What a POS! - Zivot je cudo (2004) Discussion

[–] 19 years ago

[deleted]

Interesting opinion... I assume that you are absolutely not familiar with the place Kusturica comes from. There is a special meaning of the films like Underground and Life is a miracle which are only comprehendable for those who witnessed the things that happened back in the nineties in the former Yugoslavia.
For others, these films might be interesting, thought provoking, or entertaining sometimes, as anything that you have no idea about --- NO OFFENSE---
I think Life is a miracle is another pearl in the row of a flawless necklace.

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[–] kikirriki 19 years ago

Well this movie is mostly made for people from Balkan, but when someone from outside likes it - it just shows how strong this master piece of art is.
Who finds something to like in this movie is everything else but ignorant.

"What defeats people is a bouble confession." CP

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[–] Krustallos 19 years ago

Well, obviously the movie has something to say about Bosnian politics which will not be 100% clear to an outsider. On the other hand his earlier films all had a political element too and they were much better.

The problem here for me wasn't the politics it was the decline of Kusturica's humour from surrealism into slapstick.

"I don’t like the term torture. I prefer to call it nastiness."

Donald Rumsfeld

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[–] in_area51 18 years ago

As a matter of fact, I come from the very place Kusturica comes from -- Sarajevo. Moreover, I even met the guy back when he was a respectable cinematographer, and not a failed village idiot. And, yes, I did witness what happened in former Yugoslavia (or the besieged city of Sarajevo, to be more precise), though addmitedly not on the CNN.

This movie, though cast with an excellent actor (Stimac), is a waste of time and 8mm film. It is so cheap, words don't come to descibe it. A total disappointment.

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[–] Claudia1968 18 years ago

Besieged city of Sarajevo? Yes, maybe, but from within the muslim goverment in the city itself, a government which never regretted a single life lost, and for one goal only, a goal we are witnessing every day - we have it every day on daily news - a muslim state, with merceneries from muslim countries, people who became Bosnian citizens on one account only - to fight and die in the name of jihad.

You call Mr. Kusturica an idiot - on what account? The fact that he was born as an atheist and raised as a Serb with a muslim name? On the account that he has never been a muslim but had a muslim name - that is your case? You are so PATHETIC... What is wrong with you? Anyways, I do not cure sick online, seek help elsewhere...

This movie is excellent, story well told, and it is funny, very warm and loving. People, you are going to love characters in this movie. The guy who posted this thread is just furious because he has his own issues. And the movie - it is brilliant!!! Strongly recommended!!!

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[–] in_area51 18 years ago

"Claudia",

I believe it is more apparent from your reply who really has issues. Only a psychopat can deny what has been broadly documented in a daily fashion by media from all over the world for more than three (3) years.

Btw, there were more terrorist mercenaries coming from Romania, Ukraine, Russia, Belarus, Moldavia and Greece than any Arab country, where the latter started arriving sporadically in the middle of the war. Admittedly, however, most of these orthodox fascist wannabes have been taken care of in the area of "Jevrejsko Groblje" (Jewish Cemetery) in Sarajevo, where their "brave brothers" threw them, along with "human shields" consisting of innocent civilians of the occupied Grbavica, against the Bosnian defenders -- a proud force consisting of patriotic yet ill-armed Bosniaks, Serbs and Croats -- true Sarajevans.

I digress, however. I didn't call Kusturica an idiot (I would reserve that term for utterly uninformed, yet arrogant people like you), but a "village idiot". The village in question is, alas, what once upon a time used to be the city of Belgrade.

I call him that on account on his own actions, behaviour and statements, not his upbringing.

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[–] 18 years ago

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[–] lumosnight 18 years ago

To call someone an "Orthodox Fascist" is an oxymoron. There is no such thing.

The real Fascists were the Croats who murdered the Serbs and Jews simply to show off that they are good Nazis and to satisfy their hatered for Serbs. Ever heard of Jasenovac? I thought so.

So watch out what nonsense you are saying. How do you expect to be taken seriously?

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[–] Enkelados 19 years ago

I don't agree that it is an awful movie.

I think it is beautiful, great photography, great dialogues, great music...

I actually watched this movie twice and the second time, there was 4 Bosnians sitting in front of me and I was amazed how these 4 people weren't laughing or reacting always in the same places than the rest of the people in the theater. I guess some things had other senses to them and I guess that some things that we thought were funny, weren't funny at all for people who had lived under these conditions.

I felt ashamed that I couldn't understand their point of view, yet I loved the movie for what it made me live for two hours and a half: Beauty of love, sordidness of war, the value of friendship and family.

Demented forever!

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[–] Word_inquisitor 19 years ago

Even though I don't think it's a bad movie, I think it was waaaaay long.
I believe there were a whole lotta scenes that the movie could've done without. At the end, I swore never to see it again, just like Underground.

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[–] anreq 19 years ago

And I loved Underground. This film was simply quite irritating . It has Kusturika's signature.He has found his own style.I didn't care for any of the characters, for the plot or the soundtrack, I tried to watch it. After 45 minutes I gave up. Nobody can say I didn't give it a chance.

Maybe Kusturika's style is not my style anymore. I simply couldn't bear it.
Good for the ones who liked it but I think this film is overrated.

Greetings

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[–] milena-18 18 years ago

I agree with you. watchable but clearly not genious.
My greater frustration lies with other people who try to color everything with national colors. whatever my little miseareble cursed savage balkan nation it is. haven't you had enough. sure saying Leni Riefenstahl is a genius is a bit complicated of a statement, but saying Kusturica's film is not superb shouldn't be a such a weighty statement. the man himself has tried so hard not to get nationalistic. this is ridiculous. as lovely claudia exemplified.

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[–] rooprect 18 years ago

Even though I haven't seen this film, this thread interests me because it touches on something I've suspected for a while. From the few other Kusturica films I've seen, I gather that the man is talented, visionary and clever. However it seems that as time goes on, he does become more nationalistic. That is, his films are directed only toward the communities around which the films center.

This is fine... if you happen to live in those communities; I'm sure the films are magical. But try to understand it from an outsider's point of view. We would very much like to learn & enjoy the culture and history of these nations, but Kusturica presents a very closed-off, esoteric (almost exclusionary) vision that, frankly, gets on our nerves after a while. I'm not sure if that was the idea behind the original post, but it's what I gather.

Well, if Kusturica wishes to keep his movies exclusive, that's his right. But if anyone can suggest some of his films that are a bit more accessible to the international public, please suggest them. And when I say "accessible", I don't mean trendy or Hollywood; I simply mean something we can all connect with on some human level, without knowing all the inside jokes & secret handshakes.

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[–] r14444 18 years ago

I agree with some people here. Kusturica is repeating himself a little, or a lot. And yes, there are some political messenges that I find hard to understand. But still it makes me smile, and that is what is important to me.

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[–] abu_harun 18 years ago

The Balkan wars by proxy. Here we have a good example of the Balkan hatred at work.

As an ex-NCO of former Yugoslav Air Force I had probably witnessed more than most of the posters on this board. Sorry Claudia I have witnessed Serb atrocities first-hand, as I have met Serb victims of rapes committed by the Croatian soldiers. Although I have not witnessed it I am sure there were some atrocities from the Bosnian side as well.

The matter of quantities is irrelevant for each of the victims personally. Unfortunately that is what the war is, note that we can witness many atrocities committed by the American soldiers in Iraq and i believe that is only tip of an iceberg.

I grew up in the same environment as Kusturica born of a Muslim father and a Bosnian Serb mother, and raised as an atheist. I will not hide that I disagree with Kusturica's points of view. For that reason I don't watch his movies any more.

With the hindsight I can now reflect on all illnesses that the communist society had, and all false promises that so called democracy brought to the Balkans. I have also spent last 11 years in the western Europe so I can say there is also latent hatred towards foreigners and other nations and cultures in their societies. Whether it is going to get out of hand as it was case in the Balkans I do not know.

I do know however that I have found my peace in the religion of Islam, that teaches you all the opposite of the nationalist madness I have been through - that all human beings are equal regardless of their skin colour, nationality, tribe etc. It also has the mechanism to enforce it unlike the Christianity which is only a moral code.

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[–] lumosnight 18 years ago

"Although I have not witnessed it I am sure there were some atrocities from the Bosnian side as well."

Damn right there were atrocities from Bosnian Muslim side. My family also personally knows certain people those who suffered under the hands of Bosnians who were almost burned alive in their homes. And more distantly, we also know of the rapes Bosnians did on Serbain women (yes they did that, don't act innocent) and I'm so fed up that everybody throwing all the blame onto Serbs.

"I grew up in the same environment as Kusturica born of a Muslim father and a Bosnian Serb mother, and raised as an atheist. I will not hide that I disagree with Kusturica's points of view."

Yeah, I bet you wish that he were a Muslim and threw more dirt towards the Serbs.

"I do know however that I have found my peace in the religion of Islam, that teaches you all the opposite of the nationalist madness I have been through - that all human beings are equal regardless of their skin colour, nationality, tribe etc."

And Serbs are the people who spread hatered? We protect the minority groups very well in our counrty- we don't divide anyone into classes, we criticize ourselves if we show any racial hatered.....

I don't want to sound bitter, but Bosnian Muslims have also caused grevious harm to my people, in a way that few foreigners would know.

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[–] a-a-d 17 years ago

Obviously, everyone go ahead and blame it on the communists - although, as I recall, the people of the region lived much more peaceful, quiet, and quality lives in that serene and prosperous time.

...And if blaming the communists fails, blame the Orthodox Serbs - because no one except Russia, which isn't in any state to start another world war for our Serbian brothers, like we did almost a century ago, and tiny and weak little Greece share their faith. NATO and the UN's clear hatred for Islam was born just a few years too late...

And, despite the new war games that they play, no one seems to wish to cancel the re-written history that blames the Orthodox Serbs for everything ill that ever happened in the region... The West doesn't seem to understand that a nation demeaned, bombed, divided, driven out of their homes, their holy places burned and razed, is just fertile soil for future strife...

Think about it, people... The violent and unjust creation, mostly by foreign forces, of bigoted and fanatical Muslim nations in the heart of a traditionally Orthodox Christian region, its ethnic and religious majority bitter and insulted - and you think that this "solution" will last?!

Once NATO fully loses interest in (or funding for) controlling the situation - well, I wouldn't want to be a Muslim at that time and place.

Although, honestly, how many of you that AREN'T Slavs actually care?!

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[–] ShahramMirkhani 17 years ago

My very dear friends, all of you,

I am muslim and I am from Iran and I love cinema and I 've seen most of Kustarica's films and ...

Let's think honest and let's give rights to the other side of dialog, weather it may be bitter for us.

Why are you fighting? Don't you know it's all business??
Is it new for you fighting between neighbor nations and different religions??

I AM sure that both Serbs and Muslims are guilty and victim in this war, which is not begun in 90's but long long time ago... but who is the real victim and who is the real criminal?

I am sure that we ordinary people are the real victim and may be a little criminal if we let that the real criminals play with us.

About the film, I watched is yesterday night and - as a normal habit for me - saw it for the second time a couple of hours later. I found it masterpiece, not because it tells the truth or something like that. It is decades from now that I do not look seriously for finding culture and truth in cinema. Since when Iranian movies got famous all around the world and I read what the other nations wrote about them...

Most of them where more or less true ( even sometimes quiet true and sometimes quiet imaginary ) but a movie IS a movie with max. 3 hours lentgh and ONE story and many limitations to give you the total view. Added to that, Iranian movies were known as the best during last 15 years but do you know which movies?? I tell you, the ones that showed the poor, the ill, the weak, the disabled and the mad Iranians. At that time, it was good for the DAMNED GODS OF POLITICS AND COMMERCE that advertise this view of Iranian all around the world the assure the world that this is the real IRAN. But it wasn't and isn't.

SO...

Let's see this movie as an imaginary country and imaginary religions and imaginary nations. Now you can enjoy this carnival of fun, hate, honesty, love, pride and ....

This is another masterpiece from the maestro. Let's hope that Emir doesn't stop in this step and doesn't repeat himself ( although yet it's not disturbing ). Let's all hope that he may make a big progess and developement in his style and develope it ( not change it ). And finally let's enjoy the world, the time, the movie and the other ones, weather they are muslims or Serbs or jews or ... Let's make war with the ones that want us to be in war with each other...

Love you all
Shahram

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[–] zdravko-3 18 years ago

What is "terrible ..... pathetic".
Can you give any fact to back it up?
My wife and I have similar background and were in similar position ending not in Australia but in USA. Is it better here or there ……… well who knows????????
Now we are here for almost 12 years.
Anyway, I found it is very good movie and I have enjoyed it very much.
I couldn’t find any scene that is “politically correct” for Bosnia, Croatia or Serbia.
And yes, watching this movie, you can see very clear, it is Kusturica, no doubt about it. Did I hear new U2 song? Off course I did and I knew immediately it is U2.
What about end? Is it happy end or what? What happened with Luka and Sabaha?

Zdravko Sonje

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[–] consigliere9 18 years ago

i think that balkan people can only completely understand this movie
kusturica is on of the greatest european directors.

pozdrav svim srbima:)

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[–] oigevalt 18 years ago

I disagree with consigliere9. I am not Balkan (born in the former Soviet Union), but I'm a huge fan of Yugoslav cinema in general, and Kusturica in particular. While I agree that I may not catch every nuance and local custom, I love his brand of extreme absurdity and great use of music, particularly in his earlier films, like Time of the Gypsies, Dolly Bell and When Father was Away on Business.