CROSS OVER EPISODE


Hey all,
I recently saw the SVU Episode NIGHT and I never got to see the Trial By Jury crossover called DAY (I think it might be titled the other way). Alfred Molina and Angela Landsbury was in it and I was wondering if anyone knows if I can get that episode or D/L it so I can see how it ends. Now that the series is cancelled I actually have in interest in it just for that one show. Thanks alot...

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Do you want a real Aspie's opinion of those episodes?

Whatever you do, don't buy anything with them. Pirate it, steal it, burn it, whatever. Buy it, and you are basically urinating in my face. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0406429/usercomments-6 will tell you why. I resent being told that a developmental disorder I was born with makes me a rapist by default, and I laugh at the ignorance of L&O fans who claim my comment is not useful, continuing to watch.

--mentalcritic
"Så stod han der på utkikkstopp, Hans øyne ei dei kviler"

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[deleted]

1) Asperger's Syndrome is not a disease. It is a developmental disorder. http://users.wpi.edu/~trek/aspergers.html has a good description of the reality.

2) The character is screaming six ways to sunup that his crimes should be excused on the basis of his having Asperger's Syndrome. So well-researched was this episode that he does not display any physical characteristics in common with Aspies throughout the episodes. If you ever sit and have a conversation with an Aspie that shares one of the common traits with myself, you'll know about it because they won't stop wringing their hands throughout. Many an Aspie has been mistaken for having Italian heritage, their hands moved that much during conversation.

3) There has never been, to date, a single case of unprovoked violence to this level from an Aspie. Not one. Albert Einstein was an Aspie, if that tells you anything. Andy Warhol was an Aspie, too, although Valerie Solanis probably didn't know that.

4) Irrespective of the level of research the L&O writers have performed in the past, these episodes were basically reminiscent of Nazi propaganda. Since watching them, I have been labouring under the fear of brownshirts marching up to my door. Not an unjustified fear, I might add, given that what I described in my comments is only the tip of the iceberg in terms of what I, and other undiagnosed Aspies of the 1980s, suffered.

--mentalcritic
"Så stod han der på utkikkstopp, Hans øyne ei dei kviler"

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hey aspie, you're understandbly upset but could you resist from peeing your pants here, theres no need to freak out and boycott and complain about a show and other shows around it every chance you getjust because you were offended.

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You are confusing Asperger's Syndrome with retardation, moron. Have a good look at a bio of the world's most famous Aspie: http://us.imdb.com/name/nm0251868/bio.

--mentalcritic
"Så stod han der på utkikkstopp, Hans øyne ei dei kviler"

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"Aspies?" What are you, a secret club or something?

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I rarely respond to these message boards (although I'm tempted to renaim them message-rants), but this needs to be said...

Mentalcritic, I'm sorry that this episode doesn't treat persons suffering from a disease that either you or someone know obviously suffers from in an entirely respectful way, but to degrade a television show... A TELEVISION SHOW...because their writers didn't have YOU in mind when they wrote a script that features a man ABUSING this syndrome in order to escape a conviction of rape, is simply immature and idiotic. Perhaps you should avoid jumping to conclusions simply because your knee jerk reaction is to be insulted or enraged at things you don't entirely agree with.

Heres to hoping that people searching for "Law and Order: Trial by Jury" won't find your comment helpful.


BTW, as a big fan of "Law and Order" and "Law and Order: SVU" I found this episode the BEST episdoe of the Trail by Jury series, although Trail by Jury is hardly the high quality show of L&O and SVU.

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After re-viewing the episode last night (thank you, CourtTV!), I can say that the poster above me is right. Trial By Jury is not saying that Alfred Molina's character is what all Asperger's Syndrome patients are like. In fact, ADA Kibre says in an argument that it is a poor attempt to use a disease most people are unaware of to blame his tendencies on others (really, his lawyer's idea to use Asperger's).

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Too bad that there is not a single organisation representing the Aspies of today that agrees with you or the wanker above you. Their members do not even need to be Aspies themselves to have been horrified, in fact, they are just educated enough about the disorder to understand why the people they are representing are horrified beyond belief.

--mentalcritic
"Så stod han der på utkikkstopp, Hans øyne ei dei kviler"

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1) Asperger's Syndrome is not a disease. It is a developmental disorder. http://users.wpi.edu/~trek/aspergers.html has a good description of the reality.


Nowhere does any character on the prosecution say that it is a disease. The defense attorney might (I'm not completely sure), but the episode is set up to show that, by the trial, he's grasping at straws.

2) The character is screaming six ways to sunup that his crimes should be excused on the basis of his having Asperger's Syndrome. So well-researched was this episode that he does not display any physical characteristics in common with Aspies throughout the episodes. If you ever sit and have a conversation with an Aspie that shares one of the common traits with myself, you'll know about it because they won't stop wringing their hands throughout. Many an Aspie has been mistaken for having Italian heritage, their hands moved that much during conversation.


More correctly, his high-priced attorney is the one claiming he should be found not guilty. As I mentioned before, the prosecution knows that the claim is bull. Even then, not every person afflicted with a disease or affected by any developmental disorder automatically shares 100% of the common traits. There are usually varying levels.

3) There has never been, to date, a single case of unprovoked violence to this level from an Aspie. Not one. Albert Einstein was an Aspie, if that tells you anything. Andy Warhol was an Aspie, too, although Valerie Solanis probably didn't know that.


Given the relative newness of knowledge about Asperger's, a flat-out denial may seem slightly premature. Still, your comment needs to go back to the fact that the defense's claim is bull, and would be assumed by most people of being a poor attempt to find an excuse.

4) Irrespective of the level of research the L&O writers have performed in the past, these episodes were basically reminiscent of Nazi propaganda. Since watching them, I have been labouring under the fear of brownshirts marching up to my door. Not an unjustified fear, I might add, given that what I described in my comments is only the tip of the iceberg in terms of what I, and other undiagnosed Aspies of the 1980s, suffered.


It might be slightly unjustified. You assume all of America (or the world) will talk about this particular episode and come to hunt down people with Asperger's Syndrome.

I'm sorry that "Day" was seen as negative to people with Asperger's by you, but you are automatically assuming that everyone is going to side with the defense. They aren't the main characters; they aren't the central focus of the story (they are, but overall, they aren't). Most people are going to agree with Kibre, who sees the story as a blatant lie and does her best to prove that he is lying. Though I know you would never do so, you might need to rewatch and focus on what each side's belief is.

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The entire episode actually smacks of bad writing, ignorance, and prejudice. A good example of this is the moment when one of our beloved characters tells us that it seems every few years some German comes along and they name a disorder after him. I forget when Asperger's Syndrome was added to the DSM-IV, but that aside, it has been more than a decade since a full disorder description was added. Hans Asperger was Austrian. His description of the disorder is nothing like the description that exists today, and it was written in the 1940s. This is one of the more accurate statements in the episode.

The prosecution at no point offers any refutation of the idea that this defendant has Asperger's Syndrome. No testimony from psychologists, no testimony from real Aspies, nothing. Not a solitary effort was made to treat the Aspies of the world as individuals.

As my first paragraph makes clear, Asperger's Syndrome is only new, even knowledge-wise, in the minds of normies. But that aside, this only serves to highlight the foul treatment of Aspies over the past six decades. Every doctor these days who is worth his salt will tell you that the earlier the disorder is detected, the better the outcome.

Which brings me to the following: take a look at http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000129/board/thread/30770788. You will find half a dozen messages at the bottom containing news stories of violent crimes against auties and Aspies. Why could Law & Order not focus on crimes like these instead of making one up that bears absolutely no basis in reality? Because pointing the finger at the outsider and screaming "he's si-coh!" is easier than exploring the truth.

It is interesting to reflect that after twenty years that began with having a mother screaming into my ear until "my brain hurt", as I put it while I was lying on the ground crying, progressed through being bullied and beaten throughout school, being forced to ingest medications that caused worse iterations of the agony described above, only to learn just this year what the actual truth is, then to be told I am a rapist by default because I cannot tell the difference between "hello" and "let's *&^%", by people who cannot even pronounce Asperger, no less, as far as I have been able to find, I cannot find one of my living past girlfriends who is willing to testify that I raped them. Even without penalty of perjury.

--mentalcritic
"Så stod han der på utkikkstopp, Hans øyne ei dei kviler"

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Oh lord! IT'S TV mentalcritic!
Should every Latino get his knickers in a twist when one of his race go "bad" on a show? Should all men freak when one is depicted as a rapist on TV and his defense claims it was his hormones?? Same with shows depicting PMS sufferers as crazed killers? L&O has done a number of eps with Aspergers characters - they are not all depicted as rapists! As a matter of fact a few shows depicted an Aspies as the heroes of the day!

I think it's a really good idea that you've cut down your TV viewing time - you clearly can't cope with the difference between TV (i.e. make believe) and reality!

BTW - there are quite a few organizations that represent Aspies who laud such shows for bringing Aspergers' to light! My boyfriend has Aspergers - he liked the show! It's people like you who give the rest of us a bad name.
wanker, thy name is mentalcritic!

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You ignorant little normie fool.

First of all, Asperger's Syndrome is not a disease. There are some who would argue it is not even a disorder although it is listed as being a pervasive developmental disorder. Now, the fact that this television show resembles Nazi propaganda ("lock up your daughters, he's an Aspie, he'll rape you!") aside, your defense of it is laughable in light of the fact that the episode makes absolutely no effort at all to even suggest that this man is about as Aspie as he is a monkey, or that he is committing a serious offence. I suggest you take a good look at www.aspiesforfreedom.com for starters and just look at the amount of abuse we Aspies have to endure from normies like you day in, day out.

Lest you think my comment does not reflect the opinions of others, Channel Ten, the commercial network that broadcasts Law & Order in Australia, has received so many complaints about this one episode that they now have staff who do nothing but take angry calls from Aspies. Are you even aware that Aspies who make calls to the police in regional areas of Australia and make complaints of abuse routinely get ignored? No? Goes to show how much your opinion is worth then.

--mentalcritic
"Så stod han der på utkikkstopp, Hans øyne ei dei kviler"

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Sheesh...I am SO sick and tired of you PC crybabies whining anout everything that comes down the pike. It was a TV show! They don't owe you anything and probably care about as much as I do that you're upset at the way your disease (yes, it says right in the first line of that link you posted "Sometimes referred to as Aspergers DISEASE") or syndrome or whatever it is, was portrayed. Stop worrying and whining about what people do on TV and get on with your life. I just want to grab people like you and shake some sense into them. I happen to be Bi-Polar (formerly known as Manic Depressive) and I'm of Irish descent. Does that mean that every time a TV show depicts someone as bi-polar by having them paint themselves red and climb a flagpole, or showing some Irish guy getting drunk and beating his old lady that I should find a message board and whine about it? NO, it really doesn't. I just really hate this politically correct crap. A midget is a midget, a fat person is fat and you're an "aspie", big freakin' deal. You are not owed anything. Deal with it and move on, for cryin' out loud. I, like i'm sure most of the world, had never even heard of Aspergers until the show and if I didn't come here to see if there were going to be new episodes of TBJ I probably would never have thought about it again. I feel for you, like I would anyone with a disease/syndrome, but I don't feel sorry for you because it was portrayed in a negative light on TELEVISION! Ignore it and carry on, only advice I can give ya. Whining about it is just gonna piss people off.


mad

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"normies." heh heh. someone needs to take a chill pill...

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Best not to get him riled up. We'll be here for hours.

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Guys, as a fellow Aspie, I feel I need to apologize for these idiots.

I disliked the episode as a whole as well, but am I being a pussy?

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I can see where you're coming from and indeed, if I were in your place, I'd be quite ticked off too. This particular episode put a lot of weight on Gabriel Duvall’s syndrome as an explanation for his actions (although I think his mother being a psycho played a big part in it, too). When I watched this episode (which, admittedly, was a LONG time ago), I got the impression that the writers were trying to show how in some cases, a person's condition, disorder, whatever you want to call it, can potentially cause a lot of confusion and misunderstanding based on the differences between the so-called "normal" way of viewing the world, vs. the way of the individual in question.

However, it IS a television show, so it's pretty ignorant for people to honestly believe that this is how those with Asperger's Syndrome truly act (like the rape), as I'm sure you know all too well.

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After reading this thread, I can say that you, mentalcritic, should really relax and stop pointing fingers at a television show episode you didn't like. Aside from the fact I don't really think it's offensive, it's just downright stupid to complain it hurts your delicate feelings. I've known people with OCD laugh their asses off at Michael J. Fox's part in Scrubs. Why? Because it isn't real, and it also brings their condition into a greater light. If anything, you should be HAPPY L&O is informing the mainstream about Asperger's Syndrome.

Oh, and the line about 'some German comes along....' isn't because L&O writers are Nazis and want to hang you, it's because Angela Landsbury's character was written as the kind of person who would say something like that. If you can't differentiate between a fictional character and reality, what the hell are you doing on a public message board?

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maybe it's part of your "syndrome", but I think name calling on a message board isn't really showing "normies" (meaning.. what? normal human beings) a positive light on "not-normies" (not normal humans with Aspergers Syndrome).

I went to high school with kids with different problems, the issues ranged from mild depression to autism. I had classes with a few kids with Aspergers, and I'll tell you what, I disliked every single one of them. I actually think I'd rather have had them all be dangerous weirdos, than to be sitting with people who talked about their trip to *beep* Disney World for six months, all the while farting and eating their boogers. I'm not sympathetic to your "syndrome", or to you or your "aspie" community, and I wont treat "aspies" any differently than just the average overly annoying person that exists in this world.

Anyway, that sucks that you're autistic, but you should really get the *beep* over it and move on with your life.

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[deleted]

I understand mentalcritic's complaints even thous I never heard of this syndrom before seeing this topic.

I know that I was offended after Virginia Tech while all the Lierals predictably took advantage of the tradgedy y advanceing their GUn Control Agenda, all the Neo-Con moron like Sean Hannity where actualy sugesting rounding up people like that Cho, talking about all the so called obvious Warning signs, all of which could apply to thousand of people in this coutnry who never have and never will hurt anyone including myself.

http://www.RonPaul2008.com/
Our only Hope for a Decent President.

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The very fact that twice, and I'm not even through reading the responses, you have mentioned Nazis and/or Nazi Propaganda means you have already lost the argument. Twice you have gone Godwin, and it only shows your lack of using reasonable discussion tactics. This, Mental, means you have no case.

--
Once upon a time, we had a love affair with fire.
http://athinkersblog.com/

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Trial by Jury is a joke and an insult...

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I also have Asperger's Syndrome, and I was very thankful to the show's writers. They do not make it look like AS causes people to become rapists - unless you count Kibre repeatedly stating that the lawyer for Molina's character was using a lame defense and trying to use AS as an excuse. The villians were the ones who claimed that the man's AS caused him to rape and they were proved wrong and defeated.

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Thank you for your comments. You might've also liked last night's episode of Boston Legal, which approached the subject in a similar and ultimately different way.

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That's sweet of you. But I live in Oz, and we are about a year behind in Boston Legal eps. -_-

Oh, also, my psychologist, who has studied AS extensively, saw the episode as well. Not only did she enjoy it, but she also guessed that the man had AS before they even revealed it. So much for that argument on inaccurate symptoms.

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I don't half aspergers but i have Non Verbal Learning Disorder and work with people with Aspergers and I agree with Cam. It not only showed AS was not an excuse which is a good thing for people to see it helped raise AS awareness

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I agree with mentalcritic personally. If it had to do with racial prejudice or stereotypes or something like that instead of a disorder, there would have been uproar and rightly so. I haven't seen either episode myself as I don't watch SVU and haven't seen any of TBJ yet but I believe the writers should have done more extensive research in the subject, from what I've read above.

O'Neill, two 'l's!

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I know this comment is over a year old, but you haven't seen the episode and are basing your opinion off the rantings of ONE person who was highly offended.

My opinion:
I have seen half of one episode of TBJ and couldn't stand it. The whole "ZOMG! OFFENSIVE!" went out the window when the show didn't last for a full season and was canceled.

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Well, I've seen it since and I stand by my comment.

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I didn't kno that one was crossover...wow...now that's gonna make me wonder what happened. I just assumed that was the end of it, where SVU left off.

Just how close can I get Lord to my surrender without losing all control.

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Did this question ever get answered?

I read (literally) this entire post. Couldn't find a place/post where
the original question was addressed again.
Not only was the subject hijackedit was never returned.

So... my question is the same: where can I view the episode "Day?"

I've looked all over without success. Even STC let me down.
They only had something like 5 of the episodes and that
wasn't one of them.

Anyone?







Small Town Sim
Hey! Don't you ever knock?

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Try Hulu.

--
Once upon a time, we had a love affair with fire.
http://athinkersblog.com/

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