MovieChat Forums > Millions (2005) Discussion > Intelligent children

Intelligent children

posted 16 years ago by mastrmeb
18 replies | jump to latest

This movie reassures what I've been saying for years. After watching movies set in Great Britain and France, I'm convinced that American children are less than smart.

In this movie, we have young children (of an age I'm not about to guess) identifying Nelson Mandela. I'm going to assume it's fairly realistic (as I've seen similarly intelligent children portrayed in other various films set in Europe). It will comfort all you Europeans to know that American children of that age probably wouldn't be identifying Nelson Mandela as much as they would be cartoon characters. I don't know if it's the parents or the school system (or both), but yea . . . that's what I've come to realize from these films. American children are not as smart as European children.

Has anyone else noticed this? In film or otherwise?

[–] velcroshoe 16 years ago

I wouldn't go as far as to say that American children aren't as smart as European children, but I think they are just raised to have a less globally conscious attitude. I think the same as European children can identify Nelson Mandela, American children would be able to identify many of the U.S. Presidents. It's too bad American education is very centered on solely American culture for young kids, but I don't think they're really less intelligent than Europeans their age.

[–] fan_of_bollywood 16 years ago

I completely agree with velcroshoe. Also, unfortunately, the education standard in much of America leaves a lot to be desired. It's not the children's fault, they're just not brought up to know what goes on outside their shoreline.

Example: I live in Australia (but most of my family is European), and Americans are confused that we don't ride kangaroos to school. I'm being deadly serious!

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Sunday Was A Bright Day.

[–] jbaer-5 16 years ago

Also, unfortunately, the education standard in much of America leaves a lot to be desired. It's not the children's fault, they're just not brought up to know what goes on outside their shoreline.

I'm not sure what you mean by the education standard, as that can be taken many ways. There are standards (benchmarks) established. Most American adults would be surprised what children need to pass these days, so I would disagree those standards leave much to be desired. But learning does not happen in a vacuum. There are certain factors that make significant differences for children's outcomes. The biggest factor is parent involvement. When parents value education, they will read to their children from a very early age and they will expose their children to ideas and people. There was a groundbreaking book several years ago by Betty Hart and Todd Risley where they looked at the rate of language used by parents to their children in homes. They collected a ridiculous amount of data that took many years to codify. The results showed children performed the poorest in school had the most problems with reading and language, and those children came from homes where the parents hardly ever spoke with their children. It is a bit concerning how prevalent this phenomena occurs. So from the parent-child perspective, I would agree the education standard leaves a lot to be desired.

[–] danixdefcon5 15 years ago

Example: I live in Australia (but most of my family is European), and Americans are confused that we don't ride kangaroos to school. I'm being deadly serious!

I'm from Mexico, and I find it funny that many people in the US think that "ese" means "dude" in Spanish! (Note: "ese" is "that", and I don't see many people calling their friends "that"!!!)

[–] 15 years ago

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[–] spittle8 16 years ago

You've mistook intelligence for knowledge. It aids children in no way to know who Nelson Mandela is. He is the husband of a woman who advocated burning people alive with gasoline. On that note, I was taught all about Martin Luther King, Jr. in American grade school.

There is nothing wrong with American curriculum being centered on American history and culture. We are the preeminent dominant force on Earth. We damn well better teach our kids about what has made us the most powerful force in human history.

Also, give European children an I.Q. test and compare it to non-minority American children, and I'd bet money we'd come out on top. Europeans, the English and French in particular, tend to be more working class and less cultured than Americans. If that statement shocks you, then please keep your ignorant stereotypes to yourself.

"Did he say 'Making f-ck'?"

[–] 16 years ago

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[–] che-lecossais 16 years ago

My money is on "sheer idiotic hypocrisy".

[–] spittle8 16 years ago

The problem being that you are brainwashing children into admiring monsters such as that whore Mother Theresa, with blood on her hands, and Gandhi, who was a bastard of the highest order. Mandela to a lesser extent as well. The national school systems of western nations brainwash children into believing nonsense, and by graduation students generally lack even a cursory knowledge of the various hard sciences and instead remember historical pseudo-facts about irrelevent matters. I can say from experience that American schools brainwash children into believe liberal lies (and I stress lies) and propaganda and tenaciously suppress free thought. I remember getting in trouble for (justly and accurately) correcting my teachers in history class when we'd study a topic I had already read books on.

Simply put, the curriculum is static and damaging in its countless errors and counterfactualism, and there is a disturbing and systemic effort to trend towards "politically-correct" conclusions on history. In American grade school, we are taught a very base and rough interpretation of a historical issue and then force-fed illogical conclusions or a moralistic nature. Generally it devolves to "white men were bad and killed brown people. Brown people never killed white people and had a superior naturalistic way of living and a superior religious system".

I can only assume the same issue haunts British children. What is needed is neutral oversight of a concise, accurate telling of important historical periods without the *beep* opinions. History is important, but political lessons of a socialistic nature are not. It took me YEARS to realize I had been brainwashed into being a liberal socialist. I only reverted to conservatism due to the fact I had an open mind.

No, but I am confident in my groundless accusation against European kinder-volk.

"Either this is witty irony or sheer idiotic hypocrisy. "

I don't generally do 'wit', not intelligent enough for that. Generalizations are rough, but in all fairness I would actually stand by mine. I don't believe it is unfair to suggest that Western-European culture is more vapid and shallow than American culture. Obvious, we have our pernicious and omnipresent shell culture that permeates everything with its sickly disease, but that is an unworthy representation of our efforts.

Europeans are, to make an additional generalization, reactionist and ignorant. A base and primitive people driven by emotions and sentiment that is not grounded in logic. This will be their downfall as they are overcome by stronger peoples form the East. I make this statement based on knowledge culled from significant exposure to materials and experiences I would deem relevent to such a conclusion. I offer no evidence in support of this other than my own significant logical functionality.

"Did he say 'Making f-ck'?"

[–] 16 years ago

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[–] spittle8 15 years ago

I grew up in and around Seattle, that trumps Boston as far as wealth and liberalism are concerned.

Saying that liberalism encourages progression is rather silly. Liberalism is, at its core, about control. It is the antithesis of libertarianism, which is an ideology rooted in the belief that people are best left to their own devices in perfect freedom. Liberalism on the other hand is an answer to mankind's inhumanity and imperfection, through control.

If you like being told what to do, good for you, but I live in this country because I do NOT like being told how to live my life. America was founded on libertarian principles, liberalism is an alien disease.

As for conservatism hurting America, you are clueless. We haven't seen truly conservative governance in ages. Bush is not a conservative, for one thing. In all actuality, he has been very liberal in many respects. He has pushed for big government, big spending, greater government interference in our lives, and foreign interventions, all very liberal initiatives. You are confusing conservatism with the right-wing, and specifically Evangelical ideology. Good to see you're well educated...

"The spirit is willing, but the flesh is spongy and bruised."

[–] spittle8 15 years ago

Forgot to add that this country was not founded on an ideal of being the "best to live in" [sic]; it was founded on the ideal of liberty and freedom. We were meant to be free here. Free to starve, free to flourish, free to succeed and free to fail. And free to be left the *beep* alone if we so desire. The problem with liberals is that you've destroyed that in this country and are working tirelessly to strip away what remains of our freedom. Sure, we're free to choose where we work and what we wear, but we're no longer free to be left alone, no longer free to defend ourselves, no longer free to only pay the necessary taxes. You'd have it so we are all forced to contribute to bogus socialist programs that always fail. I've lived in Detroit for nearly 4 years, a city that is controlled by Democrats and whose citizens tend to all be on the dole, more or less. Feel free to pay a visit if you want to see your *beep* "progression".

"The spirit is willing, but the flesh is spongy and bruised."

[–] Quanfa 15 years ago

Evanmang87 - I was with you until "We might be able to blow up the world 500x and we might have an excessive military budget but guess what? We're not the best country to live in anymore. Our citizens dont have it the best anymore. But go on and believe Reagan was the Second Coming and history will be kind to the current *beep* daddy's boy we have in office."

First - we, nor anyone else in the world, even with combined efforts, are not capable of blowing up the world 500x. That's been incorrectly espoused for decades. Please tell me you didn't learn that at one of your elite Boston universities...

As for being the "best" country to live in, that, of course, depends. I think the level of immigration (legal and illegal) into the US would beg to differ with your statement. Nowhere else in the world has the number of immigrants entering into it every year. Now having said that, that doesn't give Americans the right to run around the rest of the world sticking their chests out and demanding everyone speak English. We also could do without a government that insists on taking care of the rest of world. I guess the only supported, popular wars are the ones started by democrats... In any event, it's obvious to me that there are some absolute asses in America - some terribly ignorant, stupid Americans. But Americans don't have a monopoly of ignorant and stupid people.

As for our citizens "having the best anymore" - that's also a matter of debate. Some people in America are quite happy and couldn't imagine living anywhere else. But still - what is "having the best?" I'm not trying to be difficult, but honestly - how could American complain about what opportunities they have compared to the rest of the world? Aren't we discussing this with "Millions" as a backdrop? How many Americans on this message board are without access to clean water? Or is your biggest problem that you don't have a QWERTY keyboard on your cell phone. Yeah, by and large it really sucks in America.

But the basics of this whole discussion is more correct than incorrect. The American education system is poor at best given the results on a national level. But I would blame this on government run public education. Now the argument can be made that it's not private schools that are better at teaching but the type of students that go there. So be it. You can't ignore, as spittle suggested, that demographics definitely have something to do with the numbers. Texas, for instance, one of the lowest scoring states in the US, includes many children who can't even speak English much less take a standardized test in English.

But the real test is what comes out of a particular country. America still holds many influential companies in the world and founds them everyday, despite a somewhat ignorant populace. Maybe that makes America like a union - it only survives as well as it does because of a select few that go against the grain and actually have intelligence and a work ethic!

[–] fox-153 16 years ago

spittle8 yea Americans are so intellegent they cant work out the difference between an Iraq soldier and a British/American solider! SHOOT EVERY1! Being a dominant force does not make you intellegent, look at the person leading your country for a start! I think safety in numbers is more the issue! The playground bully was the dominant force at school but was he the most intellegent?

As it happens I disagree with the original poster - i don't think you can judge a countries intellegence on a film! Most of the child actors come from good backgrounds and could attend private schools. They aren't going to cast an unarticulate child for this kind of role.

[–] ender342 11 years ago

Speaking of 'ignorant stereotypes'...

[–] Loops2112 16 years ago

**In this movie, we have young children (of an age I'm not about to guess) identifying Nelson Mandela. I'm going to assume it's fairly realistic (as I've seen similarly intelligent children portrayed in other various films set in Europe). **

erm well for starters, it's a film. They say 'we're going to show you all a photograph of a man and when XXX's character says "who is this", I want you all to shout "Nelson Mandella" to him'.

Unfortunately that just means that the kids are able to follow instructions, not that they are smart!

[–] waffleman101 11 years ago

what are you talking about, its a script, i find it hard to believe you could possibly think by watching movies you can get an idea of what goes on inside real peoples heads or what knowledge they know.
you must be thinking that these writers researched local knowledge and decided what people generally do and do not know, which is utter madness, what has happened here, in my opinion, is that european writers like to think positively at the next generation whereas in america people are portrayed a steriotypes with the purpose of getting a point across and make money.
look at women in american cinema and tv compared to british, women are generally portrayed as control characters, annoying or keeping the main character down or getting in their way.
its the style of the writers and the industry in america producing this *beep* mostly hollywood

[–] PsychoticDestruction 8 years ago

This is more of an education issue than an intellectual issue.