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THIS IS ONE OF BIG GREEK LIES,ALEXANDER WAS MACEDONIAN, NOT GREEK


ALEXANDER WAS NEVER GREEK, HE WAS MACEDONIAN.HISTORIANS CALL HIM GREEK FROM 19 CENUTRY. MACEDONIA WAS PARTITIONED IN 1913 AND GREEKS CLAIM THEY RIGHTS FOR ALEXANDER BECAUSE OF IT, BUT HE WAS MACEDONIAN.THAT IS CLASSIC GREEK PROPAGANDA. http://www.historyofmacedonia.org/

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I Haven't seen this movie yet but did you noticed the the film name is ( Alexander the Great from Macedonia ) ?? you said that the movie told that Alexander from Greek .. from where you get the info ??

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I think that guy was just talking about how history in general views Alex (history books are written by the winners). Greece conquered most of the known world and he seems to be still upset about it 2000 years later.

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[deleted]

Indeed. The guy that sarted this thread is another one of these guys that gets upset when a film is not historically accurate. Hell, most of the History that is taught in schools is not historically accurate, so let's do something about that and worry less about ENTERTAINMENT being accurate.

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Alexander used the greeks to conquer the world.
In those days it didn't really matter where you were from or ethnicity as in ancient rome it was a very intermingled society from an ethnic standpoint.
however, there is no doubt Alexander was ethnically Macedonian as was his father.

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Concluding from what you say and what's in the link you send, i understand that you didn't read it all. Try reading also the facts from the other side. Also try some helpful and reliable links like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macedonia_%28Greece%29 and
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macedon.
Also, you're right. Alexander was from Macedonia. And Macedonia is in Greece.
I don't know how people from the other side of the Atlantic see this, but imagine a new created country claiming the name "Texas" or "Alabama" and claiming also the history of that state. How would you react?


And, by the way. This is not the right place to talk about politics.

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All that's well and good (and I think you were more responding rycor814). I'm just saying that it's a tired argument when people complain about historical inaccuracies in movies. Especially one like this that never claims to be historically accurate.

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i can 't believe the guy who started this.can he just tell me,if alexander, and macedonia were not greek,then why did the greek include macedonians in the olympic games?do you know that they didn't let anyone but greeks participate in olympics?i m sick of this new story about FYROM called Macedonia.like the other guy said, how would you feel if in a civil war -let's say in mexico(example,nothing against mexico)- some people create a new country and call it (a state near mexico?), saying they one the name,and that they are descents of the people that used to live there before 25000 years?would you feel good?anyway,let them say,they have no idea about history...or anything

sorry about my english,if i have mistakes it's probably because it's too late to use my mind!!!

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There already is "a new country and call it (a state near mexico?)." It's called California. That proves your point. It's like people protesting the Columbus Day Parade in New York. But, some people need something to bitch about. It's just funny when they pick something that happened 2000+ years ago.

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[deleted]

Macedonia conquered ancient Greece.
Alexander did adopt most of the culture of ancient greece but that doesn't make him a greek. Nor does the fact that Macedonians participating in the Olympic games make them ethnically greeks.

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Well yes Mexicans are descendants of people from that era....aztects...read your history.

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I Am aromanian or of vlach origin and i wonder how would you feel if your culture was brutalized and changed around and your language was discouraged to the point that a different culture (in this case the greeks) have gotten the younger generations of vlachs thinking that they are actually greek and the greeks have made them be ashamed of their vlach origins. This is what has happened in Northern greece for the past 70 years. My grandparents migrated from the northern part of greece in the 1930's to romania. My grandpa still had brothers in greece and their children do not speak vlach anymore because of the ethnocentrism inherent in the greek culture towards my people. So when i hear you guys mention about a american state seceding i think its a b.s. inaccurate argument perhaps parts of northern greece where alexander came from (i am not saying that we are decendants of alexander) should have been given up to form a separate vlach state out of northen greece and southern albania where many of my people are from. Now though its a mute point because of the racist attitude instituted by the greek gov't and the greek people against my culture. this attitude has made most of the vlachs there believe that they are in fact greek when they are not. They are of thracian blood and not really of greek blood.

also on the topic of alexander many people dont mention that he was actually only half greek (from a macedonian greek tribe) and albanian. Also as for that argument that macedonians must have been greek because they participated in the olimpics i am not sure if their participation was allowed before alexander and i doubt that it was because when Phillip conquered greece after the huge war between the 2 main greek city states had decimated the greeks, Phillip and the macedonians were referred to by the greeks as barbarians from the north conquering the decimated greek city-states. I think that only after alexander macedonia were viewed as a greek city state. Either way alexander made greek the official language of his empire and adopted most parts of greeks culture instead of his macedonian culture so thats what makes him one of the greatest greek figures in history

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whatever, the closer descendants of Macedonian today are Albanians...same features, culture and traditions !!!

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Ignorant people.
You just like to talk talk talk talk.
Stop talking and read some books, preferably some of the ancient ones. Read historians that lived before 200 AD. There are a lot of them.
If you do you will see that no Albanians or Slavs (current FYROM residents) were living around Balkan Peninsula.
Macedonians as mentioned before were a Greek tribe. That is all. After World War One, communist from USSR needed to have access in Aegean Sea. They created the idea of a communist Macedonian nation that would claim their territories back from mean Greeks. Isn’t it a neat reason for WAR???

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You're Ignorant brother...I am greek, and I don't see the point to classify every prominent figure as Greek. It is propaganda and nationalism. Greece should stop craps. About our Albanian neighbours they're the oldest people of Europe...maybe they are the real Greeks...many modern greeks have Albanian blood and we call them ARVANITIKAS...As Greeks we should not mix politics and history...Alvanos are our brothers...


Here is a nice youtube video I've found out :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsekPtvppMU

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Allelujah to that brother!
The Balkans need more people like you.
I am Bulgarian and live outside of my country but I am sick and tired of the nonsense that goes around. We should learn to live together better and honor each other as neighbors better.

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Dear albanian cyro_ag (and not greek as you say that you are), if you think that Alexander wasn't of Grecomacedonian origin but he was from Skopje then show us at least one book or manuscripte that was written at the time of Alexander and was written in the slavic language that your friends the skopians speak today!! I don't understand how you people can think of such nonsense and believe to be true. It seems that people with no history like the skopians are easy to manipulate and are an excellent ally of enemies of Europe and Greece.
Alexander spoke greek because of one simple thing... Macedonia was and is a part of Greece and all of the Greeks wrote and spoke greek since the dawn of civilization!
cyro_ag if you are greek why can't you spell correct the words that you want to write in greek?? perhaps because you are NOT greek as you say! as albanians you maybe should not mix politics and history... But we greeks have every right to do so!
by the way nice propaganda video... too bad the soundtrack was from a greek composer... the ruins were ancient greek... the greek ancient discs and also the greek art pottery... try better next time and show something that is really from your people... like the burning of churches, women and children and the help that your people gave to the Turks during the Ottoman Empire when you aided them to kill European people (Greeks, Italians, Serbs, Russians, French, British etc.) as part of their invading and later occupation army!

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armakedon

demetrius, the writings on the tomb of phillip are written in the greek alphabet but they are not written in the ancient greek language i forget what languaqge they used to find out the meaning of those scriptures but it definitely wasnt greek

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Costeas, you don't know what you are talking about. I suggest you stop spreading lies given I have seen the writings on the Macedonian tombs personally and as a classic expert able to read and make out that not only was it written in the Greek alphabet but that it was in the Greek language too.

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you are not greek,,you are albanian,,albanos,,,skase re malaka pou grafeis kai sto imdb,,gamo tin alvania soummtrava sti kolotripa soy palioarhidi,,pou mas les oti eisai kai eelinas!!

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BUT THIS IS A MOVIE BOEARD ABOUT A MOVIE THAT CLAIMS IT HAS NO OR LITTLE BASIS IN REAL HICTORY. All this Historical chatter is great, but this is just a movie and one that states its historical INaccuracy from the get go. Its MACEDONIA 90210.

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But this guy didn't complain about how accurate or inaccurate this movie is.He said that Alexander was not Greek. That's his problem. It's like in a movie of US's War for Independence and someone doesn't criticize the movie, but all he's saying is that General Washington wasn't American, but French or Italian or something. Huh?

To cyro_ag: these things on the video are considered invalid for more than 5 years now. Refresh your sources.

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But, the was British. I think you were on to something there. It's the same as complaining about a Civil War film not saying that Washington was British.

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I am sorry it is new stuff...proven

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Apology accepted.

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Macedonians were not greek, that's why greeks have always called macedonians "barbarians", meaning outsiders, greek history also admits to the fact that most macedonians didn't speak greek, but rather their own primitive language. These new vicious attacks against macedonians by greeks is solely because of the macedonian minority living in northern greece that have no rights whatsoever and the fact that so many macedonians in the US, Canada, Australia and abroad are decendants of those who were kicked out of greece after WWI and WWII. And just as Macedonians have mixed thru the millenia with all other peoples that have passed thru the region so have the greeks. Check this link out.. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=11260506&dopt=Abstract

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I have to admit that I had no idea that there were still people who are considered Macedonians (it's so easy, even a Macedonian could do it, sorry, we had no idea you guys were still around). I'm guessing it's similar to the Palestinians (correct me if I'm wrong) or that minority group in Spain whose name always escapes me (starts with a "C" I think). Or, here's a good one, it's like saying Kleopatra was Egyptian. So, I think I am understanding this a little more and I am seeing what the big deal is. Thank you. It's amazing what you can learn in an IMDB chatroom. But, the name of this film is clearly ALEXANDER THE GREAT FROM MACEDONIA.

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And so what if he said he weren't Greek. I don't think there is any proof he is ethnically greek either way. Do you have his DNA??

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ok people, alexander was NO greek.he was a barbarian.since we don't have his dna we can't claim him as greek.neither can we proof that aristotle was greek.even achilleus maybe was...a barbarian.

oh, give me a break, you're being pathetic.you want alexander not to be not greek?ok, take him.take every single ancient greek, and call him whatever you want.just leave greece alone, and stop talking about greek propaganda.it is obvious whose propaganda this story is.i just can't believe how stupid people have become these days.they believe every *beep* someone tells them, without even trying to search for the truth

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I'm sorry but your premier,what was his name hmmm i think it was Karamanlis(correct me if i'm wrong),one week ago in the European senate said that,watch out!:I AM MACEDONIAN AND SO ARE 2.5 MILLION GREEKS!
If he feels that way,then thats just fine no problem at all,but he should confessed that a little earlier,don't you think?
And 1 history fact about Karamanlis,your so called real "greek" premier.
Let's see how greek he is:
His grandma was from a macedonian descent,which means macedonian,but married with a greek,so she had to learn his greek language,
and for her sister:she has never even spoken a greek word,and should i say about learning it?I think not.
I think that he is not lying about that he is Macedonian.


P.S.Truth hurts sometimes,doesn't it!?

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The people of Macedonia may not have considered themselves ethnic Greeks and may not have been considered ethnic Greeks by the Greeks themselves but what was more important was the culture and religion that they followed. Many people now believe that the Macedonians were an ancient Greek tribe that kept seperate from rest of Greece but absorbed many of the cultural influences of the rest of Greece.
Being that the Macedonian kingdom was an area near to Illyria, Dacia and Thrace, it is inevitable that there is some ethnic and cultural cross-over and overlap due to migrations, and that in keeping up the relations with other peoples, that the royal families would have intermarried. The ruling family of Macedonia, perhaps in contrast to the people they ruled, considered themselves to be of Greek descent and can trace descent through the male line to rulers of Argos and Mycenae.

http://www.american-pictures.com/genealogy/persons/per01162.htm#0

And the mother of Alexander that the YouTube clip seems to state is of pure Illyrian descent can claim a hypothetical link with Achilles.

http://www.american-pictures.com/genealogy/persons/per01294.htm#0

"God was a dream of good government. You will soon have your God, made with your own hands"

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"gorancrash", ofcourse he's Macedonian. His origins are from the Northern part of Greece called Macedonia. I don't understand your point. It's an area within Greece.

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I don't understand this whole thing. But, it's amazing that such a discussion broke out on a yet-to-be-released, low-budget, historically-inaccurate, historical, sword-and-sandal meladrama.

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I think most people don't care a damn...It seems the Greeks have something to prove for some reason...not sure what.
Do you know a bunch of Greek lawyers tried to sue the film makers for portraying Alexander as gay...lol

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True, most people just don't give a damn. You can say that about most of what's going on in this world. The average person just wants to go about their business. Humans are selfish animals as most animals are. Our survival instincts make it so. It's just sad that most people are so caught up with how bad traffic is, so they can't empathize with what it's like to be blown up by a suicide bomber on your morning commute.

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Haha...you want us to read history written by Greeks...
By the way my family is from Macedonia and I don't consider myself Greek. If you look at the ethnic makeup of most of the Macedon region it is predominantly Slavic.

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[deleted]

slavic,,you said it by your self!!! what slavs have to do eith alexander the great??? or albanians?,,you crazy ppl!!lol lol,,what can i say,,i think alexander was indian from chungaschuj tribe!! yea ,,)))

about the slav in macedonia,,you are origin bulgars,,so why you shame it?? bulgaria was a great empire in old days!! but now you claim tsar samuil as a macedonian,,he wasnt he was bulgarian,,,and tesla was serb,,he wasnt skopj))),,actually you dont have your own history,,your history is bulgarian!! as about ancient macdonia!! it was greek culturally,,same language ,,same people,,in minor asia king philip was said,,i will protect the greeks here ,,because there are my blood!!! so shut the "beep"up!!


and albanians please,,do us a favor and go to your *beep*

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are you *beep* kidding me? if you ever read history you would knew that Greece was cut in City Countries. Sparta, Athena, Macedonia... Eventually Alexander connect them into Hellas (not Greece as in English)Skopia was part of ancient Hellas. as part Turkey and Albania. Skopia (now wannabe named Macedonia)was part of Ancient Macedonia but they can't claim anything because Alexander was Macedonian but Hellinic! he spoke Greek Hello people!

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Greece was a big civilization at the time, you stupid ****! How come you speak English now? Are you English becouse you speek their language? Today's Macedonia (or FYROM, as you Greek homosexuals say) is a part of the Empire of Alexander the Macedonian. After the Balkan wars (several years before the WWI) the country was separated between Greece, Bulgaria and Serbia. Today's Macedonia is the part that belonged to Serbia, and it was given independence after the WWII. I'm sure that you learn different history in school, but that's the part of Greek propaganda. So *beep* the name FYROM. We are MACEDONIA. We were and we always will be. Alexander is buried on our territory. So learn history (not from your books). Read something about Demostenos (or however you call him, we call him Demosten). He was a philosopher who agitated against Alexander and his father Filip, because they weren't Greek. They were Barbarian. One of their ancestors was called Phillhellen (which means "friend of the Greeks" -------------> HE WAS NOT GREEK)
So as I was sayin', I speak English, German, Serbian, Bulgarian AND I'm not English, American, Serb, Bulgarian. I am a PROUD MACEDONIAN!
Try to learn something true and cut the propaganda.
The Americans didn't fall on it!:)

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First of all i did not curse! you are totaly wrong but what ever! you and your people just want to be something great! that's why you're stealing the name Macedonia.You think that by saying that you are Macedonian you became something great something big. well you are not! you are not going anywhere with that if your country didn't have the support of USA you wouldn't be able to call yourselfs Macedonians. But eventually -since we all have the same old routes- i will tell you that and please understand it! It's not where you come from or how many great people and heroes your country has! it doesn't matter if Alexander was Macedonian or Hellinic -which at the time meant the very same thing- what matters is what will you do with your life and if you will ever be remembered! tell me something GREAT about yourself. i don't have anything great to say about me but at least i don't hide my shame behind Alexander as you do! and forgive me for my english but i'm Hellinic!

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Dear arhidi or arhite
Your race coulter, language, face, body ,and sole is slav ethnic witch means in Greek and English a slave you were slaves in ancient time to the Greeks
you now to wipe there *s.
You can not change who you are live with it!

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you are slav,,you are not macedonian!! you have no connection with alexander the great!!!

i am speak many languages too,,and i am speaking slav also like russian for examp!! so i know about slavian language many things..and you ppl have nnothing to do with ancient history you didnt existed back then!!

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OK a bit history for you people. In South Balkan peninsula (nowadays Greece), 4000 years ago lived some people called Pelasgians. In 2000BC-1600BC the first Greek tribe descended from the northern Europe to mainland Greece, they were called the Achaeans and gave the boot to (or assimilated with) Pelasgians, they are famous for their Troyan War (Achilles, Odysseus, Menelaus, Agamemnon were Achaeans).

They were the the dominant race in the Greek peninsula for some 4-6 centuries and made an alliance of city-states named the Mycenaean civilization. The greatest city and the center of decisions was Mycenae, while other famous cities of the alliance were the island of Ithaka (Odysseus's home), Athens, Sparta, Pylos and Thebes.

Around the 13th century BC happened an event named the Dorian invasion, the second prime tribe of Greeks -the Dorians- descended to the Greek mainland, burning most of the Mycenaean centers to the ground and claiming them for their own, along the descendance a part of the tribe was stationed to the north of the Greek peninsula and were named Macedonians, and some of them (more eastern) Thraceans, most of the others went and stayed to the ol' Mycenaean centers. Athens was the only major Mycenaean (Achaean) center not to be conquered by the Dorians (Athenians -in the later days- had it as something to be proud of being direct descendants of the proto-Greeks, Achaeans).

Fast forward, after 4 "dark" centuries (without many historical events taking place, result of the Dorian plunge), through the Classical years (starting from the 8th century) of science, art and philosophy, we arrive to the 5th century BC when Herodotus, wrote the first historical accounts ever being documented in human history calling the descendants of the two main Greek tribes as the Hellenic Race and the place they lived Hellas including Macedonians, Thraceans, Athenians, Spartans, Thebians (pretty much anyone living in the present day Greece) Ionians and everyone else living in the Aegean shores of Asia Minor (Turkey today), which meant that all those people were talking the same language had the same religion and claimed the same heritage.

You can understand even better Herodotus's claims by the origin of the seven sages of Ancient Greece (the first historical scientists/philosophers): Thales of Miletus (from Miletus of Asia Minor), Solon the Athenian (from mainland Greece - Attica peninsula), Chilon the Spartan (mainland Greece, Peloponnese), Bias of Priene (Ionian, Asia Minor), Cleobulus of Lindos (present day Rhodes, Greek island of the Aegean sea), Pittacus the Mitylinean (present day Mitylene - Lesvos, Aegean island), Periander of Corinth (mainland Greece - Peloponnese).

Fast forward another century to the 4th century BC. That's when the Peloponnesean war (between Sparta and Athens) had already ended (with Spartans taking a narrow victory) with most of Hellenic city-states lying in disarray (first half of 4th BCE), except Macedonia which had expanded to Iperus, up north (to the present day FYROM) and east to Thrace, while Philip the Macedon took hold of the Macedonian Kingdom (Macedon being wealthy and powerful) decided to make an Alliance with the other Greek states under his rule so that expand eastwards against the Persian empire. Many Athenians with Demosthenes at their helm claimed no allegiance to Macedonians, Demosthenes went as far as calling Macedonians barbarians (the so-called "barbarians statement"). In those days "Barbarian", meant a person who spoke "Bar, Bar" a.k.a. not Greek, Demosthenes claims was based on the language spoken from people living in the freshly conquered places from the Macedonian empire, which were of Illyrian, Scythians or other norther Balkan origins. In other words Demosthenes calling Macedonians as barbarians was a political propaganda used from him towards the ignorant Athenian populace to gain votes towards his political best interests (not that much different from present day politicians ....). Based on his inaccurate "barbarian" statement the main opposing party lead by Eubulus made a fierce opposition to his thesis calling him that he was undermining peace and stability between the Greeks by alienating them, however Demosthenes party prevailed making Athenians believe that they had little to no connection to Macedonians (which was primarily true since they were Achaeans and not Dorians like the Macedonians, but not entirely since Achaeans and Dorians descended from the same tribe).

Also worthy of a note is to say that Aristotle one of the most famous philosophers/scientists of ancient Greece was born in Stageira of Chalcidice which was Thracian by that time but already had Macedonian influence. Aristotle was most probably of Macedonian origin which gave his father a place in Macedonian aristocracy and he -himself- later on a place as the tutor of Alexander the Great.

On another note, present day Macedonia's (FYROM) populations are of Albanian, Slavish, Turkish and Greek blood lineage but they have no cultural connection with ancient Macedonia. Most of the populace according to official records are of Slavic origins which descended to the place not before 6th CE ..... Present day FYROM's strives are mostly politically fueled since there is no historical connections between them and ancient Macedonians.

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[deleted]

You lot got owned, seriously you guys are worse than the "we never landed on the moon" *beep*

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"You lot got owned?" Is that English? But, this is great stuff, man. A serious ethical and ethnic discussion about ancient Macedonia on an IMDB sight about an un-historically accurate film.

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I have to say well done Stevethegreat, for your knowledge and for taking the time and having the patience to write all of that, perhaps people will have a better understanding.
Problem is, you get something like this after all your hard work...

Idiot, Macedonia IS Greek.

THE MAN
THE LEGEND
THE GREEK


"God was a dream of good government. You will soon have your God, made with your own hands"

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As a bystander in this little debate, it seems like this is the same as Texans in the early days of American wanting to be known more as Texans than Americans. Or, not. Maybe it's more like Ukranians not wanting to be known as Soviet Union-ites.

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[deleted]

Vardaska will be the new and permanent name for FYROM.

Slavs can only be called by a slavic name and should be proud to be slavs.

Alexander the Great was a proud Greek man who fought to spread Greek culture, ideas and beliefs to the Eastern world.

Slavs have no need to steal Greek names or Greek culture.


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[deleted]

The president of FYROM admitted that he has little connection to the ancient people who lived on his land. Many Greeks have admitted the same about their land.

Ancient Minoan Greece was conquered by (among others): Myceneans, Dorians, Spartans, Macedonians, Romans, Byzantines (not really 'conqured' but the culture was changed), Latin Crusaders, Ottomans.

Along the way the culture was changed immensely, including the language. This is why most Greek children today cannot read the classics in their original language.

Alexander's first language was Macedonian, but he also spoke Greek along with other languages.

What is known as 'Greece' today and the people known as 'Greeks' ought to change the names changed, but of course this is wishful thinking.

Neither Greeks or Macedonians should get too worked up about this; it happens in every country, but most countries don't try and claim the history of the world as 'theirs.' Italians don't say they 'own' Roman history, because if they did they would demand Greece back. 'Greece' has a very, very long history of being conquered many, many times by many, many different cultures.

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guys calm down-the skopians "fake macedonians" cant proof why ARISTOTLE is a famous greek but in same time they claim alexander as non greek ...

alexander and aristotle were born in northen greece MAKEDONIA ...SAME TIME SAME PLACE SO WHY THE WORLD KNOW ARITOTLE AS GREEK AND DISCUS THE GREEKNES OF ALEXANDER that makes no sense!! think abou it

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[deleted]

guys calm down-the skopians "fake macedonians" cant proof why ARISTOTLE is a famous greek but in same time they claim alexander as non greek ...

alexander and aristotle were born in northen greece MAKEDONIA ...SAME TIME SAME PLACE SO WHY THE WORLD KNOW ARITOTLE AS GREEK AND DISCUS THE GREEKNES OF ALEXANDER that makes no sense!! think abou it

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I see many lack historical knowledge of ancient Greek history. Macedonians weren't Greek? That fallacy wouldn't be from the same comic book that gave the idea ancient Greek couples stopped having sex after their 3rd child, would it?

People need to read carefully the ancient writings of the Greeks and not what one finds on random political based online sites. Start with ancient Greeks like Aeschines and Isocrates who viewed the Macedonians as Greeks LONG before Macedon was any powerful Kingdom never mind trying to conquer the Southern Greek Polies.

Aeschylus - do people know when he lived? Try the 6th century BC now go back and calculate what era King Philip 'conquered' as some ignorantly claim Athens. Aeschylus the ATHENIAN, one of those same Southern Greeks that some falsely claim viewed Macedons an "Barbarian None Greeks"! Read his play "The Suppliants," where the poet on the basis of the age-long legend handed down by the Greeks from prehistorical times proclaims the descent of the Macedonians from the Doric branch and directly tells us about the Macedons origin from the Argive Heracleids, as those who ruled "the land of the Perrhaibians," "beyond Pindus," "near the Paeonians," "in the Dodona mountains" and "all the territory through which the pure Strymon flows." Aeschylus tells us that the Argaeads also include the peoples of Thessaly and Epirus, whose royal families had their own traditions of descent from Hellenic gods. So tell me why did Aeschylus who lived CENTURIES before Macedon became a superpower, why did Aeschylus the bearer par excellence of pan-Hellenic traditions and ideals, who also was A FIGHTER at one of Greece's most well known battles at Salamis and singer of the all-Greek surge against the invader from Asia, believed Macedonia to be a Greek people and land, why did Aeschylus broadcasts Macedons royal house descent as Greek, according to Greek legend, from the Hellenic pantheon, hmm? What, was he scared of a backwards kingdom that had NO power at all during his life time?

Another great start in learning ancient Greek history by scholars and not cereal boxes would be Hesiod an Anatolian Greek who lived in the 8th century BC, do the calculation on how many centuries that was BEFORE Macedon became the powerhouse it did. In Classical Greek:

"Magnhta Makhdona: Makedonia h cwra wnomasqh apo Makedonos tou Dios kai Quias ths Deukaliwnos, ws fhsin Hsiodos: h d’ upokusamenh Dii geinato terpikeraunw uie duw Magnhta Makhdona Q’ ippiocarmhn, oi peri Pierihn kai Olumpon dwmat enaion. (1)" (Hsiodos, c.720 BC)

Translation in English:

"Magnes and Macedon: And she (Thyia daughter of the Greek progenitors Deucalion and Pyrrha and sister of Hellen, who together with his three sons Dorus, Xuthus (with his sons Ion and Achaeus) and Aeolos, comprised the set of the basic 7 ancient tribes that formed the Greek/Hellenic nation) conceived and bare to Zeus who delights in the thunderbolt two sons, Magnes and Macedon, rejoicing in horses, who dwell round about Pieria and Olympus.’(1)" (Hesiod, c.720 BC)

The "Macedon" Hesiod is speaking about is the forefather of whom his descendants, the Macedonians, took their name from and of whom they (the Macedons) and ancient Greeks clearly considered a Hellenic tribe.

Here is another ancient ATHENIAN Greek, Thucydides who lived 100 YEARS before Philip united the Hellenes. This is what he states about the Macedons:"The total Hellenic force was about three thousand; the cavalry that went with them, Macedonians and Chalcidians, were all told a little less than one thousand, and there was besides a great multitude of barbarians". Here is it is in Greek too: Gk:"MAKEDONVN JYN XALKIDEYSIN OLIGVN ES XILIOYS, KAI ALLOS OMILOS TVN BARBARVN POLYS".
Thucydides distinguishes the Greeks which included the Macedonians and Chalcidians too on the one hand and barbarians who were not Greek on the other by using the adjective few (Gk: OLIGVN) for the former and many for the latter (Gk:POLY).

Here is another ancient Greek ATHENIAN source for people Euripides, and he knew the Macedonians very well given he LIVED amongst them for many years and had NO problem communicating in Hellenic with them, that is hundreds of years LONG before the supposed 'Hellenization' of Macedon some claim. He wrote many tragedies that were written and played while he was in Macedonia. This would have been impossible, had the Macedonians been 'barbarians' (non-Greek). This is because in one of these tragedies, 'Iphigeneia in Aulis', the Greek superiority over the barbarians is emphasized. The following epigram in memory of Euripides which is attributed by some authors to Thucydides may give us more light to the actual beliefs of the people of that time (and possibly Thucydides):"MNHMA MEN ELLAS APAS' EYRIPIDOU, OSTEA D' ISXEI GH MAKEDVN, H GAR DEJATO TERMA BIOU". That is Classical Greek, translation:"Macedonia, the land of Greece that holds the bones of Euripides." The Macedons would have found their Kingdom called by other ancients "the land of Greece=(Grk):MNHMA MEN ELLAS APAS' EYRIPIDOU offensive if as some falsely claim it wasn't the land of Hellenes if it wasn't so. Given that the Macedons did not find it offense is more evidence the ancient Macedons were a Hellenic tribe.

Here is another ancient Greek Herodotus states the following about ancient Macedons Greekness in Histories, 1.53.1: "…for during the reign of Deucalion, Phthiotis was the country in which the Hellenes dwelt, but under Dorus, the son of Hellen, they moved to the tract at the base of Ossa and Olympus, which is called Histiaeotis; forced to retire from that region by the Cadmeians, they settled, under the name of Macedonians, in the chain of Pindus. Hence they once more removed and came to Dryopis; and from Dryopia having entered the Peloponnese in this way, they became known as Dorians."

Another ATHENIAN Isocrates states the following LONG before Philip conquered Athens: "For I am going to advise you to champion the cause of concord among the Hellenes and of a campaign against the barbarians; and as persuasion will be helpful in dealing with the Hellenes, so compulsion will be useful in dealing with the barbarians. This, then, is the general scope of my discourse. I affirm that, without neglecting any of your own interests, you ought to make an effort to reconcile Argos and Lacedaemon and Thebes and Athens; for if you can bring these cities together, you will not find it hard to unite the others as well;" Now why would Isocrates who was a Greek Athenian ask the help of a King who was supposedly not Greek to champion the cause of the Greek cause? That's like an American politician asking Bin Ladin to champion the American cause.

Also this is what John Edwin Sandys states in "The first Philippic and the Olynthiacs" Publisher: London, Macmillan and co. includes Greek texts and commentaries regarding passage "Argos"[Herodotos VIII 137, IX 45, Thucydides II 99,2, V 80,2] :"one of Philip's ancestors, Alexander A', had as a Greek been allowed to compete at the Olympic games [Herodotos V 22]. Demosthenes, however, in his hatred of Philip, never acknowledges his Greek descent. ... of breath as he gasps out this final and comprehensive phrase of vituperation. In such a spasmodic utterance no one need be surprised either at the presence of hiatus or at the concurrence of several short syllables". In other words what classics scholar Sandys is saying Greeks did not side with Demosthenes because they did not take his accusations seriously. Anyone who believes what Demosthenes said was taken at face value by most Greeks are fooling themselves. A parallel to that is if someone took seriously Bush Senior when he called former President Clinton a "bozo," and not comprehend it was just an abusive term used as an insult towards another political person.

As for those out there who try to use the lame a s s excuse Greeks were just trying to 'gain favors' with Macedon are forgetting one HUGE factor in their lame argument: why would Greeks like Thucydides, Aeschylus, Hesiod, etc.
who ALL lived CENTURIES before King Philip became a powerful king make claims that the Macedonians were Hellenic? What did these ancient Greeks who lived CENTURIES before Macedon became a power house have to "gain the favor" of a small POWERLESS insignificant kingdom that had no influence on world affairs? Answer: nothing, they had nothing to fear, nothing to gain, nothing at all, they stated exactly what the ancient world view on Macedonians was, that of a Hellenic Kingdom. This is also reinforced by the Persians, who ruled Macedon for a while there. The Persians call the Macedonians, and this is inscribed to this day and found on Cyrus the Greats tomb "The Greeks Wearing Hats", in reference to the special hats the Macedonians were known to wear.

PS: Oh and since ancient Greek history is not a subject most of you are familiar with, here is another FACT ya'll should store away: it was King Alexander I, don't confuse him with Alexander the Great, who SPIED upon and warned the Spartans, Athenians and other Greeks of Xerxes attack on Greece. And it was King Alexander I who pushed the last remaining Persian soldiers out of the Hellenic region, hundreds of years BEFORE the supposed "Hellinization" of Macedon under King Philip. People really need to research what they are trying to argue before they come out looking ignorant of the facts.

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Alexander was born in Pella(Greece) :)

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Nice.

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Simple:
Alexander the Great = Ancient Macedonian = Ancient Greek

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[deleted]

I'm tired of this stupid "controversy." That fact is that, nearly 3000 years after the fact, the current inhabitants of BOTH Greece and Macedonia have zero real ethnic relationship with the ancient peoples of the region. Modern Greeks and Macedonians are descended almost entirely from the various combination of Slavs, Turks, Goths, etc who moved into and through the region over dozens of centuries.

You have about as much right to claim the identities of these ancient people as I do to call myself a Roman because Romans once occupied Britain and France.

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[deleted]

[deleted]

You will have to demote the Greek denomination too, since it originally refers to ONE tribe of Hellens, the first one who met the Romans (from what I understood) in southern parts of Italy. The "Greek" denomination has then been extended by Romans to denote all Hellens, somehow incorrectly.

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