lets be honest guys


hey everybody, I am a enormous film fan and respect films of all genres both far and wide. After viewing morvern callar and watching with an open heart and mind to it. Even if it was an "intensive character study", I must say...honestly and bluntly...
this was one of the worst movies I have ever seen,
like even if you liked this film,
sit down, and ask yourself how many times you could actually watch this.

if you liked it cool,
but it was just awful for me,
not even a good character study, I dont even WANt to connect with that character.

just wondering if I'm the only one.
thanks and sorry to fans.
didnt mean to be an a__hole

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Nope, you're not the only one. Just watched it myself and must say that just because a film is long and dull doesn't make it important, nor does an important subject warrant such ponderous treatment. A defter touch would have made this thing so much more worthwhile. I find it ironic that fans of this film and others like it (and lets face it, first year film classes are brimming with films just like this) laud it for being different than typical Hollywood films in that it doesn't pander to audiences or tell them what to feel, when the truth is that this film does nothing but beat you over the head in its demand to be taken seriously. I found it just as shamelessly manipulative as anything in the mainstream, and torturously labored on top.

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Thats an excellent post, and thankyou for responding,I admire your honestly and clearly put statement. It truely is my sentiments exactly

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amen

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If you found it amazing, that's fine. I'm glad you got something out of it. And you are correct in your assumption that it must have said something to me strongly enough to get me to post on the IMDB about it; I've somehow resisted the temptation to post on the Feardotcom page. In order to clarify (for me at least, I don't presume to speak for the original poster), Morvern Callar represents a particulary virulent strain of cinematic narcissism that would seem to be the opposite of mainstream filmmaking, but is in fact (in my humble estimation) something closer to its handmaiden. Pointing up the disposable frivolity of a low-brow genre film is not worth the time it takes to type: it's fish in a barrel. But poking holes in the hypocritical pretensions of a workmanlike piece of kitchen-sink crap like Morvern Callar I find inexplicably enjoyable. And ignorant, mean-spirited suppositions about the taste of a poster who disagrees with you ( ... probably enjoy dull ... etc) only goes to prove my point that films like this and those who are suckered in by them are merely naked Emporers.

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Okay, I came here because a friend of mine told me about the movie and told me she thought I'd like it. I haven't seen the movie yet, so I have no opinion, but I just wanted to bring something to DBP's attention. Do you see the irony in this response???

And ignorant, mean-spirited suppositions about the taste of a poster who disagrees with you ( ... probably enjoy dull ... etc) only goes to prove my point that films like this and those who are suckered in by them are merely naked Emporers.

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I don't think saying that the Emporer has no clothes qualifies as ignorant or mean-spirited.

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It implies that.

Well, any movie that can get people so worked up is definitely worth seeing. I'm intrigued.

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If you love movies in general, then yes, it's an interesting film to talk about. But in this case my feelings about it have more to do with what the film seems to be a symptom of and less to do with this specific film itself. But do post after you see it. Curious to know what you think.

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I just watched this movie today and really WANTED to like it, but I thought it was sorta............boring. And I also don't see it as a good character study- it didn't even seem like she WAS grieving. But maybe her character was shutting it out or in denial or something, who knows, who cares. I just didn't find it interesting and I too love film and have an open mind.

But I will say that I could have done without all the nippleage. Okay, 2 British chicks taking a bath together? No wonder it had so many wonderful reviews (all by men) on the cover of the movie case!

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Like others have said, this film could have effectively presented its message in a much shorter version. There were a few scenes that were well done, such as the party scenes. People gather to socialize, yet they weren't connecting; walls of sound and drug-induced distortions symbolizing or creating separation between them.

But on the whole, the film is severely diluted by very long unnecessary takes; cutting the film in half would've made it more powerful. Yes, yes, I know some will claim that the subtle nuances only they and the director understand is what makes every second of footage drenched with essence.

If you enjoy excavating meaning from nuances in very long scenes, for example, of a person silently smoking cigarettes or merely sitting, this film is for you.

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I agree. This movie was about unlikable assholes. I wanted them all to die. Other films about less-than-perfect people usually allow their characters some redeeming qualities. Not so with this movie. It was humorless and dull.
Movies have so much potential ... there is no excuse for boring the crap out of the audience when you are making a movie, when you have the use of sight, sound, and movement.

I am a big fan of independent films which are painfully honest and real. This one was a disappointment. The worst movie i've seen in the last year.

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I just sat here thinking of something moderately intelligent to say so that I could avoid any backlash of comments from phoney fans of this movie...but...


this movie blows...


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Hi, I was watching this on dvd and had to pause it just now to check out what other people have said - because it seems really boring and unpleasant, yet the reviews had been great! And I love indie films - when they're genuine - this seemed contrived and manipulative. Although Samantha Morton's acting is good, that doesn't save the movie for me.

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her acting is good? could have fooled me.
the corpse was more exciting.

this movie was just flat out boring. uneventful. an insult to my intelligence. do yourself a favor: read the dvd box's summary and spare yourself the 120 minutes of eye-gougingly boring agony

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It's true, as a character study this film is somewhat murky, but I think what needs addressed is the reason behind why the character is hard to relate to, sympathize with and overall understand within the films context. Every person in a moment of moral ambiguity who makes the choice to become someone they haven't been is forced to deal with oncoming situations where they must decide who they are and what they want on a dime. So in place of so many complaints about how labored the film is, how it's boring and meandering, take the character from point zero and realize the triumph of the movie and the filmmaker is to show both the liberating aspects of such an act as well as the navel gazing, slow burn lows that occur thereafter. Ramsey is a serious filmmaker and an expert at atmospherics. I don't invalidate strong reactions to the film, negative and positive, but wouldn't say that fans of the film are 'phoney' or misdirected film school blowhards. Use what this movie gives you--- a character much like LaMotta in Raging Bull, where development is more dependent upon outside forces and the motions we go through in honor of those forces as opposed to some easily relatable screenplay-ish character that goes through the emotional gamut.

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I absolutely agree with you!
I don't understand mattvanstone's point. why is it necessary to identify with the main character? this is the response that mainstream movies look for, and Morvern Callar isn't about that, it's more realistic than that!

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If you approach this movie as a character study your going to be disappointed. I liked the music and the Spanish scenery, but I left the movie unmoved. It's boring and it provides little payoff for those who hold out until the end waiting for substance. It's actually a pretty bad movie. Despite all of the problems I have described and its pretty crappy story, I kinda like it. I dunno why.

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I don't think the spanish lovely scenary is there just for the sake of it, but to describe the kind of places and kind of fun that British working class dreamms about. This helps us understand something about the characters we are analysing.

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It's funny -- I read most of the posts on this thread, as well as the "worst movie ever" thread, and came away fairly dumbfounded. I'll be the first to admit the film requires patience from its viewers, especially on a small screen, where the many poetic visual textures are reduced to the size of a sitcom set. I'll even admit that the characters' actions are morally ambiguous and potentially alienating to those who like their movie heroes with no shades of gray. To call a movie boring and pointless, however, is strictly a matter of subjective individual taste. Some may have found the brief scene boring and pointless where Morvern visted Lanna's grandmother, fixed her coffee and watched the snow fall. Whereas I gleaned chapters of information from this simple, silent act -- about Morvern's inner kindness, her indecision, her need for companionship without chatter, her sense of her own mortality and the role nature will play in her forthcoming decisions. Scenes like this I find infinitely more exciting than a car chase.

To call any movie -- and its fans -- narcissistic and phony reveals more about the the viewer than it does the movie ... usually frustration in being unable to share a common, if minority, opinion.

In other words: if you're colorblind, it's fair to admit you can't see the rainbow -- but don't tell me the rainbow doesn't exist, or that I'm pretentious for imagining it.

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I couldn't agree more istra and arturobandini.

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I fail to see the pretensions that DBP speaks of. It tells a story in a an unconventional manner however it is never polemical so i can't understand how it can be hypocritical. The film has aesthetic beauty which is praise worthy regardless of it's narrative form. Pretentious is such a terrible criticism anyway. This film never claims anything more than your average mainstream film. Pretentiousness is unfullfilled ambition, which is no bad thing. Nevertheless people use the term pretentious in a derogatory sense to club any film which attempts to raise it's head above the waters of mediocrity. In general folks, just relax and be open to film-makers efforts, as the film does have it's merit.

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We were open to the 'film-makers efforts' - but Lynne Ramsay failed to engage viewers. This kind of film puts off at least 9 out of 10 viewers from ever watching an independent, low budget British film again. The film has no message, no humour and gives it's star, one of the best actresses in the world, almost nothing with which to try and engage the audience. Any actress could have played that role and overall the film would have been just the same, just as pointless. A real waste of Samantha's talent - and the money.

Is it any wonder the vast majority of British cinema-goers will never pay money to see low budget British films? They won't even watch them on TV.

This film failed as entertainment, as art, and even as a feminist tract (all the male characters are two-dimensional stereotypes) - hard to see what the point of it was.

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Firstly, I along with others on this board found this film entertaining however it isn't the intention of the film to be entertainment in the traditional sense. Furthermore, I'm not sure what qualifies you to dismiss its status as art.

Mass appeal clearly wasn't a major priority when making this film. In spite of that this does not mean the film has a negative impact on British independent film making. The role of the film-maker is not, paticularly an auteur like Lynn Ramsay, to generate a profit. Movern Callar was generally critically well recieved and won numerous awards (as can be seen in the awards & nominations section) therefore surely it publicises and encourages British film making. Films like this aren't expected to make a profit nor appeal to everyone hence not all films are like this. Why don't these 9 people who got turned off realise this is merely one film that has no nescessary likeness to other independent film they might see? When I went to see "The Last Samurai" not long ago i found it was dissappointing however that won't stop me going to see "Troy" simply because they're both films with large budgets about warriors.

I personally was engaged with Movern's moral ambiguity and struggle with alienation. What sort of thing would or does engage you as a viewer, i mean this genuinely, as i'm interested in what this film lacks in this respect.

Without Samatha Morton the film would be far worse off. She conveyed a world of uncertainty in that "blank" stare. I felt the lack of emotion was more a existential repression which illiminated the character.

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I agree the director's primary concern isn't to generate a profit, but one of their concerns surely is (or ought to be) to take into account the audience watching the film, and Lynne insulted her audience's intelligence with numerous meaningless, long empty scenes that added nothing to the story and which seemed to exist only to show Samantha looking still more desperate - or alienated as you put it. The audience got that message in the first few minutes of the film. The film might have been ok as a short, but was stretched out about 3 times longer than there was material and filled by meaningless, long sequences like those driving around Spain.

I know the film won some awards. That's a bit scary, but no doubt good evidence that Lynne Ramsay and the film's producers are skilled, busy networkers. It was nominated somewhere or other for Best Screenplay!!

I only watched this because Samantha was in it. Normally I would be firmly in the camp of those who never watch low budget British films. I did watch a fair few, back in the great days of Film Four - but a large proportion of them display the smugness and self-satisfaction personified by Kenneth Branagh and Emma Thompson, which is endemic in the Brit film industry. Even independent Brit film-makers display this smugness - even when the luvvies who run the Brit film industry and BAFTA year after year completely ignore their efforts, as can be evidenced by the fact BAFTA has never even nominated Samantha for anything!

Most of the 'independent' films I liked I can't even remember the titles of, they seem to disappear without trace. 'Under the Skin' was one. If you didn't see it, that was a film that told a similar story to 'Movern Caller' - but did it by engaging the audience and not insulting them. Technically it was far better than Movern, on a far smaller budget - and didn't have a single wasted minute.

I disagree with you about Samantha and the film. Any actress can stare blankly into a camera and portray alienation/desperation/existential fright - if it's just staring into the screen and not reacting to some event or conversation, which is mostly all she was asked to do in this.

I'm glad you liked the film, I'm sure lots of people do, but it annoyed me, more than anything I've seen for years. I think it's the lack of enthusiasm for making films it seems to show - all that wasted filming showing scenes nothing whatsoever to do with the story, basically a short story inflated to feature length just because they had the money. That's what it feels like watching it. It's enthusiastic film-making I like, whatever the genre, directors who clearly love their job - and know how lucky they are to be doing it. Directors who show passion. There was no passion in 'Movern' - imo of course. Guy Maddin is my all-time favourite film-maker. Clearly he loves it, and probably still, like when a child, behind his lens imagines he is Orson Welles! Lars von Trier shows the same passion too. I thought Dogville was a beautiful film. No doubt Mark Kermode hates it and Jonathan Ross would rather talk about an Eddie Murphy film on Film 2004 than about Dogville, but that says a lot really. Did you see it?

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dhnet2, what exactly is it about this film that you find so life-threatening? Honestly, your conspiracy theories are absurd and reactionary. You really think MORVERN CALLAR was a plot that Ramsay, Morton, BAFTA, the BBC (not to forget Branagh and Thompson) cooked up just to drain your tax dollars while boring AND insulting you with their intentionally passionless form of filmmaking? You really think that they schemed and "networked" (!) to drive the public away from independent films?

Has it occurred to you that your opinion (which of course you're entitled to) may not speak for everyone -- even though it may speak for the majority of whiney posters on this thread? By carrying on in such a histrionic manner, you're insulting the intelligence of those who enjoyed the movie.

That hysterical, intolerant tone is what provoked me to comment above. Why can't this movie's detractors just say it wasn't their cup of tea and leave it at that? Why the need to be so melodramatic and act like this movie is depleting your oxygen supply? Maybe it has more power over you than you'd like to admit.

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I think I've explained why the film annoyed me so much. Of course it's just my opinion, and others like the film - though I haven't read people saying they like it with much passion. They say they like it, but not passionately. Passion isn't intolerance, it's just passion. People (particularly the English) criticise Dogville and say Lars von Trier insults the viewer by not using props and buildings and the camerawork - but those views aren't insulting the people who love and defend his film. It's just discussion isn't it? A film that causes some people to hate it is better than a film which leaves everyone nuetral about it, and I'd hope Lynne Ramsay agrees with that. She may have intended her film to be that provocative to a certain type of film viewer such as myself. If so she did her work well, no film has annoyed me like this one. I think it's probably actually because she seemed to waste Samantha's great talent so much. In my opinion!

But conspiracy theories? I mentioned no conspiracy theories. Branagh and Thompson (and others) *are* smug and self-satisfied and make lazy films. I've never seen Lynne Ramsay on screen so I don't know about her. I don't think Samantha Morton is.

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I don't believe the long shots, which seemingly have no narrative/characterisation purposes, are insulting to the audience (at least they weren't to me). I simply enjoyed the imagery of these shots which served to establish the atmosphere (i felt the film excelled here) and the mood. For me, the visuals had a poetic quality beyond literal progession of the narrative.

I think the development of the character of Morvern from near-comatose hedonist to a more free thinking individual was deserving of the run time. I guess its just a difference of opinion but its fun talking about it nonetheless.

Morton brings a depth and complexity which most other actors couldn't convey with the same inanimate presence. Also, the performance of non-professial Kathleen McDermott, as Lana, was great, raw with vernacular effrontery.

Argeed, a nomination for best screenplay is absurd :D. I haven't seen 'Under the Skin' or 'Dogville' both of which sound worth catching. Ashamedly, i've only seen one Lars Von Trier film; 'The Element of Crime'.

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"..the visuals had a poetic quality beyond literal progession of the narrative." Blimey! I take back what I wrote back to arturobandini - you are defending the film with passion. Fair enough, I watched most of the film again earlier and the bits in the Spanish hotel/club are good at showing the mind numbing emptyness of that experience. I wasn't saying there aren't merits in the film, just that a) it's way too long, and b) it isn't telling much of a story - or one that I think many people will identify with or care about. The fatal flaw is that Movern only manages to escape the nightmare because of the book, whereas all the other characters, who aren't so lucky, are doomed - and of those Lynne only cares about Movern's best 'friend'. Movern doesn't actually do anything to deserve redemption.

I remember 'The Element of Crime' now - that was a wacky movie, containing I remember one of the most hysterically bad-but-funny lines ever in a movie, spoken by a hilarously out of shape Michael Elphick to the beautiful woman who desires him. Magic!

'Under the Skin' is a mighty fine movie and Samantha is awesome in it. It had a very low budget and that shows but it is very inventive and intense. I think you'll love it and I can't believe Lynne Ramsay didn't have it in mind when making Movern.

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Pardon me for crashing your and BeatOswald's conversation, dhnet2 -- hope you both don't mind. I read your response to me above, dh, and when you aren't hand-wringing about the Injustice Of It All, your words are a welcome addition to the conversation. I happen to agree (for the most part) with your criticism of the Branagh/Thompson output. DOGVILLE hasn't opened in the States yet, but I was always a Blair Brown fan, so I'll check it out; von Trier, whom I do find extremely talented, nevertheless rubs me the wrong way in interview after interview (talk about condescending to one's audience). UNDER THE SKIN was only okay, I thought -- saved by the performances of Morton, Rushbrook and Tushingham, but otherwise trite and better-suited to TV than the big screen.

Anyway, dh, you're quite wrong in stating that MORVERN doesn't inspire a passionate response from viewers. I've already left far too many posts about this movie on other threads, else I would go into great, boring detail (again) as to why I found it one of the most life-affirming movies I've ever seen. For me, the story moved at a brisk pace and never wore out its welcome. I found every frame, every cut, every "blank stare" packed with grace notes and literary nuance. As you may know, "callar" means "to silence" in Spanish -- and this is one of the very, very, very rare modern films to illustrate the beauty of absolute stillness.

I'm not trying to suggest that you're wrong for not liking it. I just don't understand why the people who don't like this movie tend to be so contemptuous of those who do. Personally, I found ELEPHANT the most revolting movie I'd seen in ages, but I didn't feel the need to attack its creators or its fans on a public form. These small, independent films --whether or not we take each one to heart -- need all the support they can get.

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But you can't support them just because they are small, independent (relatively) low budget films and support them regardless of whether they are good films or not. I think I read somewhere that Lynne Ramsay and the producers had £4 million. Not much compared to most modern films I know, but it is a fortune compared to how much Carine Adler had to make 'Under the Skin'. It is a fortune compared to how much Guy Maddin had to make his early films. You can squander £4 million (nearly $8 million) and make a bad movie with it, just as other film-makers have looked after every penny and made great movies on less than a million, sometimes a lot less than a million - like Carine Adler. Having £4 million for a project is a dream for most aspiring film-makers isn't it. So I don't think just because the film is low budget and 'independent' somehow means it can't be analysed and criticised just as much as a Hollywood blockbuster.

I don't believe I was contemptuous of anyone who liked 'Movern' - my whole approach was that for 99% of British film viewers (in the cinema or at home) Lynne's film was completely obscure, and she surely was well aware of that when making it. She made her film for the 1% who can approach a film as an isolated entity and view it objectively, and that's fine. Those 1% maybe have more patience, or know more about films. Guy Maddin's films probably also alienate most viewers, for different reasons, but in his case he does make every possible effort he can to make them appealing - in a certain kind of way. It's his genre that doesn't appeal to most of a modern audience - not his approach to the audience. Guy wants his films to be loved by everyone, Lynne clearly isn't so troubled. Lucky for her.

We are *never* going to agree on 'Movern Caller'. When you write "..the story moved at a brisk pace", we just to agree to disagree! "..this is one of the very, very, very rare modern films to illustrate the beauty of absolute stillness." Fair enough, I recognise your purity when approaching a film. All I could think when watching it was 'this so-and-so director was so very, very lucky to be able to make a film in the first place, but she is making it for herself and her clique - not for me or the majority'. I could never get over that feeling. No doubt that makes me shallow and not a true lover of films. For me making a film that doesn't attempt to appeal to many people is a waste. I'm sure other aspiring film-makers looked at 'Movern' and thought the same - I was angry on their behalf.

Carine Adler made 'Under the Skin' on a ridiculously small budget and had the sense to allow Samantha to improvise and fully deploy her talent. I think Lynne Ramsay wasted an opportunity to do the same, and that I think is reprehensible, especially when you are lucky enough to have one of the best actresses of your generation at your disposal, someone far more talented at telling a story than Lynne is.

The whole world has seen Dogville already, many of them up to 18 months ago, everyone apart from the USA. Typically it was shown almost nowhere in the UK and where it was shown almost no-one turned up. Aren't Anglo-saxon countries cultured?!

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Watched this on BBC2 the other night after hearing some good reviews about it - I wish I hadn't wasted 95 minutes of my life! A load of boring, pretentious twaddle - it felt like a lifetime sitting through it. How slow can a director make a film feel? Horrible, just bloody horrible!

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I might be completely wrong with the £4m figure, I seem to remember reading it somewhere but it could be total rubbish. £800K for Lock, Stock? That's pretty amazing, Guy Ritchie is a modern master - and he has a sense of humour!

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You're so full of it. I am sick of pretentious losers who assume that because people find this movie boring and otherwise meritless, it's because they want "car chases" or "characters with no shades of gray". Get over yourself!

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