I'm pretty sure everybody here has had their ups and downs on the "logic meter" so I think instead of judging I'll start where you left off and work backwards...
Congrats! You caught on to the fact that Lily wouldn't have know who she was riding next to much less if they were next to a cliff because she was blindfolded. So you're all good there ss.
As to Lily's "stupidity" in the cave... she'd been raised on the frontier in New Mexico by a Mother who hated ALL Indians because her own father (TLJ) had run off and left the family to more or less become one. Lily had a built-in prejudice, had been highly traumatized and had no reason to believe that particular Indian was there to help her. He could just as easily have captured her Mother and stolen her cross. But they made it pretty clear she understood how badly she screwed up when they retied the Indian girl who was also a captive who was screaming at Lily that she had just killed them all.
This is also the same girl who had the guts to fight against the evil band of Indians who'd kidnapped her, killed half her "family" while doing it and tied her up and treated her like meat. She did this by skinning a deer, rescuing and trying to save the Mother (Elizabeth Moss) and her dead baby only to have dirt stuffed in her mouth to show her what "the rest of your life will taste like". She had the courage to help the other girls get out of there when her Mom did show up and fought just as hard as anyone to get them all out of there and keep them safe later on by shooting at the Brujo.
As to the Brujo, he and his group had their pride diminished. He killed the photographer who took his picture because the photo was "bad medicine" and the way that guy died was only one example of how scary that freakin witch really was... lest you forgot, this was the same guy who skinned a steer and stuffed a living human man into the body/skin, sewed it back up and roasted him alive. It had nothing to do with the Mexicans and EVERYTHING to do with the fact that he was just black magic evil and wanted the people who crossed him (some of whom were the escaped prisoners) wiped off the face of the Earth. Nothing less would have given him his mojo back and nothing else would satisfy his need for vengeance.
Plus... hate to break it to you but the sale/slavery market on young girls and boys is STILL alive and thriving all over the world and it makes pretty big freaking money for the people who are doing it, OR THEY WOULDN'T KEEP DOING IT!
As for the "troublesome" women... SERIOUSLY?! Traumatized, tied up teenagers who'd seen their families slaughtered by these guys and you think they're going to be a problem? One of them shot herself in the head in the middle of her chance at getting free from the gang. She had a gun to protect herself with, Lily getting horses and she put a bullet in her brain. So the "trouble"... not so much there in my opinion. The whole scheme worked because the women they took to sell were too emotionally and in some cases physically damaged to even be a problem... Heck, if they could grab 8 girls in under 10 days they wouldn't even have to feed them. Water alone would keep them alive and it was clear they got "cleaned up" for the sale. Oh and if you check, depending on where they were in NM, in the 1800's old west it's highly possible that it wasn't hundreds of miles to Mexico proper at all. Not too mention the fact that they weren't at that point even being chased by the Army because "The Fourth Calvary" who were supposed to be after them were up north in Colorado I believe.
For the Brujo, it was not just about the money. It was about power, control and the practice of black magic. That guy scared the pee outa me and I wasn't in his gang so yeah, pretty sure they'd do whatever he wanted until it killed them. At that point, what he wanted was revenge.
So you're free to see it as a cliche' ridden western that was typical and poorly done cause we've all got our own perceptions and as Anais Nin once said "we don't see things as THEY are, we see things as WE are". But I thought it was an entirely new take on the western with 2-3 running stories going throughout the entire movie all of which was beautifully scripted, acted and shot. And I'm not generally a fan of westerns either although I will ALWAYS believe that both the original Magnificent 7 and Silverado are bloody miracles of movies and both are best served in their original form!
But that's just me! It's late at night and my brain meter just ran out of quarters.
"You told me I had nothing. But you were wrong. I have love, I have hope and I have faith."
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BobbyT24
7 years ago
Thanks for the response, Janine. I respect your opinion and your thorough rebuttal. I think both of us put WAAAAAY too much thought into our posts. ;-)
Most of my comments were meant to be tongue-in-cheek. They went longer than I intended since I respect anyone willing to put their vision (and considerable budget) on screen when the majority of us couldn't write a good script if they spotted us all the words between "FADE IN:" and "FADE OUT." I just saw a lack of plausibility at a critical juncture in the storyline for a bunch of baddies generally just wanting money. Getting rid of the prisoners asap was supposed to be the end of their journey I would imagine. Beholdin' to the Brujo is another conversation entirely!
Never meant any disrespect for women - especially those kidnapped in the story (except Lily - OMG grrrrr!!!). ;-) To the contrary. Not a joking matter actually. I was using the (less than humorous) view from the bad guys, not my personal feelings since that form of action would never cross my mind to do to another human being. Sorry if that offended as that was never my intention. Any type of human slavery is wrong on every level at any time in history. Probably why I hated what the bad guys did to the women and didn't just let them go when they weren't "needed" anymore. And the baby... that was just plain evil. Historically accurate or not, that sucks. :'(
Personally, I thought the Brujo character was extremely effective, spooky, sociopathic, and evil incarnate. One of the best "Western" villains they ever created actually - and I've watched more than my fair share. It was some of the other parts of the story that didn't make sense. Then again, those in charge of the movie-making business are far smarter than I so what should I expect? :-)
Thanks again for your response. It was thoughtful, impassioned and appreciated. Hope you have a great 2017!!!
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Janine-The-Barefoot
7 years ago
Hey ss!
I'd be willing to bet that there are a WHOLE bunch of people on the boards who think I've put WAAAAAAY too much into my posts as it is... some with and some without any thought entirely!
But I have to say that IMHO anyone who can come up with this: I respect anyone willing to put their vision (and considerable budget) on screen when the majority of us couldn't write a good script if they spotted us all the words between "FADE IN:" and "FADE OUT." more than deserves to have somebody front some money to go in search (creatively speaking) of a script of their own! Methinks you don't give yourself enough credit.
I will go on record as saying that I had hoped (in vain apparently) that some of my examples of Lily's behavior over the course of the movie would at least give you enough reasons to maybe raise her up to at least a 3 on the "crap-o-meter" but ahh well, I will live to fight another day!
And I NEVER ONCE considered that you had it in for women... well, at least I wanted to hope not. Your post showed some thought, the ability to think and even though there are others on the board who demonstrate differently entirely too often and with far too little reason, I saw enough of the tongue-in-cheek to believe you were a man "with a clue"!
Pleasure sharing notions with ya my good sir! Here's hoping our paths cross again.
"You told me I had nothing. But you were wrong. I have love, I have hope and I have faith."
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