Explaining the title


A certain reviewer said he/she didn't understand the reason. It stands to reason as it is supposed to be read in French. It is actually a reference to basic French grammar, which is supposed to be significant, the story being that of a grammar school.

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yes...in terms of grammar, etre and avoir are the two most important verbs in the french language. one or the other is required for every compound conjugation of any verb in the language.

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It is one of the first and most difficult thing you must learn in the french language in school. I thought it meant "to be and to have" (French people may correct me on that). And of course this is also a significant theme in this documentury and in life ofcourse.

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Yes, it means to be and to have.

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I remember my pain in learning French, and I will never forgot Avoir et Etre and their conjugations.

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Je suis
Tu es
Il/Elle/On est
Nous sommes
Vous êtes
Ils/Elles sont

J'ai
Tu a
Il/Elle/On a
Nous avons
Vous avez
Ils/Elles ont

And that's just present. God, I'm glad I finished french (with a 3.9 out of 10).

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no biggy

Tu as*

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[deleted]

It's even more significant, as the only way to learn your French verbs is by rote. And that is how M Lopez teaches..on paper, or chalk and talk. Very little manipulation of objects, coloring in sheets, maths with a pencil only..I'm a teacher, and I don't teach like that; M Lopez himself says his methods are not modern.
I'm from South Australia and we have one teacher schools too, but we don't teach like the French do. Or at least, like M Lopez does. He's very nice, but his lesson approaches need updating.

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It's an embarrassing indictment of the English-speaking world that the title had to be translated. Maybe if the movie were dubbed it would have attracted bigger audiences. Or, better still, what about a Hollywood remake with Mark Whalberg as Lopez?

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such things should not be joked about

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I've seen what modern methods result in... not impressive. Bring back a solid foundation and fewer gimmicks. Oh, so what.. we have Internet access in all schools in Britain (well, it was one of Mr Blair's aims) ... but do they know how to spell and write and punctuate? Don't make me laugh. All they can do is look at pretty pictures.

And as for being called Monseiur or Madame. I think that's a good thing. I don't want a seven-year-old calling me Tina. Good grief. The schools in Britain and in Germany where I now live don't allow their teachers to be called by first names. In Britain it's still 'sir' and 'miss'. It's all about mutual respect. I noticed he didn't make fun of any of the children or taunt them or do anything like that. Unlike some of the teachers I've come across who shouldn't be allowed to come within ten metres of a child.

No, I like his approach. Quiet, a solid foundation, mutual respect AND - what is most important - he encourages his pupils to carry on thinking for themselves i.e. no spoon-feeding.

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Hmmm... let's see... 19th century... chalk and slate, pencils, no Internet, no TV, no colouring in and gosh.. what do you know? Such out-moded teaching methods meant we had Isambard Kingdom Brunel, Darwin, the Intustrial Revolution and writers such as Jane Austen, the Brontes, Charles Dickens etc.

Hmm.. modern teaching methods and we've got.... computer games, video games, Bridget Jones's Diary (not v. v. good), chick-lit in general and authors like Nick Hornby. Hmmm.. wonder if they'll be studied in the 21st century.

Sorry.. but I've seen the work of children studying German at my old school. What is being produced by 18-year-olds now was what we were doing at a much earlier age and my old German lecturers at Manchester University told me ten years ago that they have to give remdial German grammar lessons before they can even start with the literature based course of studies. And yes.. the German grammar books being used at secondary schools are modern.. lots of colourful writing and nice little photos. But they can't string a sentence together. Oh yes,.. we MUST have modern methods. SUCH an improvement.

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Etre et avoir are, as mentioned before, the most important verbs in French. They are used in virtually every sentence hence you can't start speaking or writing French without knowing how to conjugate them perfectly. In fact it is not even difficult: j'ai; tu as; il a; nous avons; vous avez; ils ont for avoir and je suis; tu es; il est; nous sommes; vous êtes; ils sont for être.
In the Dutch-speaking part of Belgium, where I come from, this is thought to us in the fifth grade of primary school (10 year-olds) and you can never pass the French course in the fifth grade without knowing the two verbs as they are so important to the French language.
I used to hate French as a subject at school, but after having spent 3 months in France as an Erasmus student I became very fond of the French language, people, films, French literature, humour etc. Vive les Français, they are fascinating.
Maybe the same thing will happen to me some day with German!

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For a great taste of French literature, check out Emile Zola's "Germinal." I read it in my western civ course, and learned to detest it.

At any rate, Être et avoir is a great film. When I told my French instructor my mom had given me a copy of it she'd found at Blockbuster for $4.99, Mme. Baird went crazy. Apparently she had seen it when it was released in France and absolutely loved it.

On the two verbs, one might note that être and avoir are the two verbs used to conjugate the past tense in French. Être is used for verbs of action, like arriver, aller, and such. Avoir is used for every verb that doesn't take être.

For instance: J'ai mangé but Je suis arrivé. The first(I've eaten) takes avoir because it isn't an action verb, while the second(I've arrived) takes être because it describes action and so on.

And there's your french lesson for the day

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Actually, the rule is: "avoir" for transitive verbs (vers that can be constructed with a direct object), and "etre" for intransitive verbs. Your French instructor was not very good if he/she told you that "manger" was not an action verb! That's the best action you can get in France!

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I studied a Nick Hornby book in the 21st century. As a piece of contemporary literature and an insight into and analysis of the mindset of a passionate follower of something that has an impact on aspects of Britain’s social anthropology, Fever Pitch was actually quite an enjoyable read.

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[deleted]

As for Mr Lopez's methods being "old fashioned" I tend to disagree. Although he says his methods aren't modern, his way of teaching is reminiscent of European teaching as a whole. Having attended school in France, Switzerland and Australia, I found the Europeans to adopt more of an "empty vessel" approach to teaching whereas the Australian way of teaching was much more open to student input. I think you'll find that the differences in styles of education come as a result of the differences between the methods taught in the universities in respective countries.

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While I understand what you are saying, katmailoz, you are not necessarily the difinitive authority on this topic.

Sure, YOU like to have a modern approach to teaching, but it just so happens Mr Lopez chooses not to. The children learn, socialise and are provided with a satisfactory educational environment. Therefore, perhaps you need to look to more traditional methods yourself, instead of criticizing others?

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I don't think his methods need updating at all. I taught in both Australia and the U.K. and now teach in Taiwan. They are from one extreme to the other, and the French/European way (or at least Mr Lopez's version of it) seems to be better. In Australia and the U.K., there's absolutely no rigour, discipline, respect for others or self respect whatsoever in many schools, and we graduate students from high school who are borderline illiterate and innumerate and have little idea about anything or anyone else in the world beyond their own immediate whims and fancies -- they can complain loudly about those for hours. In Taiwan, there is rote learning and standardised testing for its own sake to the point where it destroys all creative and critical faculties in children, and again, on a daily basis I witness incredibly selfish and reckless behaviour in society simply because discipline here is draconian but never instills a sense of personal involvement in one's actions and a stake in society.

Mr Lopez realised that there are/were times when it's necessary to just knuckle down and do the work. Sometimes, there is no easy way around that. Yet, even with the little ones, he had an incredibly philosophical way about him, and he encouraged every student to think about deeper issues of self and others.

I could imagine a kid like Jojo could really have gone off the rails and been an unholy terror. Maybe he later did, I don't know. However, I could also see that Mr Lopez probably reined him in. Not only did he probably make a significant difference in teaching him French, mathematics and other such subjects, he probably also made a significant difference in teaching him to be more disciplined and persistent and to have some respect for others, and perhaps most importantly, himself.

Frankly, I was in awe throughout the movie.

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Etre et avoir is the title of a classic Marcel book on existential thinking.

Thus, the movie title is a multi-level evocative one.

Regards,
Richard Melson

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that's the most interesting comment on this forum.... but i have a little doubt, ¿what's the relation between the title of the movie and the movie itself?

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French writers use this distinction in two ways:

1. to distinguish between "possesssive individualism" of bourgeois society where you are what you have.

As opposed to:

2. you are who you are and not what you have.

A memorable teacher/exemplar would communicate these points.

It might also just be a "multiple reference" which sets a mood and is not rigorous or completely logical. It also refers to mundane grammar lessons too.

Regards,

richardhot

Richard Melson

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There is also the Erich Fromm book, To Have or to Be, which is a kind of meditation on right living in the 20th c.

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etre is the present tense of the verb "to be" in french and avoir is the present tense of "to have"

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Not true.

Etre is the full infinitive translation of "to be" and avoir is the full infinitive translation of "to have." Be and have are used as infitives in English also, which is why the disctinction should be made. As for their conjugations in the present tense, indicative mood:

Etre:
Je suis
Tu es
Il/Elle est
Nous sommes
Vous etes
Ils/Elles sont

Avoir:
J'ai
Tu as
Il/Elle a
Nous avons
Vous avez
Ils/Elles ont

The compound tenses, such as the past perfect, past infinitive, future past, etc. all use either etre or avoir as their helping verbs. These verbs are irregular in their conjugations in all tenses and moods, making them very challenging to the French student, and international student alike.

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Nope. They're irregular but because we use them so often we remember then instinctively in almost every tense... The problem for children who begin to have this almost instinctive knowledge is much more their writing...Believe me. ;-)

Then we can make many mistakes on plenty of other verbs which are used far less frequently...lol

Very true the title has several meaning.

First it's a reference to the teaching of the basic French grammar through those two important verbs.

Then it's a hint at the difference between to be and to have, very philosophical...

Etc...

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KISS! Three cheers for those who highlighted that the tittle is based on one of the worse headache of the french language, (Which by itself is already a big headache). I like to think that the title was simply given on this basis alone, I wonder if it thought to be the international success it became and therefore more directed at a french audience. Just the same, no harm in looking a little further with a pinch of philosophy. I also wonder if to be and to have and the whole French grammar were my ulterior motive to emmigrate to Australia? Australia where I hear wiht monotonous repetition that English is the hardest language to learn. Well it's not easy and I remember in the french schools I attended we used to say that we needed a hot potato in our mouth and go for it: "haaow too yoo too"!.
No such device is available for "to be and to have" Just like learning to write chinese, only a few thousand drills will get you somewhere. I'm not sure I've got great empathy for the academie francaise (see small letters!)and I'm sure I'm not alone in this, french has its Cockney version too, rymming slang and the rest as well with again little thought for "L'Academie Francaise" and I feel a little sorry for those who learn corect french and find themselves in a usual french crowd. No wonder that "down under" I get another monotonous "Ah the frenchs are so rudes they ignore you when you try to speak to them"! Ha ha ha. I dare not telling them that when I speak english after nearly 40 years I sometimes get the same. Yep, pardon my french but it still come through thick and hard (Thank God for the key board!)
But here we ARE, and we HAVE a wonderful film that brought me back to primary school not far from what is depicted in the film. I remember sending a letter to my mother to tell her I came second at the end of, perhaps, my first class. Second of three! Our class had possibly 4 grades in it, and I think we walked some 5 to 7 kms to get there, collecting chestnuts on the way and God knows what else we did then.
I hear that France is rethinking its teaching methods as the modern way was not as cracked up to be all it promissed!
Well for me it's Keep It Simple Stupid!
Cheers MM

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Enjoyed your post. KISS method indeed; first get a 2x4. If anything is 'evidence based' or has 'standards' in the title, run. Get away from the blithering idiot.
There are things in the classroom which need to be taught; to you. You never close the door with a single student in the room, male or female, any age. You always have your back to a wall and walk the perimeter. You never ask for opinions after a fight, you go with what you saw and heard. You never ask for backups from administration, you demand it.
Now can we get to acedemics.

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Of course the title is LITERALLY the 2 most important verbs in French, and in that sense, alludes to the grammar classes where they'll be recited endlessly.

BUT it also reminds us of the truism that whatever these kids will BE and whatever they will HAVE (and I don’t necessarily mean materially) is greatly shaped in their formative years, in schools such as this one.

With a wonderful teacher like M. Lopez, they learn so much more than merely reciting verbs and times tables. Kids fortunate enough to have grown up under his tutelage will learn patience, diplomacy, gentleness and how to express themselves.



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[deleted]

The little school has not much in the way of space, equipment and teaching but it is replete with life and its substance, being.

In the midst of winter, I found there was, within me, an invincible summer

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