the alien movies and event horizon, while TCoR looked to me like some star wars or dune trying-too-hard-wannabe. the differences in the technologies of these peoples is quite apparent. how do the producers explain this?

do you remember how everyone talked in PB? it was simple, short dialogue, edgy, and people swore when they needed to. it just brought out that dramatic tension that kept you watching. in some cases it was even witty. ("battlefield doctors decide who lives and dies. it's called triage" "kept callin' it murder when i did it.") in TCoR, everybody's trying to be so dramatic (i mean, this is the fate of the universe we're dealing with here!)
and not only is the development in jack's character not plausible (THEY EVEN CHANGED HER NAME!!!) riddick is not the same at all! watch PB, dark fury and TCoR back to back and you'll see what i mean. he's not the same. in PB and dark fury, riddick is everything i admire about him: a nasty, immoral, bad*ss hardy killer freak. he dislocates his own shoulder and pokes a hole in his own neck. man! he exuded a dangerousness that was so attractive. in TCoR, except for the beginning, he's just another prop to use to make a crazy action movie. the only time other time he acts like a stone cold killer is when he kills the prison guard. but he doesn't kill toombs!! which is what you would expect from him. he was just too nice! in PB the characters were gritty and realistic. in dark fury they were weird but intruiging. in TCoR they were just too overembellished to work, for me at least. the scriptwriters or whoever dealt with the production of that movie knew we like that riddick character a lot, so they tried to make him more special: "the last of his race", "a prophesied savior"... f-ing bs! i didn't need that. after PB riddick was alreadly godly. adding all that furyan stuff was just cheezy.

taking TCoR by itself though, i did enjoy the movie. but as a further development in the story of riddick, it was a letdown. it was like they got a bigger budget or something to produce the movie so they went all out. it's too bad we can't turn back time so they can take back that movie because it was a huge mistake. (hehehe as you can see im a big riddick fan. hahaha) but anyways, i'm done now. blah.

[–] igniggutmcfly 19 years ago

There isn't much in your post that I can really say you are definitely wrong about. However, I disagree about riddick changing. He says at the end of Pitch Black that the old riddick died somewhere on that planet. I think that throughout the 5 years, riddick changed some. But really he has only changed in regards to imam and jack.

[spoiler] sense they both die in chronicles then that crap is over. [end spoiler]

toombs wasn't killed for time restraint reasons.watch the deleted scenes with commentary.

If they continue with more sequels than Riddick should be the slick killer he was in Pitch Black Because Kyra is dead. His only connection is Imam's family.

I can't explain why Jack changed.

"Death by teacup. Why didn't I think of that?" Kyra The Chronicles of Riddick

[–] MrHen 18 years ago

<i>"And worst of all, where Jack would have had to have been dragged, kicking and screaming, into the Necromonger ship, Kyra simply ran for it, not even bothering to check and make sure Riddick wasn't okay."</i>

I think the director's cut extended that scene a bit. I could be wrong.

But all in all I agree with everything you've said. Kyra was the biggest disappointment for me when watching TCoR. I personally love sci-fi so I could ignore some of the implausibility in the movie... and I still really enjoyed the movie. But it was Kyra that prevented it from becoming a continuation of the Riddick story.

I can understand how someone could undergo such a dramatic change (especially at that age) but that doesn't mean it was necessary. At least they changed her name to reflect the change in character. Kyra and Riddick's relationship in TCoR felt more as if it was manufactured so that they could show a half-way decent story while getting Riddick in the throne. The only way Riddick would stay and fight was if Jack was threatened hence the reason for Jack being in the film.

They used what was already there to accomplish a particular goal instead of letting what already existed grow on its own.

In any case, I still have to go pick up a copy of Dark Fury. I really did enjoy it and your write up is dead on.

[–] 18 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Jake-219 17 years ago

I'm thinking that LostSoul put what I was trying to say much more eloquently, but agrees with what I was saying two posts ago. (On the other hand, for once I wasn't the one going on for numerous paragraphs...so it depends how you define "eloquent!" lol)

But it occurs to me that everyone insists upon "realistic" characterizations...yet somehow don't accept that as time goes on, people change.

When, after 5 or 10 years, people have different characters, they find it unrealistic.

Perhaps you just haven't been through enough yet.

In real life, people DO change, considerably, especially in younger years (but even in older ones). Some people are your very best friends this year, yet you lose touch by next year...and by 10 years from now, if you're lucky enough to ever see them again, they're totally different...and you wind up wondering how you could have ever considered them your best friends.

If it hasn't happened to you yet...believe me, it will.

And we're talking BEST FRIENDS, here...let alone coincidental outsiders like Riddick, Imam and Jack.

Yeah, it doesn't do much to hold a franchise together...but to consider it "unrealistic" is just naive.

You guys are talking about movie reality...not reality.

[–] android-impostor 10 years ago

Kyra is another Furyan. Riddick is not the last of his race. The only known Necromongers to have defied their conversion are Kyra and The Purifier.

[–] the-almighty-kit 11 years ago

really tight review, couldn't agree more on most, if not all points.
we don't know how long they've had off the planet since the last, so riddick, with his accelerated healing (or so I've been reading) could have had the time to get better... otherwise you're dead on in this and your advice, although too late for me, is probably worth it :)