Overall "Natural City" is fine and nice sc fi movie. But it suffers from very common problem in Korean cinema: sentimentality and bad music (pompous orchestra music and awful pop songs). The ending was terrible. Its not the first Korean movie I notice that problems. Why Koreans so like sentimentality and have bad taste in music when doing movies, why they can't get over this *beep*?
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I found it difficult to care about any of the characters in Natural City, so I didn't find it sentimental in the least. (I didn't even notice the music, so it couldn't have been that bad.)
"R," the soldier fighting to save the replicant he loves is too much of a self-involved, reckless arse to root for. The dying replicant is practically a vegetable, so her expiration doesn't seem tragic (especially since the thing she misses most is what she was programmed to do -- exotic dancing; this made her too much of an automaton for me). The main good guys (Cyon, Noma) are too generic and dull to make an impression.
The movie has style but no real personality. I didn't feel there was any strong theme or message or anything to justify the time I spent watching it. And it's about 30 minutes too long.
I just found it overall to be a hollow viewing experience. It looks good, but it doesn't have a soul.
Secret Skull that is exactly it! You should post that same exact comment (highlight it all then hit cntrl C, and post it with cntrl V) as your review of the film. You hit all the right notes and that is precisely what is wrong with this could've been great flick! If it had a good story that is!
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my feelings exactly
shareYou haven't answered my question. You just have written your opinion about movie, but didn't pluged into my question at all. You can make love story without being sugar-like sentimental and you can have better taste in music. I've noticed those peculiaritys in more than one and two Korean movies, so I wonder if it is common for all Korean nation to be sentimental and like bad music, or just its trend of Korean filmakers?
sharesee this thread:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0294252/board/thread/33520720
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you can't read English again or what? I'm not stating, I'm wondering (asking).
sharejudantis_vaizdas
> you can't read English again or what?
These racist comments are hilarious because you seem to be the one who is linguistically challenged. First, read your Subject Heading, "what is Korean problem?" A proper phrasing would be, "What is the Korean problem?"
Then you wrote, "you can't read English again or what?" That has multiple problems, including one that any elementary school student recognizes: Capitalization.
I've never criticized users for their linguistic skills before but you had the gall to question someone on his/her English proficiency when in fact, it was you who was wrong.
> I'm not stating, I'm wondering (asking)
Wrong. You asked the question by STATING (aka assuming) that your premises are true. Namely, that over-sentimentality and "bad music" are common in Korean films. I don't see a lot of people defending you or even answering your question, which suggests that few agree with you.
Here's a suggestion: If you truly want answers and meaningful conversations, be less obnoxious and racist.
Heres my suggestion... lighten the hell up and stop nitpicking. Korean cinema isn't great... how is that racist? That's like saying you hate Hollywood movies and me saying "oh, you're racist against white people." But wow wow wow... NO ONE could EVER be racist against whites! Lighten up, stop being a whiney bitch, and if someone doesn't like a nationalities cinema, stop trying to censor them by saying it's "racist." Pig.
P.S. How was my capitalization and grammar, tool?
> lighten the hell up and stop nitpicking
Nitpicking? The words were plain and clear. I didn't have to go scavenging for details. Just because you didn't read the same message into his post, isn't it arrogant to assume that those who read otherwise were nitpicking? Again, you're assuming that there is a universal yardstick with which one should interpret something. And when one doesn't conform to that standard, s/he is nitpicking. Show me that yardstick. I certainly am not arrogant enough to say that you're insensitive just because you don't conform to my standards.
> Korean cinema isn't great
QUOTE where ANYONE in this discussion said that it was. You have no point there.
Read the original post again. Unlike you, I'll have the courtesy to quote:
Read the subject heading: "what is Korean problem?"
Does that heading say anything about "Korean cinema isn't great"? It plainly says that there is some sort of national problem. Was it so hard to say, "Why the pompous music?"
Then this little charmer:
"Why Koreans so like sentimentality and have bad taste in music when doing movies, why they can't get over this *beep*?"
Again, what is the yardstick for "bad taste in music"? When one megalomaniacally uses one's own esthetics as a cultural yardstick, yes, I think that's ethnocentric and racist. And note that the writer never gave details. When you denigrate a whole culture, at least give some examples.
And why denigrate all Koreans? Why not limit the comment to Korean directors?
> NO ONE could EVER be racist against whites!
I love how you rant against points that I never made. Tell me where I stated -- or implied -- that racism can't apply to any culture. Quote, please.
> stop being a whiney bitch
Wow, that's sure a good argument. So people who disagree with you are whiney bitches. Not just whiney, but bitches as well. Pretty pathetic.
> stop trying to censor them by saying it's "racist." Pig.
Censor? Look up the definition and show me where there was censorship. Indeed, I eagerly awaited the original writer's response. Seriously, look it up. There are many dictionaries online.
> P.S. How was my capitalization and grammar, tool?
There were a few problems, with the most glaring being "a nationalities cinema." I believe you meant to write "a nationality's cinema." (of course, you'll probably edit your post to invalidate this point)
As for calling me "pig" and "tool," are you really that childish? Is it so hard for you to make your points without insults? It would seem so.
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People aren't directly answering your question in kindness to you. Your premises are flawed, so your "question" makes you sound inexperienced and solipsistic.
So, the answer to your question is no, they will never get over this *beep* because there is nothing to get over.
judantis_vaizdas
> You haven't answered my question. ... You can make love story without
> being sugar-like sentimental and you can have better taste in music.
You arrogantly assume that you wrote a question worth answering. Rather than asking IF your generalizations are valid, you ASSUMED that it is so without listing evidence, or the credentials to make such sweeping generalizations.
I'm not Korean, but have watched a fair amount of Asian and Korean movies and TV dramas (subtitled) because I dated a Korean. I completely disagree with your assessment, especially the point about the music. I find the music on par with Hollywood productions.
By arrogantly using terms like "bad music," you assume that there is a universal yardstick. And if there is, why don't you refer me to such an authority?
A valid question is "Do all Korean movies have such orchestral music?" or "Why is there such a reliance in pop songs?" A racist meaningless question is "if it is common for all Korean nation to be sentimental and like bad music." And that's exactly what you asked.
Even your Subject Heading is racist, "what is Korean problem?" -- generalizing your opinion of Korean filmmakers to all of Korea. You could have written, "What is the problem with Korean filmmakers?" And I found it ironic that you asked another person if s/he can read English when your subject heading is in POOR English.
Basically, your question is non-sensical and not worth answering.
I wonder if it is common for all Korean nation to be sentimental and like bad music, or just its trend of Korean filmakers?
It reminds me of the apparent problem with (some?) Japanese movies (see Casshern). Too much pathos, again and again, which bogs down the movie. I'm still trying to find an Asian movie I could like without too many reservations (any suggestions?).
This movie also had "Japanese giggliness" embodied in Dr. Giro, which is another thing I hate.
It's a pity, because the foundations of many of these movies are promising.
watch "wonderful days" best korean flick ever! and Versus is sweet japanese movie sure its a little rediculous sometimes but its fun to watch.
shareWill do. I was planning on watching Versus but didn't do it yet. Wonderful Days/Blue Sky - added to my list.
(Another one I didn't like recently, although not due to over-pathos: Oldboy.)
I have no problem understanding the OP shooting from the hip with his question/musing about Korean films. I watched because I am a Sci-Fi nerd. I wanted to see what influences I could pick out and there were some engaging visual elements. NOW, I will start first with the MUSIC. YUCK-O. Man, I thought this was awful music. I listen to lots of industrial music and am used to boring techno in many Sci-Fi films. But this was like really icky-poo to my Sci-Fi sensibilities. I know that there are clear comparison of this movie to Blade Runner. I saw a CD-pack of the Blade Runner score by Vangelis sell recently for over 200 US$. well??? That is because it is bloody GOOD music! So, regarding the sentimentality. Does anyone speculate as to WHAT this label refers to? The fortune-teller girl's story seemed a bit disconnected. I found it empty rather than sentimental. Please illuminate me. What sentimental elements bothered you.
share(((sorry))) I just had to re-post and mention the music of Rubber's Lover which is a Japanese Film. This is proper sci-fi music if you want my opinion. I have not finished watching but the music at about the 16:00 mark is simply blistering. :P
shareWatch " Old Boy" and then come back and apologize for your idiotic clueless blabber
"A fundie to me would be anyone who believes in a literal interpretation of the bible"
I second that. Oldboy is a top film with one of the best musical scores to accompany it. So if you want to judge Korean films, how about watching that then getting back to us?
Also, for those of you who believe Asian cinema is not that good, I suggest you do more research and watch a few more films before stating something so ridiculous. For one, the majority of Hollywood's horror films made now a days are remakes of Japanese horror, regardless if Hollywood takes something that worked fine in its original version and messes it up in the process. Examples: The Eye, Grudge, Ring...etc etc.
Another good example of a remake not as good as the original asian version, not in the horror genre, would be "The Departed", remake of "Infernal Affairs" where once again the original was 10 times better than the remake.
A suggestion for a lot of people here: Do some research and try to make your point with facts and without the use of insults. Insults make people assume that you are either a 12 year old with no point to make, or even worse an adult with the mind of a 12 year old and not capable of making a point.
"Another good example of a remake not as good as the original asian version, not in the horror genre, would be "The Departed", remake of "Infernal Affairs" where once again the original was 10 times better than the remake."
Opinions vary on that.
A reccurring theme on these Asian film threads are how superior they all are to western movies. And we know that's not the case.
Why do asians continually feel the need to prove themselves superior to westerners? Talk about 'inferiority complex'.
I've seen some good asian movies but not many. When they can make movies of the calibre of say 'The Godfather' 'Alien', 'Saving Private Ryan' 'The Shawshank Redemption' etc then I'll sit up and pay attention.
And the constant cries of 'racism' whenever westerner criticize asians is just laughable. Like blacks playing the race card.
I've lived in the far east (Japan, Korea, Thailand) and their cultures are far more xenophobic with ingrained racism, than anything in the west.
What makes you think that Asians "feel the need to prove themselves superior to westerners"? I guess most people that are claiming that here on the boards are Westerners, too.
I usually prefer Asian movies to Western movies, especially when it comes down to your list. But it's all about taste.
Oh, by the way, this one - Natural City - was very lousy.
In response to your question regarding the sentimentality in Korean movies, it is essentially a staple. It is related to a number of cultural aspects that range from the story structures in traditional Korean p'ansori, to the Japanese influence of Shinp'a that was introduced to Korea during the colonization of Korea by Japan during the formative years of the Korean film industry. Actually, both of these influences are essentially types of melodramas, which is by far the most influential form of story telling within Korea.
Much of the sentimentality in Korean film can also be attributed to the idea of han. Han is essentially a self-pitying cathartic sensibility in relation to the problems that Koreans experience. Usually this ideal is metaphorically depicted as a woman dressed in white that represents the collective difficult experiences of of all Koreans. In Natural City Ria is the depiction of the woman in white lamenting over the injustice of the life of a cyborg, which in turn is meant to be metaphorically analogous to the injustices that the Korean people have endured. When this term is applied to the Korean masses it is known as minjung.
OP: pwnd
"Quick, extra nails! I'm falling over."
J.C: The best-off
Wow as opposed to the absolutely brilliant music from That Hollywood uses and sentimentality? Look at all the so called summer or big block buster films from the US, don't they drown in sentimentality?
shareWow as opposed to the absolutely brilliant music from That Hollywood uses and sentimentality? Look at all the so called summer or big block buster films from the US, don't they drown in sentimentality?
Actually my opinion differs from y'all, I loved the music in this movie, I believe it really set the tone and brought out emotions even though it was a bit difficult since the character development wasn't done too well. The music in this was probably one of the things that really stood out for me and I felt it really made all the difference for this specific movie. Its funny how different our tastes are but being Korean, I guess I'm more biased to sad, melodramatic music.
sharethey may say the same thing about American movies, just there taste cant chnage just take it in for what it is
shareI think oldboy is an excellent example. In the opening scene, the music backing the part where he is holding the would be suicide/jumper by the necktie - absolutely brilliant.
In terms of sentimentality - joint security area might be accused of this, but I'd suggest that it actually 'works' on that level. I'm about as cynical as one could get, but JSA certainly got to me.
Whilst those probably represent two of the best of the internationally known Korean films, you might then look at something like Arahan, which has its good and bad stuff. Some of it dragged, some of it seemed not to know where it was thematically, but I think the fight scene in the restaurant had really decent backing music. not over the top, just a nice fast paced compliment to the action.
Now 'natural city' - I've just watched it, and there's probably (in my opinion) some truth to the suggestion it's overly sentimental and so forth. It's fair to say it's not exactly my favourite Korean film.
Can we all just keep on track and on topic about the film. I'm Australian and there's plenty of locally made films I love, and some that make me cringe, but I can separate any criticism of an Australian film from racial or cultural intolerance.
John McKenzie
p.s. - I always seem to get the reply in the wrong place in the thread, apologies if this post is one of them!
This movie is far superior to anything Hollywood has put out since The Matrix. If you feel it is too sentimental or as the other poster didn't sympathize or identify with the characters the problem is with you, not with Korean film makers who actually know how to pace a movie and give the viewer a developing exposition of its characters.
shareI don't want to get caught up in this little war you all got going here, but I'm going to have to side on the OP (even if his English is perfect). I'm somewhat of a movie addict, 3000+ American DVD Movies archived, 600+ Chinese, 300 from random other countries, and 400+ and growing Korean DVD's, as I'm on a Korean movie trip at the moment. Point is, I've seen a LOT of movies (and thats an understatement), and not just American, but from almost every country, ESPECIALLY Korea's.
All in all, Korean movies are excellent, it's probably the only country I think consistently pumps out quality movies on par with America. However, one draw back I do frequently see in many of the movies (not ALL, but I'd say 75%) is the over use of dramatic musical scores and long drawn out sentimental scenes. This seems to be a basic element of Korean movies, as if the directors learned it in film school. This isn't always bad, and sometimes is just what the movie needs, the directors are able to do it perfectly - as someone mentioned, Old Boy, for example - but the majority of the time I find it over used, eventually dulling or slowing down the pace of an otherwise great movie. That said, a lot of Korean movies are still awesome. Movies from every country have their flaws.
I was thinking the same about American movies.
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