who was the father of the twins?
Was it the older man (the one that Eleni ran away from) or his son (with whom she ran away with)? Had the older man raped young Eleni?
shareThe Son is the father of the children. That's why she was sent away in the beginning, so that the father would'nt notice it. Just when Eleni has been tucked away in bed after returning the women make a remark that goes something like "Look at the boy behind his father, totally unaware of what he's done". The father wants to wed Eleni years later, after his wife has been dead for some time.
share"Look at the boy behind his father, totally unaware of what he's done".
The second "he" in this scentence can be "the father" instead of the boy.
Why on earth a grandma would gave away her grandsons not for poverty or any other reasons, but because what? In early years the farmers would marry young to bring in more procution cravity. So marry the young couple would be best and only solution. Unless it's the father instead of the son, father of the twins.
Twins never call "father", vice versa they never call "son" or "our sons".
The old father was so desperate to marry the young girl because he made her his "bride" long before his wife's death.
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Disgree.
The farmers marry young to achieve more labor capability. Even new Greek or Turkish immigrants in West Europe marry young. For Spyro and his wife must longing for grandchildren as they only have one son.If Eleni got pregnant from the son, they may just get married.
The only possible scandal was Eleni got pragnant from the father instead of the son. Can you imagine a Grandmother gave away her grandchildren instead getting the young couple married.
The conversation between Anna(Spyro's wife) and Casandra could be a riddle:
1. To late to stop him... ( son or father)
2. Look at the boy behind his father, totally unaware of what he's done".
The second "he" in this scentence can be "the father" instead of the boy(son).
The twins never called "father", and the son of Spyro never called "sons".
Eleni never said to son of Spyro " our sons" or "our children".
If I recall correctly, when Eleni and her young man are outside the music school, she says, "my boys" rather than "our boys".
I think that there a Sophoclean family-dynamic going on in the story. To me, this is an important element of the tragic aspect of this film.
A mother would say this -I do. It is clear from the beginning that the twins are Alexis' sons and that they are - at least one of them- angry at him. [Edit: Also it is clearly said in the published script]
And, yes, there is a Sophoclean element in the story. Brother and Sister (as practically Alexis and Eleni are) and from another aspect Mother and Son , Father and Daughter (Spyros and Eleni), Father against Son (Spyros and Alexis), Brother against Broher (the twins fighting in opposite sides), though it echoes more of Aeschylus’ Seven Against Thebes.
Maria-37, I'm glad you clarified that because I thought it was strange that one of the twins acknowledged Eleni as his mother but never called Alexis his father. As for the conversation among the women while they were putting Eleni to bed, my impression was that the women were simply assuming that Alexis was the father but the later marriage of Spyros and Eleni made me think that Spyros could have been the father.
shareThere is another far more complex answer. What could've happened is that Spyros raped Eleni when she was young. He is therefore the father of the twins; but Alexi's family probably believe that it was Alexis who had made the girl pregnant, and therefore decided to try and hide it from Spyros. Spyros would've acted normaly so that nobody believed that he had raped a young girl while being married to someone else. This would also explain why the old women say "look at him, totally unawere of what he's done" referring to Alexis.
It would also xplain why he boys never call Alexis 'father', and he never calls them 'sons', and why Spyros is so desperate to marry her (perhaps he regrets what he did and belives he will repair the damage done by marrying her). We can also remember that near the beginning, when Alexis and Eleni are young, Alexis says he heard the women whisper, so we can suppose that the woman believe Alexis did wrong, but he doesn't know what (meaning that he wasn't the one who made love to Eleni).
Anyway, Angelopoulos always leaves it fairly ambiguous. One kid likes Alexis, the other doesn't really seem to; when Spyros dies, only one of the boys seems to be affected and lowers his head, etc.
Maria is correct. The dialogue:
Danae, the girl's delirious. If Spyros found out anything, he'd kill her. [because he either foresees mating with her and wants her to be a pure virgin with no sexual knowledge, or he thinks she is not worthy of being with his son, or because she would spoil any plans he [Spyros] has for his son, or he would "kill" her because the family took her in and raised her and she repaid them by destroying the innocence of their son; either way, Spyros knows nothing about the relationship between his son and Eleni]share
It's pointless. The girl's not of our blood. [the farmer theory nullified: the family would never consider allowing the two to marry because she is not related to them, and may not even be Greek - she was orphaned in Odessa, she may be Russian, Jewish, Ukrainian, Roumanian, Bulgarian, Albanian, Armenian, Italian, French, German...]
Have you spoken to your son?
He's in a daze.
Of course! After what he did! [impregnated Eleni!]
Couldn't you have prevented it?
By the time I found out, it was too late. Good thing I came up with that story about her being sick and took her to my sister in Thessaloniki for the last months. Then we found that good woman. You know her husband's a merchant. Childless. No, no, the twins are in good hands.
Spyros! And your son, behind his father as though nothing happened. [the son is accused of acting as if he did nothing]