MovieChat Forums > The Diary of Ellen Rimbauer (2003) Discussion > Sukeena & John in Diary of Ellen & Rose ...

Sukeena & John in Diary of Ellen & Rose Red


In Rose Red I thought that had Sukeena and John have a real affair. In the Diary of Ellen it was staged. I liked the idea of it being staged better. It would be horrible if poor Ellen had to deal with Sukeena cheating too. She would have lost everything. But I thought that in the end of Rose Red, Sukeena's spirit was bad and Steven Rimbauer had to fight her off. I did I miss something or was the just something they (the writers)decided to change.

reply

You missed the fact that Steven fought off the daughter, and not Sukeena. Sukeena was never shown actually killing, however all spirits locked in Rose Red would soon turn on their visitors.

reply

Bravo jasone-4! Yes, he fought off the daughter. It goes by so quickly when you see the fangs come out of the window...it's great!

reply

In "Rose Red", Sukeena and Ellen threw John out the Tower Folly's window, right?

reply

Yup.

reply

Sukeena & John didn't have an affair, it was staged by Sukeena & Ellen. John was set up. Its been awhile since I've seen this movie but for some reason, Sukeena & Ellen felt it was time for John to go. I think its b/c he didn't want anymore builting of Rose Red.

reply

I thought it was quite obvious that it was staged when I saw Rose Red. Sukeena looks at Ellen a couple of times and keeps kissing him. You can see it in her face that she does it to frame him. Also she actually helps Ellen push John out of the window.

reply

In Rose Red Ellen looks more shocked to catch them, which would lead you to believe that the affair was real. But Sukeena did help Ellen push him through the window, which lead me to believe they planned it.

reply

yes they planned it... read the book =P
*spoiler coming up*






sukeena fooled john that she wanted him and he followed her up to the tower where she said that she was going to spend the night (all alone). when he got up to the tower he heard Aprils voice and saw here face... then sukeena, Ellen and the spirits of the house took him and threw him out the window...

reply

Also, in Rose Red, after John is pushed out of The Tower Folley/Rose Tower Ellen and Sukeena hold hands.

Also, in the Diary movie, Sukeena and Ellen hug very closely as they watch workers clean up the glass of the tower window where John committed suicide after witnessing the true face of Rose Red and it's spirits.

It seems to me they were friends (or something more) till the end. Sukeena saves Ellen's life in Africa, helps her give birth and Ellen gets Sukeena out of jail by whoring herself to John and killing him, so he doesn't touch Sukeena. They had/have a very close-knit friendship, so I'm pretty sure Sukeena was acting very well, to fool John.

There was a scene they never filmed where they originally had Sukeena biting off John's lips in the Rose Red series, but censorship, and an accident to a crew member (according to the Rose Red DVD commentary) wouldn't allow it.

reply

But...you are forgetting in the diary of ellen rimbauer (the novel), John insists on a three-way romance including Sukeena, and Ellen abides, feeling guilty in making Sukeena. And this is after John sees Sukeena and Ellen kissing in Ellen's room. John has secret passages throughout the house.

So the so called 'staged affair' isnt really anything new, just Ellen setting up it was to show John that she knew he was messing round with other woman without her. And she didnt like him much to begin with.

Sukeena also went missing, which suggests something too.

reply

The book also gives a website in the end (I'll have to look it up again) and leads you to a page where you can find entries that were omitted and very sexual in nature.

It is very clear that Ellen and Sukeena were lovers.

reply

The website is: www.beaumontuniversity.net

Read the book and it explains all.

reply

Thanks for that link. Now much of the back story is making sense.

reply

No, in the movie Rose Red, it was staged as well. When Ellen snuck up on John while he was kissing Sukeena, Sukeena looked at her because she was expecting Ellen to pop into the room. Then when Ellen went to push John, they pushed him together, and Ellen didn't even attempt to make Sukeena fall as well. Not to mention, they were holding hands right afterward. It should have been pretty obvious it was staged.

reply

Thanks for the website, but I swear I must be doing something wrong because I cannot find any written articles. Just "related searches" that lead me no where and a bunch of ads. Grrr!

reply

I watched the Movies "Rose Red", "The Diary of Ellen Rimbauer" and I read the Diary book all at about the same time to keep it all fresh in my mind.

As you know, movies never tell all the details of a book and oftentimes the writers mess around with plots and all to keep the movies at a certain length or to just try to get the points across and go from there.

I tend to stick with the story as it is in the book version because that is where you get the details and how the writer originally intended it, so according to the Diary, Ellen was in love with John at first and wanted their life together until they took their trip around the world and Ellen found out how John had a strong sexual desire for other women, and in turn this caused her to get some sort of sexually transmitted disease which she held against him and had caused her problems in years to come.

When she returns to the house, she finds solace there and she switches her love to the love of the house. She does realize she has sexual desires for Sukeena and even acts on them because she doesn't get the love she needs from John.

The House becomes jealous over time, at first taking away those that cause hurt to Ellen-like the affairs John had, but then as the House loves Ellen, it gets jealous of her as well and takes those she loves, even Sukeena in the later years which the movie never covers, then eventually herself.



I think the building of the house was like attention being given to the house and if she stopped, the house felt abandoned.

reply

A few years off, but in case anyone stumbles upon the series and this movie like I did.. Stephen King's Rose Red came before the book. The book was designed as a companion piece for King's mini series when it proved to be very popular. It wasn't even written by King, it was someone else entirely.

So in any instances there's a discrepancy between King's Rose Red and The Diary, I say Rose Red wins over the book or later produced film.

reply