Favorite characters - Rome (2005) Discussion

[–] nyctc7 9 years ago

Obviously I like Pullo and Vorenus.

Julius Caesar--I really liked Ciarán Hinds performance. I liked Season 1 better than Season 2 and I think he was a big reason.

Posca--Here is a slave who through sheer hard work and his superior intellect has earned the respect of Caesar, and his freedom.

Timon--I would have liked to known how things worked out for him in Palestine. Even though he was a bit of a thug, he was intelligent and a good man, he knew how to be familiar with his "betters" but also smart enough to keep his place.

Mark Anthony--mostly because I liked James Purefoy's performance.

Young Augustus--I think Max Pirkis did a very good portraying someone who is both a kid, but clever beyond his years.

Atia--I liked her much better than the evil Servilia.

Brutus--mostly because I liked Tobias Menzies performance.

Honorable mention to my three favorite Rome "babes":

1. Gaia (Zuleikha Robinson)
2. Cleopatra (Lyndsey Marshal)
2. Vorena the elder (Coral Amiga)

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[–] shuwik 9 years ago

Atia--I liked her much better than the evil Servilia.

Thank you for opinion, but I strongly disagree with you. Yes, Servilia is evil. But is Atia not evil? I can't understand, I can't put it in my head why everybody hates Servilia. Can you explain me this, my friend?

Servilia is my favorite character then, now and forever.

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[–] nyctc7 9 years ago

Atia vs. Sevilia is of course a strong bone of contention--there are people on both sides.

Why do I prefer Atia?

In the series, Atia seems to start the war between them by arranging to have the obscene graffiti of Servilia and Caesar painted throughout the city. This was due to Marc Antony's statement that the rank and file soldier was starting to feel that Servilia was "unmanning" Caesar, that he no longer wanted to fight.

A nasty thing to do, what Atia did, but was it a crime punishable by death? It was Servilia that initiated the death wish. Atia merely wanted to embarrass Servilia, but it was Servilia who wanted a duel to the death. Her speech to Atia, in front of young Augustus, was pure evil. Atia, on the other hand, never wished death upon Servilia, until Servilia's assassination attempt.

Atia was more fun-loving than the old crow Servilia, who had no sense of humor at all.

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[–] shuwik 9 years ago

Thank you for your response. Can I continue? By our modern day standards what Atia did is not a crime punishable by death. But remember the story takes place in Ancient Rome.The pornographic graffiti in Rome was a public humiliation and cruel defamation. Caesar and Atia humiliated her publicly and in this time they all were very bother with their "honour". And revenge was a very noble cause in this time. So Servilia had moral right for revenge. In terms of ancient morality her actions were rightful and righteous and her response to the Julii family was not disproportionate. Yes, her speech was evil. But not much evil than Atia's order to kill her daughter's husband. For me has sense only one point: it was Atia who started the feud. So she is the most despicable character of the show. In my opinion Atia is villain and Servilia is a tragic hero.
And I don't find Atia funny but only vulgar.

Excuse me my awful English.
Greetings from Russia.

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[–] Nomad310 9 years ago

Servilia threw her own son under the bus by permitting Cassius to sign her son's name to treasonous missives.

Atia, on the others hand, did all the horrid things she did to both advance her family and protect her son. Moreover, Atia was successful, even at her own expense. No comparison between the two is possible.

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[–] nyctc7 9 years ago

^Thank You Nomad310

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[–] shuwik 9 years ago

Nomad310, thank you for your response. But i don't understand your point. So you think that end justifies the means? OK. But Servilia and Octavia's first husband didn't like those "means". Do you think they had no right to avenge them? Really? Honestly if I had been in Servilia's shoes, I would have felt that my son betrayed me. I don't justify her actions too but I continue to affirm that she was in her right to punish Caesar and Atia.
Btw, do you like Cersei Lannister from GoT? She is almost look-alike of Atia but surprisingly I don't know a lot of her fans. This fact intrigues me.

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[–] Nomad310 9 years ago

Consider the culture and its dangers, especially for the ruling class. All the slimy things Atia did, she did to protect and advance her son and, by extension, her family. Remember, it's the sons that counted, as Caesar's cold reaction to his daughter's death and the comment that her stillborn child was merely a girl and, therefore, of no consequence.

Servilia, on the other hand, acted not from wanting to protect her son, nor even from political conviction, but from jealousy and wanting vengeance against Caesar, who dumped her. Rather than protect her son, she placed him in grave danger for her own selfish ends.

If you can't see the difference between the two of them, then I can't help you understand any better than this explanation.

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[–] shuwik 9 years ago

Nomad310, thank you for your post but it seems that you don't understand my point. I saw the show and I remember all the facts you have described. I understand the difference in character's motivation and don't argue with your statements. But consider the antique culture. Was the revenge by all means in disposal not the part of its culture? Servilia was humiliated. For her it was the cruelest thing. So she did all those evil things to avenge her. By the way do you remember the story of Medea and Jason? This character did even more cruel things to avenge her in similar situation. And Medea goes unpunished and fully avenged after all her misdeeds because she was in her right to do it.
Also I don't understand one point. Imagine if you had been in Servilia's place after Caesar had dumped her and Atia had gloated about her rival's humiliation. What would have been your reaction? Remember it's not our modern world but the Ancient Rome. So you would have hold no grudge? Not have wanted to punish them, to made them suffer? Or would you have wanted to avenge you? And by what means? Personally I can't see how she can avenge herself in this situation without inevitably put her son in danger.

Thank you for your answer, my friend!

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[–] Nomad310 9 years ago

Shuwik, well, what it really comes down to are philosophical points. There are all kinds of human motivations. Do we judge them all the same? We don't. Some motivations are worth more, are more noble, than others. Some are more base. Yes, revenge was part of that culture. So was rape of slaves, but that doesn't mean we should admire it or excuse it. Even in Rome, although permitted, it wasn't admired.

Your argument seems to be that it was okay for Servilia to put her son at risk because she had a right to hold a grudge and to seek revenge. This speaks exactly to my point which is that one's duty as a mother, even in ancient Rome, should have trumped her baser need for revenge. That it didn't was downright unnatural.

As for the culture, Romans weren't especially concerned with a woman's honor unless it reflected badly on the male head of the family. In Servilia's case, Brutus WAS the male head of the family! That makes her actions all the more reprehensible, all the more dishonorable.

Your reference to the Jason and Medea story has no relevance. It's a mistake to compare the cultures of Ancient Greece and Republican Rome and find too many similarities. We tend to lump them together but they were very different. Moreover, even the original Greek myth does not imply that what Medea did was honorable, or even necessary.

And no, if I had been Servilia and been dumped by Caesar, the last thing I would have wanted would have been to dishonor myself further by acting out as she did and destroying my entire family in the doing.

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[–] nyctc7 9 years ago

I completely concur with Nomad310's posts.

I would just add that Servilia attached herself to a married man (Caesar), and she should have resigned herself when it came to an end. Her sudden "patriotism" was just her anger at being scorned, not out of any true genuine love of The Republic.

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[–] shuwik 9 years ago

I would just add that Servilia attached herself to a married man (Caesar), and she should have resigned herself when it came to an end.

nycct 7, I think in other circumstances she would have resigned herself. But not after campaign of graffiti defamation orchestrated by Atia. Remember she decided to seek revenge only after she had known who had ordered to draw graffiti. For me all is very simple: who started the feud is responsible for the consequences. And it was not Servilia who started.

Her sudden "patriotism" was just her anger at being scorned, not out of any true genuine love of The Republic.

I don't understand your point. I completely agree that only anger guided her actions. But Caesar also absolutely didn't care about Respublic.

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[–] rarmst0202 9 years ago

I think you guys are taking this way too seriously.

First, real history doesn't matter, all characters in the series have been so heavily modified from historical versions that they only bear a resemblance in name and a few broad broad details.

Second, so far as the series goes, they are pretty much all shown with virtues and vices. They all murder, torture, do all sorts of nasty stuff. So it's really hard to point to any as morally admirable in a modern sense.

So what we are left with, for the most part, is their entertainment value. I think a lot of people who say they preferred Atia over Servilia base this mostly on the fact that Atia was a lot more entertaining. She was scheming and cruel, as was Servilia, but at least Atia seemed to enjoy her scheming, derive some fun from life. Neither of the two were particularly good at it, their schemes often backfire, but Atia was definitely the more lively of the two.

Servilia comes across as a vindictive old bitch with few redeeming qualities. She ruthlessly exploits her son, pandering to his ego as one of the oldest patrician families, and to his sense of self-importance as defender of the republic. But she doesn't really give a damn about any of that, she is perfectly happy to be the tyrant Caesar's lover until the moment he scorns her. From then on, she's his implacable enemy, pressuring her son to murder him. And Atia's enemy, though that is more understandable since Atia caused the upset in the first place by paying someone to paint the obscene graffiti that started it all.

All that could be forgiveable, after all, none of these characters come across as saints. But the real problem is that there's nothing to offset any of that, nothing that evokes any sympathy or affection for her. Almost her whole screentime is devoted to bringing down Caesar, Atia and even Octavia, the girl she supposedly likes. Atia does her share of scheming too, but Atia isn't so obsessed about it, she takes time to enjoy life as well.

This is certainly not the fault of the actress who played Servilia. She did a great job given her role. And part of it is simply a result of the fact that Atia is given a hell of a lot more screen time than Servilia, which gives the viewers a chance to see much more of Atia.

But that's probably why more people seem to like Atia than Servilia.

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[–] shuwik 9 years ago

You are welcome! Thank you for your brilliant post. I have really enjoyed it and I personally think you are right in so many levels. Could I ask you some questions about some points?

Servilia comes across as a vindictive old bitch with few redeeming qualities

Granted. And Atia comes across as a bitchy whore with few redeeming qualities. Right? Please explain me what redeeming qualities has Atia. I really can't understand it. May be she is more entertaining but it is can be seen as "redeeming quality"? I really want to know your opinion, my friend.

But the real problem is that there's nothing to offset any of that, nothing that evokes any sympathy or affection for her.

Nothing that evokes any sympathy or affection for her? Really? And I have a lot of sympathy for her. You know why? Because initially she was good and noble woman. She didn't try to hurt or ruin anyone. And she didn't hate anyone. It was Atia who launched the hatred and set in motion all the stuff. And for me it's clear: who started first is responsible for the consequences. Atia and Caesar were both cruel to Servilia. They created themself a monster from the woman who initially was faithful and loyal to them. Servilia suffered cruelly. So I feel sorry for her from the begining to the end. And I absolutely have no sympathy for Caesar and Atia. Atia was behind all this tragedy and Servilia was initially her victim. Servilia by all means tried to avenge her. All that she did she did in return. For me this is the main difference between those equally bad women.

But for me the major problem is the way how Servilia's character was presented. It's obviously that the authors didn't love her and didn't want to make audience root for her. Yes I like her but it clearly goes against author's wish. That's why they prefered to kill Servilia in the end. And I personally think it's completely unfair. I don't like the whole show because of how it ended.

Thank you for your post one more time. Forgive me my awful English. Greetings from Russia!

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[–] rarmst0202 9 years ago

And I have a lot of sympathy for her. You know why? Because initially she was good and noble woman. She didn't try to hurt or ruin anyone. And she didn't hate anyone.

Initially, she may have been. But in the end, she does a lot of evil things. She has a man tortured to death to get information out of him. She destroys Vorenus by telling him about his wife's infidelity. As a result, his wife kills herself. None of these people did any harm to Servilia, but they suffer through Servilia's deliberate actions.

Sure, you can say she didn't initiate it, Atia started it by paying someone to paint obscene graffiti. But all that amounts to is slander. When did torture and murder become appropriate responses to slander? She sacrifices her own son, not because of any love for Rome or the Republic, but because of her own personal desire for revenge.

In short, I don't find Servilia a sympathetic character, and from reading this board, neither do a lot of other people.

Please explain me what redeeming qualities has Atia. I really can't understand it. May be she is more entertaining but it is can be seen as "redeeming quality"?

Right. Redeeming not to her character, but to the viewer who is passing judgment on a TV show. Characterwise, most people in the series are scum, one way or another. The thing being redeemed here is not their character, but my time as the viewer. And in that respect, Atia is more entertaining, and I enjoyed her screen presence more because of it.

But for me the major problem is the way how Servilia's character was presented. It's obviously that the authors didn't love her and didn't want to make audience root for her. Yes I like her but it clearly goes against author's wish. That's why they prefered to kill Servilia in the end. And I personally think it's completely unfair. I don't like the whole show because of how it ended.

I think you may be taking these fictional characters way too seriously. Of course the authors didn't "love her". An author who falls in love with his characters is a bad author. The authors are presenting a STORY, the story is the main thing, not the characters. This isn't a biopic. The characters exist to carry the story forward. Each has his or her own part in telling the story. Characters should be interesting, which most of them are. They do not need to be good or virtuous. When you're telling a story about 2,000 years ago, nobody will be "good" in a modern sense. They had a very different philosophy, very different moral standards. I don't see any point in trying to praise or denigrate them based on modern standards. My only concern is that they not be boring, that they have some personality and individuality so they seem like real people, not cookie cutter cartoons. I think pretty much all the characters in this series were interesting, including Servilia.

That doesn't mean I can't find some of them more enjoyable than others. I found Atia more enjoyable. Of course this is because of how the writers wrote her role. And why shouldn't they? Why should they "love Servilia" and write the story to present her in the best light? She's not real, she's fake like everyone else. She's just a means to tell a story.

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[–] shuwik 9 years ago

rarmst0202, my friend. Excuse me for not have replied you earlier. Can I continue our conversation?

Initially, she may have been. But in the end, she does a lot of evil things.

I don't argue with you about her evil actions. Not at all. But I can't understand one point. Servilia has been gentle and kind in the beginning. As long as the show progresses she slowly becomes as evil and cruel as people she wants to destroy. And Atia is cruel and evil from day one. She is evil bitch throughout she show. I can not find her any redeeming quality. That is why I strongly prefer Servilia to Atia.

She has a man tortured to death to get information out of him.

Really? Could you remind me this episode? If I remember correctly, it was Atia who did it.

She destroys Vorenus by telling him about his wife's infidelity. As a result, his wife kills herself.

Right. But she only revealed him the truth. She didn't invent anything. Servilia didn't ruin Vorenus life deliberately. She wanted only remove him from Ceasar during assassination. The death of Niobe was not her goal. It was a side effect, nobody knew how a situation would have turned. In fact what she did is absolutely equal of Atia's order to paint mural graffitti. I see no difference between those actions. In both situations it was intervention in some other's life. It's like to give a gun to someone. You did it but you don't know how this person will use it. In both situations the events unfolded in the most horrible way. But please understand, I don't justify Servilia's actions in any way. I can't understand why people justify Atia's actions.

But all that amounts to is slander. When did torture and murder become appropriate responses to slander?

She (not me!) saw the murder as appropriate response to slander, since Caesar and Atia humiliated her in front of all city. Do you think Servilia in the beginning deserved it? And yes, it was Atia who initiated all this. She is the most evil person in the show and she goes unpunished. I can not forgive this mistake to the author.

She sacrifices her own son, not because of any love for Rome or the Republic, but because of her own personal desire for revenge.

Granted. Through of course it was not her final goal, but she is guilty in her son's tragedy. But let's see Atia's actions: she sent her only son on a dangerous mission to deliver a horse, to curry favor with Caesar, murdered her daughter's husband, broke up Servillia's affair with Ceasar, had Servillia attacked in the street, kidnapped and tortured Servillia, and was going to have her face cut off, extorted money from friends of Pompey when it looked like he was going to lose the war, pimped out her own daughter to Pompey to protect her own holdings, ordered to kill all Jocasta's family (include children) and rape Jocasta. Do you really think that those actions are less cruel then Servilia's actions? I don't. I see only one difference between them. Atia started the feud and Servilia acted in return.

None of these people did any harm to Servilia, but they suffer through Servilia's deliberate actions.

Exactly like Octavia's husband, Servilia, Jocasta's family did no harm to Atia but became her victims.

In short, I don't find Servilia a sympathetic character,

Me too. But I don't see her enemies Caesar and Atia as sympathetic characters neither. I find them even more despicable than Servilia.

I think you may be taking these fictional characters way too seriously.

Excuse me, my friend, but it seems you completely missed my point. I fully understand that we talk about fictional characters that have nothing to do with the real people. But do you think creators of the show decide random who of the fictional characters must die in the end? I don't think so. On the contrary as I've already mentionned the way show ended is my main grudge about the production. Atia is alive and she herself considers herself a winner. And in the scene with Livia she is presented like a ultimate winner. And why? Yes, she ruined lives of many people, but all her schemes backfired. She is a schemer and killer but not very successful and clever one. Why the authors consider her is decent to be winner? And real Atia was dead long before the Octavian's victory! The show raped history TOTALLY. Even with all this fiction and liberties with facts it's Servilia who must be a winner. How about another story's end? Atia was killed due to Servilia's machinations. Servilia is totally avenged but she lost her beloved son. She has nothing to live for because she lost all she had loved. Lonely and miserable she retired to the villa of one of Cicero's friend to wait a death.This would have been a fair and historically correct final. Why did they choose another one?

In fact I could wholeheartedly accept those variants of the final:
1) Atia is killed due to Servilia's machinations. Servilia is completely avenged but once her revenge is accomplished, she has nothing to live for. After she had lost her beloved son, lonely, miserable and broken old woman, Servilia retired to a remote villa to wait her death and make her peace with gods.
2) Atia is killed, Servillia is killed. No winner in this game.
3) Atia is alive, Servilia is alive. No winner in this game.

All those variants are fair and righteous but I strongly prefer the first one. Because somehow it's historical correct (Atia was dead long before Octavian's victory, Servilia outlived most of the other characters and died in the villa of one of Cicero's friend apparently from natural causes). And especially I want this end because in my opinion it's fair and just. It's Atia started the feud, she ruined and broke the life of Servilia She did it because of her ambitions, greed and I guess some envy mixed with jealousy. So it's absolutely unfair to choose the stupid final where she is presented like an ultimate winner.

And why did they choose it? I guess they wanted to avenge Caesar's death. But what about the death of Octavia's estranged husband? Didn't they think this horrible crime also must be avenged by the death of the person who organized it? And btw Glabius was kind and honest man while Caesar was corrupted and manipulative dictator. So I can not understand for what purpose they needed this final. It's like they speak to me like that: "All that Atia have done is perfectly normal. It's normal to kill people and ruin the life/publicly humiliate the person who was kind and gentle to you. And Servilia got that she deserved. Because to do all the same in return it's not right". So that this kind of logic that I can not accept. In fact I have grudge not for the fictional character but for the real person who created this script. So here is the point. I hope you'll understand me right.

Once again I beg you excuse me for my terrible English.

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[–] shuwik 9 years ago

There are all kinds of human motivations. Do we judge them all the same? We don't. Some motivations are worth more, are more noble, than others. Some are more base. Yes, revenge was part of that culture. So was rape of slaves, but that doesn't mean we should admire it or excuse it. Even in Rome, although permitted, it wasn't admired.

Nomad310, thank you for your answer. So you think revenge is not noble motivation? Yes, it really comes down to are philosophical points that have little to do with the show, but I personally can't wholeheartedly agree with it. And I think we should not admire or excuse Atia's motivation too. Bad action is always bad action. And I don't care about motivation but only about the victims of her "noble" actions like Servilia or Octavia's first husband.

Your argument seems to be that it was okay for Servilia to put her son at risk because she had a right to hold a grudge and to seek revenge.

No, I don't think it was OK. I only think it was inevitable if she wanted to avenge her. And I absolutely believe she was in her right to seek revenge. I have no sympathy to Caesar and Atia. I gloated when Caesar was assassinated due Servilia's machinations. I hated this cruel hypocrite after what he had done to her.

As for the culture, Romans weren't especially concerned with a woman's honor unless it reflected badly on the male head of the family.

Set aside the show, how about legendary Lucretia? As I remember correctly she was obsessionally concerned with her honor, didn't she?

Moreover, even the original Greek myth does not imply that what Medea did was honorable, or even necessary.

The original myth does not imply any moral judgement at all. It's only a story with absolutely cruel and unprovoked according to modern day standards actions. And this story does not reprove no glorify what Medea had done. My point was that the authors of the show wanted to punish Servilia for less cruel actions than Medea's in absolutely similar situation of scorned woman. Because authors clearly reproved Servilia's character. And I see they both not as villains but as a tragic characters. For me it's something very different.

And no, if I had been Servilia and been dumped by Caesar, the last thing I would have wanted would have been to dishonor myself further by acting out as she did and destroying my entire family in the doing.

Oh, my God. Where did she dishonored her by her actions? I simply don't see it. She slowly became as cruel as Caesar and Atia but you don't see their actions as dishonorable. For me they are all bad and despicable persons. But for Servilia I have some pity and for her enemies I have no sympathy at all.

As for me at Servilia's place I would have found another way to destroy Caesar. I would have prefered to ruin his career, to publicly humiliate him. And I would have found the way, believe me! Remember first she wanted only to find out the truth about his illness. For what purpose? I think she would use it to set in motion a campaign of defamation just like Atia did. Imagine: everybody reads on every street corner about Caesar's Illness. His career will be ruined for sure. And he dumped her because of it. So she lost the man she loved all her life and he will lose something he loves the best: his power. Do you think it would have been the best revenge? At least I would have proceeded this way. Yes, my frien I am very vindictive person. That's why all my sympathy belongs to Servilia.

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[–] Petrolieguest 9 years ago

Mark Antony of course

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[–] merej 9 years ago

and we got a winner!

followed by Pullo, Atia, Caesar, Cicero, Cato, Brutus, and the Newsreader - Roman bread for Roman citizens!😀

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[–] rantingraj 9 years ago

Yeah... one of the best no doubt. Only problem is he isn't always at his best in the show but he sure did have his moments and they were great to watch indeed.

Gauis Ceaser was also nice to watch till he lasted...

and among the women, Octavia was my favorite beginning to end...

(hate that bitch Servillia who's chiefly responsible for Ceasers and her own son Brutus's death. Reasoning:- She knew she had already become an old hag as she's shown doubting weather she's still good looking enough to be admired by Ceaser. Ceaser comes to town and does requite her love. But he clearly has a WHOLE LOT on his plate at the time in the series... entering rome as a 'tyrant', coming war, Rome itself, his rival Pompei, his soldiers etc etc and when the affair with servillia becomes an embarrassment for him, [due to Atia] he does the only reasonable thing to do which is to end the affair, but to Servillia none of Ceasers other problems matter and all the grafity on the walls isn't a problem either as she says to Ceaser himself when he comes to dump her, she just wants the affair to go on and hates that He spurned her. Just because she's dumped as a mistress, she starts a chain of events which ultimately causes the death of one of Rome's great Generals who's also a visionary and is mostly interested in setting the republic on the right path even if he has to use some ill means for that noble end and assume the role of a dictator for life [at least thats how the show seemed to depict him])

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[–] iza-henn 9 years ago

'cause Mark Antony is not defeated ( "they love me! ")and closely followed by the other favourite Marks that marked our history: M. Tullius Cicero, M.Vipsanius Agrippa and even this tragic traitor, M. Iunius Brutus.
Now imagine the Newsreader reading the scores ...

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[–] Yirone 9 years ago

I agree with your list except for Atia. She's too cruel to my liking. (and also pretty pathetic at times, though she can be endearing)

Sometimes, the best answer is a more interesting question.

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[–] AlexeiKaramazov 9 years ago

Lots of great characters, but Atia was the best for me. She was fun, hilarious, entertaining, sexy, just a magnetic presence.

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[–] 9 years ago

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[–] merej 9 years ago

evil, cruel and maniuplative in a hilariously funny and magneticly entertaining not to mention steaming-hot sexy manner 😀

there better be coffee

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[–] 9 years ago

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[–] merej 9 years ago

bit of a wimp that guy, in fairness

there better be coffee

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[–] 9 years ago

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[–] merej 9 years ago

By the standards of the time. A Roman adult was supposed to be able to defend himself. That guy was useless.

there better be coffee

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[–] 9 years ago

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[–] merej 9 years ago

Nothing wrong with victim blaming if that victim couldn't be bothered to take adequate measures to protect themselves. If you drive without buckling up and your brains end up scattered across the windscreen you got nobody to blame but yourself.

Also applying your modern standards of what's acceptable to ancient times is ludicrous. Do you blame all the protagonists of the series for keeping slaves? Seriously?

there better be coffee

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[–] 9 years ago

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[–] merej 9 years ago

You don't like people who keep slaves, watch a program set in ancient Rome, and complain that the characters are unlikeable. That's a bit like watching porn and being put off by all that scandalous nudity.

Also there was no highway code in ancient Rome that would prevent people from running you off the street. You decide to drive under these circumstances, you better are prepared for accidents. Come to think of it that's very similar to what driving in Rome is like these days, minus all them irritating scooters.

Now this is a message board for people to express their opinions which I assure you does not take any audacity whatsoever - just a keyboard and a trusty internet provider. For a person of superior ethics and morals you seem terribly close to turning a pleasant discussion into an ad hominem attack. Let's keep this civil, shall we?

there better be coffee

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[–] 9 years ago

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[–] ScorpionTDC 8 years ago

She's a villain. Do you expect cuddly and kittens?

Death Awaits (Horror forum)
http://w11.zetaboards.com/Death_Awaits/index/

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[–] 8 years ago

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[–] ScorpionTDC 8 years ago

The show doesn't treat her as a villain,

.... Seriously? She's definitely comic relief, but, say, murdering her daughter's husband is obviously meant to be evil. She's also clearly inspired from Livia from I, Claudius (a villain) and the whole series ends with her villainous schemes more or less biting her in the ass as she gets to live a life of misrery

As for viewers, most viewers don't treat Dany as anything less than ZOMG QUEEN! Doesn't mean it's how she's portrayed. But I mostly see the love-to-hate love for Atia. The closest to being on her side people come is rooting for her over Servilia, who's also a heartless bitch. Arguably moreso

Death Awaits (Horror forum)
http://w11.zetaboards.com/Death_Awaits/index/

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[–] neoartz237 9 years ago

1) Mark Anthony
2) Julius Caesar
3) Young Octavian
4) Janius Brutus
5) Lucious Vorenus
6) Titus Pullo

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[–] sandman_exe 9 years ago

Titus Pullo
Lucius Vorenus
Marc Antony
Brutus
Newsreader

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[–] Maddyclassicfilms 9 years ago

Antony
Pullo
Vorenus
Cicero
Atia

Go to bed Frank or this is going to get ugly .

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[–] Nomad310 9 years ago

Atia
Octavian season 1
Pullo
Antony
Vorenus
Cato
Brutus

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[–] 9 years ago

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[–] AlexeiKaramazov 9 years ago

Aww, cute, a GoT board devotee figured out how to watch HBO shows earlier than 2010.

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[–] 9 years ago

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[–] merej 9 years ago

You are totally entitled to your opinion of yourse.

What I don't understand though is how people who do not get a program or film present their inability to relate like a batch of honour, when it's really them who are losing out.

there better be coffee

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[–] 9 years ago

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[–] merej 9 years ago

Glad you spotted the misspelling before it got me in real trouble.

As for likeable character traits: Ceasar's intelligence, Atia's vim, vigour, and lust for life, Antony's loyalty, the same for Pullo, Brutus' good intentions (I know that one's a bit lame but he tries so hard to do the right thing, poor dear), Posca's wit, Cicero's - what shall we call it - political flexibility?... I don't really care for Octavian and Vorenus either tbh, and Octavia is a bit of a cow. You are right, pretty much all the characters in Rome are flawed, though not many of them are beyond redemption. Also it's their flaws that make them interesting and believable imho.

But then, if it's not for you, it's not for you. I guess we will both have to live with that.

there better be coffee

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