MovieChat Forums > Layer Cake (2005) Discussion > Viva La Madness problem...

Viva La Madness problem...

posted 11 years ago by Brando_Sinatra
17 replies | jump to latest

Please allow me to set the scene. I've never read Layer Cake (although I will be in the near future). I first saw Layer Cake when it came out in 2004, I was in my final year at school at the time, just about to start sixth form (16 Years old). At that point I didn't care much for reading at all, I had enough of it in English lessons for my GCSE's! But ever since watching it, it has been my favourite British film ever made, and will continue to be so. I don't know why but it gripped me from the off, I've seen Alfie, Get Carter etc. But Layer Cake just holds a special place in my heart; anyway the point I'm trying to make is, as a movie-watcher first and reader second, XXXX will always be Daniel Craig for me.

I've just started Viva La Madness, which is tremendous so far, but the way that Connolly has written it I can't picture DC as the main character. Craig is well spoken, without an accent if you will, whereas the character in the book is very cockney - more relatable to the manner in which The Duke spoke in the first film. Did he also speak like this in the first novel? Did they just decide to re-imagine the aura of XXXX for the film?

It's not a huge problem, I'm just wondering if they decided to go with a different view of him for the film as opposed to the book as it's taken me a little by surprise. Cheers all!

[–] LTUM 11 years ago

i didn't catch that in viva la madness. i will thumb back thru the pages.

i do recall sonny giving XXXX a hard time about using bigger, 'educated' words. i don't recall any accented dialogue from XXXX, but i trust you if you say it's there. maybe damocles has some thoughts on this?

"rage to exist..." http://tinyurl.com/c9ush3z

[–] Brando_Sinatra 11 years ago

Flick back to Chapter two, I think, where he first speaks to Sonny in the hotel room. It's very cockney.

[–] LTUM 11 years ago

ah. okay. i recall mention in VLm somewhere how XXXX had originally come from 'that' background, and had upward mobilised himself ove rthe years. like, when he recognised the shooter kid on the street. i guess in connolly's mind that all still fits together seamlessly, from the first book till now.

though i agree that it's hard to ever see craig speaking that way

i get what you mean

"rage to exist..." http://tinyurl.com/c9ush3z

[–] Brando_Sinatra 11 years ago

He just wouldn't lol. He isn't from the East-end of london. He's from a place called 'The Wirral' which is the other side of the river Mersey. It's right next to Liverpool. If you're aware of the regions of England you'll know that these two places couldn't be further from each other in terms of accent, I know, I'm from and live in Liverpool!

[–] LTUM 11 years ago

you mean craig, not XXXX.

i guess casting craig was a judgement call on vaughn's part. like you said it only affects the impression of those who read the book after seeing the film. i did that too, so i get what you are saying

"rage to exist..." http://tinyurl.com/c9ush3z

[–] LTUM 11 years ago

i am currently rereading it now. front to back. it's true i don't picture craig as i read it

but then again, the first book wasn't really craig, either. they said in the commentary that much delliberation was had over what accent craig should use, which, the fact that they wrestled over this lends total credence to your viewpoint. good one. it means they were at least considering it because they thought it should be that way. but in the end, he said, they decided for craig to speak it straight..... the way he'd do if he was TRYING to blend into the different strata.

if anything else occurs to me as i reread the book, i will post back here.

but no, for the record i don't hear craig's voice either as i read.

"rage to exist..." http://tinyurl.com/c9ush3z

[–] kbelyshev-60-5582 11 years ago

i have no problem with DC's performance at all. layer cake was a different, and a strange adaptation for the kind of novel that it was. the novel really enjoyed its own verbal play.the movie was more conventional in terms of direction--but boy did vaughn pull it off. it was goodfellas with cuaron's camera work. but smoooth. viva is more verbally restrained- connolly is more sure of his own story. i can see DC as the main character more in viva than layer cake, actually. i just don't think it could be the same kind of movie as layer cake. i couldn't tell you what kind it could be- not by any example of what i've seen anyway. to me dc fits XXXX- or our man- if you please- because he don't talk much. he knows when to, but he also knows when to shut the *beep* up. and that, is what made me love the bastard

[–] LTUM 11 years ago

yeah i too see the film and book as totally separate.

i think vaughn brought so much style into the film that it's kindof its own animal, rather than a real adaptation proper.

after seeing the film, for one who read the book before or after, seems it would be hard to not love this film. it just so damn.....

good!!

"rage to exist..." http://tinyurl.com/c9ush3z

[–] manjaser 11 years ago

XXXX does seem like a tiny bit more of a geezer in the books. Perhaps more so in the first book than the second. It's really just in the way he talks though. It's the same character and Craig's version is really close to the one in the books.

What matters is that JJ Connolly wrote both the books and the screenplay for the movie. In interviews he's said he'd love for the second book to get adapted too. It's a brilliant book so I see no reason for it not to happen, unless Vaughn's too Hollywood now to come back and do a film in old Blighty.

I think too much time has passed. Like Danny Boyle and Trainspotting, he said once he'd love to do the sequel (Porno) yet the years tick by. Maybe Vaughn has moved on.

[–] LTUM 11 years ago

man that is a good point. i hadn't thought of boyle but you are right.

i agree it's nearly at the point where too much time has passed, or maybe even already at that point. breaks my heart, as the world's number one fan, it does, but if it never gets made at least i have the original masterpiece to savor from here on.

i just wish that connolly or vaughn or craig or all three would at least give us a hint or indication that the sequel could be in planning stages. seriously, there will be a league of disappointed fans if it doesn't happen.

"rage to exist..." http://tinyurl.com/c9ush3z

[–] PlatinumScreen 11 years ago

i think it will happen. i'd be right there with you saying too much time has passed if viva la madness had been published a decade ago, but since it has been out just a little while, i think the wheels of adaptation for the movie are turning. the waiting and wondering seems like a sahara because layer cake (movie) has been out almost ten years.

if the passage of time and craig's age are an issue, most of the viewers of the movie will not have read the book nor will they. i believe they could tweak the story to fit whatever age craig might be and all would be well.

i preface the following with the admission i have not read VLM.

in a connolly interview from august 2011, he describes xxxx this way in VLM:

Viva La Madness is a sequel to Layer Cake. The narrator has been lying low in the Caribbean, then he gets a call from his old buddy, Mister Mortimer. He's older and maybe wiser, been made disillusioned, but I think he'd call disillusionment a gift, a good thing not a bad thing.

this quote makes me think that an OLDER xxxx would be a plus in the movie. he's had time to stew in his juices and chew on some stuff. it would be totally plausible to me even if craig is older than he is now in the role.

then later in the interview connolly says:

And at some point I'll be talking to Matthew Vaughn about Viva La Madness the movie. Maybe Matt can put in a call to Daniel Craig and we can get going all over again.

http://www.crimetime.co.uk/mag/index.php/showarticle/1984

LTUM, have faith!!!!! :)

[–] LTUM 11 years ago

wow oh wow, this is quite encouraging, and i do see more plausibility after digesting your points. i won't repeat it, you said it so well yourself. good good points

thank you so much. excellent reason to hang onto hope......

"rage to exist..." http://tinyurl.com/c9ush3z

[–] statum106 11 years ago

Timing would be everything. It's really about finding time in Craig and Vaughn's schedules to shoot "Viva."

They would also have to alter the climax somewhat, given the real-life events that affect the characters.

I also believe that Mortimer carries a good portion of the story. If the screenplay holds true to the book, George Harris could see a few nominations, should he reprise his role.

I hope they bring this to the screen and sometime soon.

[–] LTUM 11 years ago

me too, i would love to see it.

great point about the climax; i have pondered that too. i'm sure they'd orchestrate some kind of tom clancy'esque ending that fit the current times.

i'm all about george. he'd likely own the film as you said.

as i read it i see so many good scenes that would be great to film, i wonder how they'd narrow it down. i trust vaughn to do it right, though.

my gut tells me we will never see it made, sadly

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"You are literally too stupid to insult."

"Thank you."

[–] bear022013-588-696101 11 years ago

Michael Gambon...one scene?
nigeriansback to Africa now....But Gambon is not Irish anylonger,where does he live?

[–] LTUM 11 years ago

ummmm, i don't know. i will find out and repost though.

"rage to exist..." http://tinyurl.com/c9ush3z

[–] LTUM 10 years ago

west london, according to wikipedia.

interesting read. i hadn't realised he left his wife and had two more sons. also i didn't realise he was knighted way back in 98, making me wonder why his credits since haven't mentioned that.

cool bastard though. love the guy. one of my faves.

as far as him showing up in VLM, that character never appeared in the book. But i guess that wouldn't matter, since the film diverges in so many other ways.

but i am still up in arms as to whether or not eddie temple died in that shot-up range rover. both views have been argued here endlessly, but my reasoning is that he must have died, otherwise why would he just vanish at the end with XXXX and crew walking around at the golf club large and in charge. IOW were he alive, wouldn't he come after them? that's my take on it.

i need to go resurrect that thread now.

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Once there was a hushpuppy, and she lived with her Daddy in the bathtub.