No sympathy for low life scum


I wish that he could have died in a horrible way just like his victims did. For all of you who say that Arnold and the state of California murdered Tookie Williams, let me ask you this: What if that had been your loved one that was killed by him. I'll bet that would surely change your mind about whether or not he deserved to be executed. To the very end he claimed to be innocent, but there was no way his execution would have been stopped just because he found himself in the unique position of being a death row inmate who said he didn't do it. Afterall, everyone in prison is innocent right? His appeals process went on for years, and it is certain that he committed those heinous murders. Just because you claim to have turned over a new leaf does not mean that you should not be held accountable for what you did. Tookie, the world is a better place without you and I hope you burn in hell.

reply

oh no , god forbid America jails an innocent black man *cough* mumia *cough*, never seen that happen
and the point wasnt to stay his execution or grant clemency based on the claims of innocence it was so he could continue reaching out to children and tackling a massive problem in gangs worldwide.
also , how is the world a better place? innocent people are dying every day :darfur(the world police wont step in), iraq (the world police wont step out) etc

reply

You call founder of Crips L.A. street gang an innocent man? Do you even know what it takes to create a gang like that? Just think for a moment before falling for pathetic stories.
Just my 2ยข.

reply

I for one will never say that what Stanley "Tookie" Williams created was anything short of horrendous. The creation of the Crips gang has caused so many deaths not just here in Los Angeles but across the country and ultimately across the world. But here is someone who worked very hard to do something about the hellish problem that he created, how many who have killed ever tried to do what he accomplished? I am not saying that the man did not deserve punishment but the work he did has prevented kids from joining gangs and will help others who have already began the walk down the wrong path, doesnt that count for something? How many of you on this board have ever dared to work with a kid or a teen who belongs to a gang? Or work in a youth center in a gang infested neighborhood? I would bet everything i own that you wont even drive through problem ridden neighborhoods let alone make moves to help those who need it most. Williams did that from PRISON. He was able to help fellow gang members lay their weapons down and stop killing each other in record numbers. He did what no one on the outside could do. His death satisfied a thirst for bloodlust, and it was a temporary satisfaction of that desire. I will bet that his death brought no real closure to easing the pain for the victims' families, because there is nothing that will end such suffering. I know because a member of my family was murdered years ago. No execution, no amount of punishment responsible for their death will ever end our pain. It never goes away, you learn to live with the loss and you go on in the memory of those who no longer live. Williams work could have continued and he would have began to repay the huge debt to society he incurred, his death served no purpose than to placate people who believe violence should be retributed with further violence.

reply

I bet if it was your father, son, brother,etc that was the cop pos mumia murdered in cold blood you would not be so devoid from reality to claim he's innocent. Tookie NEVER tried to help police steer kids away from gangs. He never tried to help prison guards dismantle prison gangs. Mumia and Tookie are as "innocent" as OJ and Casey Anthony. All Tookie did was unite Prison Gangs to attack the guards. I doubt he even believe in anything he "wrote" in that kid's book to save his ass while NOT making any real amends for all the crimes he committed directly and indirectly as well as the thousands of lives he helped to destroy by creating the crips

reply

tookie williams was and forever will be a piece of *beep* i sincerly hope his death was as painful as possible.

reply

Anyone know where I can get one of those "Fry Mumia!" shirts?


"Spare me your sixth grade Michael Moore logic!"

reply

By creating the Crips, Tookie Williams continues to kill innocent people by proxy. He has degraded the black community more than any white man ever could.

Clearly, he was an intelligent man with innate leadership skills. He could have used his power for good, but he decided to victimize people who were on the same soci-economic level that he was simply because he could. He knew not to bring his crime spree into the Hollywood Hills, Beverly Hills, and other neighborhoods where the folks were rich enough to have him "handled." Instead, he preyed upon other black folks. What a big man.

Seriously, your cousin would have put a bullet in me if he knew me in person because he would have presumed me weak and someone he could have targeted. I am just like those working class people that he slaughtered for less than $300 bucks.

Tookie did not give a damn about black folks; Tookie gave a damn about Tookie, period.

I save my sympathy for other hard working folks trying to make it.

reply

What's up uhcoughar I totally agree with everything you stated in your

post.Tookie was a punk bitch that DIDN'T GIVE A DAMN ABOUT BLACK PEOPLE.Another

thing some people in his defense must realize is that besides doing murders by

his own hands, what about the countless hits he's had ordered on people. To me

it seemed that Tookie was not remorseful about his CHOICES in life and was

trying to keep his muscle bound deebo looking ass alive. It's funny how people

in his corner are saying that he should be forgiven and let that be that. What

about his victims? They don't get a chance to live to see another day.With

people like him, their mentality is this: I *beep* you up today, I repent

tommorrow and you have to forgive me regarless of how *beep* up and vunerable I

left you feeling, and we all live happily ever after THE END. The tookies of

the world have no concept of responsibility taking and are really just pathetic

waste of sperm cell that would be better off dead. Tookie is one less *beep* I

have to worry about. Rest in Piss tookie.Rest in peace to his dead victims and

God Bless to the ones that are lucky to still be breathing.

reply

Do you even understand the meaning of the word "REDENCAO" or "REDEMPTION"? Go check your dictionary or encyclopedia & then get back with us...To all you young AFRICAN (americans),LATINO (americans),we know what TOOKIE meant to us. We know what changes and struggles he went through to understand the mistake he may have made. The only guilty people in this country are the so-called "true americans". Or should I say,"The AB or those cowards that hide behind the white sheets...the kkk?" To us, Tookie was a brother who found peace in himself to admit to his wrong-doings. But,hey,when your color is what it is,then you know the out-come. The governor,Arnold,he couldn't even tell the truth about his steroid use,so what makes you think he would tell the truth about being a work-out partner with the so-called criminal,killer,gang-banger? Just understand,"Don't be upset by the slurs these americans use to describe one of our fallen "SOLDIERS",just look to the HEAVENS & know that,Big Bro Tookie,is serving in the LORDS' army,now. MAY GODS' PEACE BEYOND TO YOU.

reply

Ok so you think he a low life he is no different then Jeffery Dahmer or Charles Manson or those kkk cowards who always prey on the helpless and get away with murder

reply

[deleted]

Re: No sympathy for low life scum
by - jaysun772001 on Wed Nov 29 2006 08:53:13
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ok so you think he a low life he is no different then Jeffery Dahmer or Charles Manson or those kkk cowards who always prey on the helpless and get away with murder

To answer your simple minded question/comment, YES I think he's a

low life piece of *beep* So are Charles and Jeffery so what exactly is your

point your trying to convey? Tookie was a fraud that mislead a lot of people

that are ( I mean "were") stupid enough to buy into his *beep* He wasn't

redeemed. He wasn't even man enough to ackowledge his crimes. All that "I'm

redeemed" and " I love the kids and my brothas and sistas" propaganda was more

fraud than a four dollar bill.People like him are all about themselves and

really don't give a damn about who they use and abuse to get what they are

after.I recognize what he WAS really about. He was about saving his black ass

so he wouldn't have to suffer the consequnces and die.If he was really sorry he would have at least

apologized to his victims families or shown some type of sympathy. He was a low budget

terrorist that terrorized his own people in his own community. In my opinion

that constitutes him and those like him as the real SELL OUTS in the

community.Hopefully his demise will show others like him what happens when live

out that type of lifestyle. So once again tookie, REST IN PISS AND *beep*

reply

Wow!!! So much HATE in the hearts of people. I can see both sides of the arguments here in all of your comments. Let's just say it like this....Tookie did what he did; before he was a crip, during his crip days, and after his crip days, ALL of us have to pay for our sins sooner or later weather we turn our life around or not, you still have to pay for the bad you've done, let GOD be the judge and lets stop judging each other. We as people know what are sins are and we for sure have to answer to them sooner or later to GOD. Who knows Tookie may have turned his life around for the good, and that's great; wonderful! And by doing so he has helped some of our black men think twice before joining a gang. But he still had to pay for what he did by death, if you live by the sword you will die by the sword, what goes around comes around, that goes for all of us. He who is without sin let him cast the first stone! Sin is sin. instead of judging people pray for people; ALL people, good or bad and let GOD be the judge, because HE is going to repay whom ever needs to be repaid, good or bad. Here we all are arguing back and forth with each other and who knows (God be the judge) Tookie may be in heaven, his days are done here, God plans for his life on earth are done, and here we are with so much hate in our hearts for one another, were too busy worrying about what Tookie did or didn't do, we all have to forgive in order to be saved and make it to heaven, no one on this earth was more innocent than JESUS CHRIST look what happened to Him, and HE forgave all! PRAY FOR THIS NATION FOR UNDERSTANDING ON HOW THIS WORKS...... Now go and do the right thing...PEACE!

reply

tookie was a sad excuse for a man. I think he had a demon in him. He pretty much destroyed Watts.

reply

I think he had a demon in him.
Demons don't exist. Stop blaming people's bad decisions on fairytale BS in a serious discussion about evaluating ethics and human worth.


"I've been living on toxic waste for years, and I'm fine. Just ask my other heads!"

reply

Reallyreal thats what I'm trying to say read my post, so *beep* YOU *beep* TOOKIE *beep* ARNOLD

reply

Calm down tookie jr. my mistake.

reply

I don't agree with the death penalty because I don't see the logic in taking a human life justified soley on the fact that they took someone else's life. It's not like they're bringing anyone back from the dead by killing him.

But I don't understand why he was/still is so celebrated. Maybe he didn't kill those four people that he was sentenced for. But do you honestly think he didn't kill other people that we don't even know of? I'm sure he did.

Some people act like he was a saint or something which he wasn't. But saying the world is "a better place without him" and that you "wish he burns in hell" is totally unnecessary.

But like I said; I don't believe he deserved to be killed. And he seemed to be changing his ways at the end of his life. To bad he had it taken away from him.

reply

the death penalty was meant to be a deterrent. But as you can see, it doesn't really work. So now its used as revenge for the surviving family. Took's "redemption" happened after he was in solitary for 6 years. 6 years in a 4 x 6 cell 23 hours a day would make the devil redeem himself

reply

And what do you think would happen to him if he would of stayed in that 4 x 6 cell 23 hours for the rest of his life? You'd get an actual reason to call him a saint that's what would happen.

The purpose of incarceration is to keep a criminal (which he was) from society; preventing them from harming anyone else, and for them to get a chance to think of they have done (which it seems like he was doing).

"So now its used as revenge for the surviving family."
Agreed.

reply

according to who?? Even if what you say is true, will tookie murder anyone ever again? Not *beep* likely



Amendment V - Ratified 12/15/1791

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

reply

Took's "redemption" happened after he was in solitary for 6 years. 6 years in a 4 x 6 cell 23 hours a day would make the devil redeem himself


true.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I have never seen a vision, nor learned a secret, that would damn or save my soul"!

reply

You call turning his life around all the way so he could stop other kids of following in his footsteps easy? You need to get a life and think about what you say. Just because he made some mistakes and didn't fit into the american dream dosen't mean he is useless. The reason he even made a gang was too survive i'm sure ur white or some black kid with parents that made it out the ghetto and hate who they are. You dont know what its like for people in the ghetto.If you were born there were people don't care about you, i'm sure you would have done the same thing. He made mistakes as you probably have and was a good man in the end, and he was innocent. Arnold is a murderer.

reply

for all you people saying bad stuff about tookie. I'll give 5 bucks to anyone that can say it to his face. (or surviving family memebers)

reply

Lila, I'm not sure he was 'innocent', as you say, but I think he definitely had changed & that he'd have done society much more good alive, by remaining in prison the rest of his life & continuing writing Nobel quality books to save our kids.
He might have been lying about his innocence, but, if he wasn't sincere about repenting, he wouldn't have been able to write books powerful enough to get him nominated five times for the Nobel Prize.
Linda Owens, the widow of one of Tookie's supposed victims, was moved enough by his writings, to support him. "I, Linda Owens want to build upon Mr. Williams' peace initiative. I invite Mr. Williams to join me in sending a message to all communities that we should all unite in peace. This position of peace would honor my husband's memory and Mr. Williams work."
Even Dubya sent him a letter commending him for his social activism.
I don't know if he was innocent of the 4 murders. I know he wasn't innocent on the whole. He apologized for starting the Crips. I DO believe he'd have done society more good alive & continuing his writing.

Carpe Noctem

reply

[deleted]

SOME scum DO find Jesus, while in prison. Charles Coulson, of Watergate infamy, found God in prison. It isn't that unusual.
Tookie made no claims to have found Jesus--or anything of the sort.
He wrote in an attempt to steer kids from gangs. These were not trite, superficial works. They were good enough, that he was nominated 5 times for Nobel Prizes. The Nobel Committee member(s) who nominated him apparently believed him sincere. These weren't written solely in an attempt to save his own skin. He realized the damage he'd done, in creating the Crips & was doing what he could to rectify that.
He was convicted of first degree murder--not the same as committing it. I'm not saying he did it or not.
Had he admitted to the murders--he'dhave been more likely to have been spared. He knew that.
I'm not even saying he didn't deserve to die. I'm just saying he was a valuable & sincere resource--while alive. That him living & continuing his writings would've done more for inner city youth than his death did.


Carpe Noctem

reply

[deleted]

[deleted]

Tookie saved more lives than he took... he should've lived.

reply

I am glad he's dead. One less gang banger on the streets.

reply

He didnt deserve to die. He saved more lives than he took.

Isnt the prison system all about rehabilitating people so they come out as better people and better citizens. Stanley Williams went in as a monster but after he sought redemption and turned his life around he became a peacemaker. The prison system worked in the case of Tookie, they turned his life around and produced a man of god, peace, love and redemption.

He didnt have to do the things he did, he didnt have anything to loose. He didnt have to devote his time to teaching the kids of today to stay away from gang bagging and killing. He could have easily sat back and turned away from redemption but his strength as a person allowed him to see the light of a better path. Even when he knew he was going to die, he unselfishly thought about others and how to single handidly change a culture of voilence into a world of peace, a culture that the American government refused to acknoweledge. It takes a strong person to face death and still think about others, people who are on here critising Tookie I have a feeling couldnt do the same.

What did it prove killing a man that had served his time to making the world a better place. Keeping him alive would have allowed him to continue on his path of redemption, it would have allowed him to save more lives and teach more people about the better way.

Dont think that I'm saying the Death Penalty is wrong, what I am saying is that it was unnessercary. I beleive people should be sentenced to death when there is no hope for them and their is no sign that they will reform during there time in prison. Like I said the prison system was created to rehabilitate people who had lost there way. People like Dahmer, Bundy and Cacey deserved the Death Sentence because they were beyond rehabilitation, it was obvious that no matter how much time they spent in prison they were not going to conform into better people.

If we continue to kill men of peace then we will have no one left to teach us. I beleive that killing Stanley Williams was unjustified. Yes he killed those people but his redemption and his teachings saved more lives than anyone man could ever take.

Arnold Swartzeeneger or whomever it was that decided that Tookie would die in my opinion is against creating world peace. I'm not saying that Tookie was they only answer to world peace, but he was apart of they answer the world has been looking for for many years now.

Comments on this forum against Tookie for me hold no water and are unjustified. Because of Tookies teachings he has saved the lives of sons and daughters, grandsons and grandaughters of people allover the world, thats a remarakable thing and something only a few people can say they have accomplished. You never know his books and words could possibly save the life of your Son or Daughter.

What point was proved in killing Tookie, what point was proved in killing a man who dedicated his life to making the world a better place.

This is bigger than the deaths of the four people he killed. If he didnt kill them, they would have killed him. When your back is against a wall Im sure you would do the same thing. When you are brought up in a world that you know no different from, alot of you would do the same. He was caught up in a visious world and it took a man of courage and strenght to break free from it.

When you have saved the amount of lives he has saved and when you have changed a world culture and formed peace between enemys then you can say that he deserved to die, until then you have no justification to say it.

Learn to Love it Learn to Live with it Diamonds are Forver and so is Ric Flair....WOOOOO

reply

""Isnt the prison system all about rehabilitating people so they come out as better people and better citizens.""

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

In the olden days it used to be, which is why they were called "penetentaries" (penetant = sorry for crimes they did, humble, and wanting to be better men).

For lesser offenders, prison can still be this way, although cuts in educational facilites and overcrowding make it hard. Serve time, learn job skills, come out a more producive member of society.


But when it comes to the worst of offenders, murderers, rapists and such, prison isn't seen as a machine by which society will rehabillitate the individual. It's seen as a toxic waste dump, or a quarrentine zone where the most socially malajusted individuals are locked up away from the day to day lives of the law abiding citizens. Prison for these people is the pit where they were spend the rest of their lives, so the rest of us don't have to deal with them.

reply

I am taiwanese and a relative of the taiwanese couple that was murdered in their own hotel. Although i am not a relative by blood but by marriage i did not personally know the elderly couple because i wasnt born yet. All i know is that every year i have to go to their grave site with my family and relatives to "by sun" which is to pray and burn incense for our dearly departed. The agony i see my family and relatives go thru makes me glad that i wasnt around when they were murdered, because of the anger i see in my uncles faces. Stanley williams might have rehabilitated for what he did, but he deserve whatever punishment the state of california gave him. He executed his victims and left them to rot. So what if he wrote a book about avoiding the gang life at the end of the day he founded the most dangerous gang and with his early influences he is still partially responsible for thousands of murders. I remembering watching something on tv with snoop dogg trying to protest against the execution of stanley williams and it just made me mad that someone who has an influence on children would go on tv to support a murderer. I know ppl wont believe that i am a member of the family or will think that my views on his death is inhumane, but in life we all have to suffer the consequences. Although some might find death an extreme consequences, if you kill someone you should be punished and no matter how much you have repented or how sorry you are you have to face the consequence. It just so happens stanley williams punishment was death. People should be glad that he died by lethal injection instead of taking a bullet in the abdomen and left to die. I appreciate his contribution to rehabilitate himself by writing books against gang violence, but in the end he had to face what he had coming. The families of victims will never be able to forget a murder in the family. In a sense Stanley has tainted mine and i am not even a blood relative.

reply

When you commit first degree murder, you lose your right to redeem yourself, or even live, in this world anymore.
You know, unless you're serving God in the Old Testament. Then you can rape and murder children all you want because the invisible man in the sky said so.


"I've been living on toxic waste for years, and I'm fine. Just ask my other heads!"

reply

If my *beep* lovely had been killed by him, i would be smart enough to know that the best thing to do is NOT TO ANSWER "KILL" by another "KILL"
Jail for life is the right thing.. and if he someway managed to do some goodthings for the young people with his books, etc., even better..

Stupid Barbarian americans

reply

People keep talking about all the hard work he did in prison by writing anti-gang pamphlets and keeping kids off the streets yet I've read that less than a thousand of them were even distributed.

And to wordtourmother42: Assuming you really are related to the innocent, hardworking victims murdered by the piece of scum known as Stanley Williams, my heart goes out to you and your family.

--
Youngblood II: Racki's Revenge

reply

"and if he someway managed to do some goodthings for the young people with his books, etc., even better.. "

His first book sold just over 300 copies and the second one just 2...wow, big impact.

reply