for a movie with alot of strange and unusual situations and emotions, i really didnt find it compelling at all. its got a surprisingly high imdb rating at the moment.
is there anybody else that thinks that movie just didnt hit the right note on any of its shocking or funny moments?
"I'm dedicating this unusual song to an unusual person who makes me feel kind of... unusual"
Well...I've only just seen it so I could be very wrong but to me it didn't really seem to have a lot to say. A lot of people seem to think that it's really original but to me it's just another riff on Eraserhead and other David Lynch films. I guess in a way it was imaginative but to what effect, what was the point and if like Lynch the point is that there IS NO POINT then I'm not really impressed. It was filmed nicely enough and it wasn't uninteresting or boring but it pretty much panned out the way I expected it would and nothing really surprised me (which SPOILER!!!!, is pretty unusual for a movie that features a man emerging fully-grown from a woman's urm...private parts!). So in short yes, I'm pretty surprised too that it is rated so high.
shareIf you think Lynch films have no point, you should be in no position to criticize. Go watch them again. Look closer.
shareDo YOU have a 1st degree in film criticism? I'm thinking no, believe me I've had far more chance to study his films than you. That said I believe that what I meant to say was that you can read Lynch's films postmodernly as being about the breaking down of master narratives and therefore although many people try to "make sense" of Lynch in a narrative sense you could perhaps say that this is pointless as there is no narrative sense to be made. Is this good enough for you? Sorry if you really like Lynch's films or Gozu and can't stand the fact that others do not agree but don't expect me to unpack every statement I make on this board just to help you understand better.
share"Do YOU have a 1st degree in film criticism? I'm thinking no, believe me I've had far more chance to study his films than you."
And all you can come up with is that there is no point? Education has failed us.
Personally, I liked and got Gozu and enjoyed it, though not as much as some of Miike's other movies. And, like Eraserhead, I found it to be hilarious in some parts.
Actually, no, that's not all I came up with and if you read my other post here then I have tried to clarify what I said before. There isn't the space here to discuss either Miike's or Lynch's movies in any real depth, for that there are things called books and journals. The fact is that I just gave my opinion and rather than discuss that in an intelligent fashion, a couple of people, who appear to be on the offensive a little too quick, saw fit to instead pick apart my casual assertions because I didn't elaborate them into a complicated thesis. I think the bottom line is that some people just can't handle the fact that the films they like are not universally enjoyed. As far as I can see, I went to see Gozu at least, I know too many people that slate movies before even seeing them but I did give this a chance and unlike the other 90% of people in the auditorium with me, I did stay and watch the whole thing. The film isn't in my opinion completely without merit but I can't say I enjoyed it or found anything particularly intelligent about it. If that bothers people then perhaps we should call this the "sycophancy database" and we should all only come on here to say how much we love ALL the movies we see. Now perhaps people could, in an intelligent way, without being pedantic, tell me what they thought this movie was saying and why because I would find THAT a lot more interesting than people who will attack my views without offering any of their own.
share" Now perhaps people could, in an intelligent way, without being pedantic, tell me what they thought this movie was saying and why because I would find THAT a lot more interesting than people who will attack my views without offering any of their own."
I don't know if this is an intelligent way, but personally i think this movie is _not_ saying much. I think it is just a strange story. I personally think that movies by Lynch like "Blue Velvet", "Lost Highway" and "Mullholland Dr." aren't saying much either, but i like them very much and can watch them everytime again with great pleasure! But i might be totally wrong and these films are full with meaning. (I would agree that there is a lot of symbolism, but imo that does not imply that the whole movie has something to say.)
Yesterday I watched this movie a second time and I still like it.
The first time i saw it i was fascinated, because with all the strange things happening i expected tentacles and/or zombies showing up at any point. The soundtrack is horror film style and the second title "the great yakuza horror theatre" suggested something like that. I expected that the town turns out to be as freakish as in Carpenters "In the mouth of madness" or like the bar in "From dusk till dawn". Allthough nothing like that happened, i watched it with suspense to the end and i enjoyed it.
It sure played with themes like fertility, sexuality, rebirth, motherhood and in my oppinion "family-ties" or something like that. But in the end i don't care if it makes any sense. Like with "Gummo", if it means something or not is unimportant to me.
Somebody wrote a comment on the movie in which he said it is something like "popcorn cinema" in Japan. Something like a "pixar movie" in Amerika. Maybe that could explain to you, why looking for sense is futile...
I have never been to Japan so i don't know if that is true.
P.S.:I think interpretations are difficult in general, because the person interpreting is doing it according to its own experiences and knowledge. So he is projecting his own personal way of thinking on the movie. As intellectual as he may be, it is still _his_ view and everyone receives reality in a different way.
So did you read my post or not? What I actually said in a nutshell was that I don't really see any particular themes in it and didn't really find it that entertaining either! I also said earlier that I don't really think that it has anything to say, which is fine if all it is intended to be is light entertainment. Why is it that no matter how well I explain myself no-one actually reads my posts thoroughly, then, like you, they still quote me and say they disagree with me!!!!
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Did you read your own post? Or my reply to it? I shared my view and did not disagree with you. Constantly repeating what you already said doesn't get you any further, either! But maybe sometimes, in the future, someone will read your posts thoroughly...
shareI think you're a leetle paranoid. That person was simply responding to what you said you'd be interested to hear, and they in essence agreed with you.
I agree with you too, as far as Lynch not having any political, social or philosphical points. He just tells very standard stories in unusual ways - the irony is that the stories themselves would be boring if told in a straightforward way. I think Gozu is very similar - it rather wittily makes explicit the intrinsic homoerotic undertones of Yakuza films... but it doesn't draw any conclusions about the topic. It's just story about a Yakuza man and his protege who fall in love, told in a clever and interesting way.
First of all, the point of this movie is in the symbolism and subtext - no degree required, just some depth of thought. Sexuality is plentiful in this film, yet none of it is your average, heterosexual fornication.
Cross-dressing waiters; Incest; Motherhood's, ah, more sexual aspects; sex-toys and prostitution... and in the end, the films climax??
Minami has sex with his "brother" Ozaki.
Their boss has to put something in one end to get the other end up?
Any other hints needed? The film is about homosexuality at its core (in my opinion, of course). The subtext explores hellish state of being confused about your sexuality.
Then, take a look at the symbolism in every scene. The cow-headed demon guarding the gateway to hell, the inn-keepers (read: gate-keepers), the two-faced man who, the river they had to cross which "kills" Ozaki.
And at the same time, things like the "Incanting the Spirit" scene prove that the weirdness is not to be taken seriously - it's not the literal truth of what's happening. The Inn-keeper's brother sits in his chair, smaking his lips and abruptly changing his sitting position. This is exactly how people who go into deep-trances and channel spirits act in real-life. Then, low and behold, he's chewing gum and they go into a bizzarre S&M sequence where the brother had no idea what's happening.
Anyway, hope I've shed some light on what this film may have REALLY been about.
Blah blah bla.. Empror, your clothes are made from a magical silk, only those who are clever will see there beauty.
Rebelcowgirl, I'd like for you to tell me how this movie was related to Eraserhead. Go ahead. Tell me how Gozu was "just another riff" on a David Lynch film. David Lynch has made some interesting movies, but he doesn't come close to Miike. I've seen both Gozu and Eraserhead quite a few times and fail to see any kind of connection. Think before you post next time. Return to your Dwight Yoakum and Leanne Rimes CD collection and leave the criticizing to people who actually know film.
shareWow! Talk about a pompous, a-hole response! Leaving aside your ridiculous comment that "David Lynch doesn't come close to Miike" which, even in the realms of opinion where everything is supposedly valid, is laughable, the personal insults that you stoop to mark you as someone best ignored.
Love those country music references too. Yeah, you're not a walking cliche of "pseudo-intellectua lism"... Nope... not at all...
No, there is a point. Miike explores many issues in Gozu, such as family, responsibility, and the desire to find a significant other. I once wrote a paper focused entirely on the themes of homosexuality found in the film. Also, do some reading on Japanese mythology. You'll find a lot of parallels to it and Gozu.
As for Lynch having no point, obviously you overlooked the criticism of Hollywood in Mulholland Dr.
usually, the "more unique" the movie, the more I enjoy it. Sadly, Gozu, as odd as it was, did not keep my interest. In fact I nearly fell asleep during 3 seperate parts of the movie. My girlfriend slept through half of it. In fact, I woke her up when the female Osaki was birthing the male Osaki. She was so bored with the rest of the movie that she just went back to sleep.
Gozu has some crazy stuff in it but it would be better off if someone just combined all the cool stuff into a 30 minute short. Oh, and saying something is Lynchian does not serve as an excuse for a boring, unexciting film.
QUIT ANALYZING EVERYTHING, POSERS.
THIS MOVIE RULED.
HOW COULD YOU POSSIBLY FALL ASLEEP?
well i can see it, my roomate does all the time when we're watching great movies (he has 4 boys all under the age of ten YIKES!) I can see the correlation between this film and eraserhead, and i can see that people over analyze movies ( i cant fault you though, as a student in a film program, i know that the profs demand you analyze the sh!t out of them) but all you need is this little trick. Lose your self in the imagery (its not hard in this movie) the cinematograpy is great and there isnt a real moment when something wierd and wonderfull isnt happening on the screen. All in all its a enjoyable visceral experience (im using big words to keep the "intellectuals" happy.)
There might not be anything under the surface (then again there might be)but you will find the "pretty pictures" good enough to like this film.
Btw is there anybody else who would have grabbed Aniki's hand when he was needing it near the end?
"Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds."
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Just saw it, this is art, maybe its a movie too ;) I like it.
shareI’m not so sure about any of the metaphors in this movie, but I do see in it, a look into a mans subconscious world. Minami is uncomfortable around girls; he is still a virgin because of this. We see this cross-dressing waiter guy and you slowly are being shown a spin into Minami's mind. The whole breast milk thing, mothering and nourishment, depicts a simple innocence (rele not sure about this one but this is all I can come up with…). I’m not so sure about the cow head demon spirit thing...that seems to draw me a blank right now. Most likely it is cultural somehow, or in some way it does tie in with Minami's personality. With Ozaki being a woman we are possibly further drawn into the depths of Minami's mind. For him to have sex he is comfortable with men but he wants a women. This may be why he still refers to female Ozaki as brother, even though he knows she is a she. When he finally begins to release himself and the male Ozaki emerges. The girl being put into water is most likely a metaphor but it might be viewed as an after period of re-cleansing and one being made new. Possibly sexually, emotionally (mentally)..etc..whatever.
I did enjoy this movie and I thought, although very weird, and a little disturbing, it was extremely funny in a very dark way and it was a good movie. This is the first Miike movie I have seen and I am quite impressed. This movie was extremely thought provoking and one of the better films I have seen in a while. I've been trying to get around to seeing the many others, but until I get a car, the trips to get Miike movies are few and far between....lol..
This movie is like abstract art. The problem with abstract art is that no one knows how to judge it. You can't say one abstract painting is better than another. You can only say you like it more. No degree in criticism is going to help you judge such works because it's all about subjectivity. Objectivity will get you nowhere.
shareBlah blah bla.. Empror, your clothes are made from a magical silk, only those who are clever will see there beauty.
sharetotally great movie. I think it's hard for certain people (namely myself), to see how anybody could dislike this movie. I'm a snob, I enjoy weird movies, and I enjoy miike films. The format reminds me a lot of audition, mainly because not too much weird stuff is going on until the last half hour or so. then it's knocked into overdrive. But, if you want to see one of his films that is non-stop weirdness all the way through, watch "visitor Q".
If you didn't like "gozu", fine. But, I still think it's good.
"oooooo, navy seals!"
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"you don't have to fricken whine about it cause *you're to retarted* to get it."
You had better be f-cking kidding me.
Blah blah bla The format reminds me a lot of audition totally great movie its a Takashi Miike film David Croenenberg Their boss has to put something in one end to get the other end up? Eraserhead and other David Lynch films It's just story about a Yakuza man and his protege who fall in love, told in a clever and interesting way. I guess in a way it was imaginative but to what effect, what was the point
sharei thought it was good for the most part. it did lose me at times with bad visual or sound effects(like the cork unpopping sound when he pops out)
some of the dialogue/plot was weak too, standard Japanese melodrama..."you saved my life, now I will save yours"
I would say its a 6.8/10
It seems today's audiences need everything spelled out v e r y s lo w l y these days...
It doesn't make sense *to you*, interpretation is a subjective action, as David Lynch said, the film just needs to "click".
For me it did, I loved the mood, the humour, the surrealist setting, the imagery that kept me squirming in my seat every couple of minutes... and the "eeeeeeeww"s and "uuuuuuuuh"s and "eeeeeergh"s from the audience were worth the price of admission alone.
In *your opinion* it isn't a good film, that does not put you in a position to criticize the majority of users that gave the film a positive rating.
Maybe you'd be better off spewing drool over mainstream manipulative crap like Titanic.
personally i think of it as intellectual masturbation
im prolly horny!
I wonder if i will get insulted by just saying the film did not "click" with me. I am glad many of you like it, but you don't have to call those who didnt "retarded", shows how intellectual Miike's fans are.
shareI can see why people don't like it, but personally I love it. I found myself giggling at near enough every line, especially the repeated lines ('It's underwear, with a hole in it!'), and the guy who kept saying about the weather. I suppose if I hadn't watched it on my own, in silence, I wouldn't have connected with it as much (probably the reason why I didn't enjoy Dead or Alive, as me and my mates were expecting it to be like Hard Boiled). A genuine surprise that I enjoyed it as much as I did, as I only rented it out of curiousity due to my enjoyment of Ichi the Killer. Incidentally, I know a lot of you will have seen it, but for those who haven't, get hold of Save The Green Planet. One of the most original, funniest, wince-inducing, bonkers, saddest films I've seen in a long time.
sharezupador2 - you said that you thought the story was told in a clever and intereting way. so how come you call it intellectual masturbation?
share