Cloying melodramatics - 2009 loseuteu maemorijeu (2002) Discussion

[–] arcamdunit 18 years ago

This is part of Nippon-phobia. You know that most Asians hated the Japanese for wat they did, so you can't blame them.

I'm a Filipino and I share the exact same feelings that Koreans have felt.

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[–] 18 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Raithen 18 years ago

Never has a thread title so aptly applied to a post within...

... and yes, I'm referring to you, hate-monger.

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[–] arcamdunit 18 years ago

This obvious attack on my heritage as a Chinese-Filipino and on my countrymen will not resolve anything. I suggest you stop it before I report you to the admin.

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[–] thenakedeve 17 years ago

I am getting tired of this Anti-Japanese stuff. My husband and I rented the movie because it looked cool. It started out interesting but it got to a point where the Japanese (as a whole) were portrayed as greedy megalomanics. My husband who is both Japanese and Korean became frustrated. Being part mestiza myself I found the movie at one point irritating. We didn't even finish watching it. What happened with the Japanese so very long ago happened a long time ago. It is time to forgive and learn from our mistakes. The Japanese clearly have and they are moving on it is time the rest the world did too!

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[–] setnaffa 17 years ago

You're forgetting the nose-tombs in Japan (dating from the 1590s and Hideoshi's invasion) and the whole Tokdo (fishing territy) thing...

None of the Asian countries are "over it" as you suggest...

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[–] zoeme 17 years ago

I think you should think more about why this movie was irritating for you other than the fact that you thought the Japanese were portrayed like "megalomaniacs". This movie, at times, made me feel uncomfortable and squirm as if there was a creepy jello crawling up my leg... And it was because it did make me wonder about history. What if Japanese annexation didn't end? What would have happened to Korea? And where the hell I would have ended up... or not at all... The movie grazed a sensitive spot in me. It's more than uncomfortable to think about nationalism (not patriotism) and alliances when you are a person who is no longer living in your homeland. Or someone like your husband who is Korean and Japanese.

No doubt. This movie has many flaws, especially the plot. Many many holes where characters fall and never come back... The multiverse, time travel strategy was a good one but was not supported with a credible/believable structure (boy, the two main characters were just fine to watch on screen tho >.<)

And, it wasn't so long ago. My dad went thought it and experienced it first hand and he is still alive. It is a lot easier for the agressor to say "move on" than the ones who were oppressed and live with the pain. Just look around you. It's not just Koreans... look at Jews for instance. Are you going to tell them to move on? The point is, pain isn't something you could just erase. It lingers for a long time. Considering, as a nation, Korea has bounced back quite quickly...

Of course, I much prefer to watch a more complete, nuanced films but I still think they should make more movies that deal with history, in a pop/Hollywood style like this one, even if they are flawed like hell. At least, as an individual, as a collective, we are acknowledging that the history is still on our minds whether we like it or not....

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[–] haggar 13 years ago

I don't think Korea is much better off right now, with the North a gigantic concentration camp. Millions of people have died, there, mostly starved for no reason, others in actual concentration camps. Others yet, in gruesome experiments of toxic gases.

As for the Chinese angry at Japan: Mao, in the Great Leap Forward, killed many more Chinese than the Japanese invasion. The number is around 20 million dead. But not a single Chinese is going to raise his or her voice against Chairman Mao. But it is very useful to inflame nationalistic fervor in the citizenry, from time to time. And it will get worse if/when the economic situation in China worsens. Then it will become extremely useful to channel the anger towards old wounds and Japan.

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[–] vicky_lc2001-1 13 years ago

What if Japanese annexation didn't end?

It made me consider that as well, if Japan had won WW2, I imagine my country (Philippines) would've been under them still. I've heard horrendous stories of what they did back then, it was certainly descriptive of a 'megalomaniac'.

It is a lot easier for the agressor to say "move on" than the ones who were oppressed and live with the pain.

^^^THIS.

OPEN YOUR EYES! dailymotion.com/video/xbi2hi_1993-chandler-molestation-extortion_news

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[–] wasspam 13 years ago

Everyone has gotten over WW2 except Korea and China. Its laughable and immature as the posters defending this POS movie.

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[–] jaquil20070911 17 years ago

Alot of East Asians are still angry with Japan because unlike Germany they never fessed up and said "my bad". The Japanese never "got over" it, they simply ignored all the atrocities that they commited and expected everyone else to do the same.

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[–] kawada_shougo 15 years ago

Learn history! Japan apologized many times for what they did. Maybe it's you, deaf East Asians, who doesn's hear them. In this case, it's your problem, not theirs.

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[–] vicky_lc2001-1 13 years ago

Learn history! Japan apologized many times for what they did.

Really? Then why are their highly documented war criminals & crimes honored as national heroes? & why have the victims not received any compensations like what happened with Germany?

OPEN YOUR EYES! dailymotion.com/video/xbi2hi_1993-chandler-molestation-extortion_news

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[–] vicky_lc2001-1 13 years ago

the Japanese (as a whole) were portrayed as greedy megalomanics.

That's because they were, study your history & listen to the traumatized surviving victims still unrecognized by their oppressors. I'm all for moving on, as long as we learn from our PAST mistakes & remember or honor those that made sacrifices for us. The problem is the Japanese have not learned from their mistakes which is why it's very understandable for those they victimized to still hold some grudge against them. By 'mestiza' I assume you are a Filipina? A failing characteristic of the Filipinos, we don't honor the past nor do we learn from them which is why we keep making the same mistakes over & over, we just never learn.

OPEN YOUR EYES! dailymotion.com/video/xbi2hi_1993-chandler-molestation-extortion_news

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[–] kawada_shougo 15 years ago

So you wanna say that your people are such a brainless that they can't understand that the world changes and current Japan is a totally different country? In this case I should say you moved not far away from Americans which still think that the Russians are communists.

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[–] setnaffa 18 years ago

Dang, you almost sound like you wanted the Japanese guys to win!!

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[–] ronin1988-1 18 years ago

I don't care whether the Japanese win.
Though I'm not Korean, I can understand your feelings towards Japan, but this movie is sometimes more than ridiculous.
It is on of those films, where you can imagine what happens next.
It's a cool movie, the idea is great, but sometimes this movie is too typical and emotional ... even the idea of the USA and Japan are fighting in WW2 together? The US has betrayed Europe, it's origin because of some east asians?
This is stupid.
In this I have to agree with Sasu I Vinge completely.

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[–] !!!deleted!!! (4524359) 18 years ago

"It's a cool movie, the idea is great, but sometimes this movie is too typical and emotional ... even the idea of the USA and Japan are fighting in WW2 together? The US has betrayed Europe, it's origin because of some east asians? "

It isn't even remotely as stupid as when they picture all americans as heroes and the rest of the world as something thankful of usas existance and we are all in debt to you.

"Civilization is a *beep* failure" - Serj Tankian, System of a down

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[–] proterozoic 18 years ago

Yea... i know what you mean. I've been watching some Korean films lately, most recently "Natural City," and it seems to be a common feature: really intriguing premises and ideas that are somewhat marred by some of the most unsubtle melodrama I've ever seen. This is one of the most apparent cultural differences between East Asia and the West. Over there, melodrama, soft pop and the like don't (yet) have fallen out of fashion due to a postmodern attitude, like they have here. I haven't yet decided if that's bad or just different.

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[–] bumfromkorea 18 years ago

As a Korean, allow me to apologize for my countrymen's backward ways of clinging to humanism in what is being dictated as a "Postmodernist" World. We Asians are so primitive that when we see love, family, and tradition in movies, we weep like little wusses, when we should be just like the Glorious American-European and scoff, the ones who are so superior that they have gone past the natural human experience and unto the dehumanizing machinization.

As for our nationalistic side, we are so sorry that we're proud of our multi-millenia history when our country is so crappy compared to yours. We should just trash our way of life just because you, the God-Like American-Europeans, think we should.

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[–] alex_neweisod 18 years ago

LOL

Please, don't judge everyone from Europe so harshly. I like Korean movies very much and one of reasons is what they are so different from typical holyweird crap.
Yet, I still think what Shiri was better than LM. And Shiri has very melodramatic and nationalist-minded plot as well.

It's better to have a gun and not need it, than to need it and not have it!

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[–] sjgood 18 years ago

I think unless you know korea well you do not know the hatred towards the Japanese that is the backdrop to this movie.

I liked the movie up until the point when history was revealed as being changed. I thought it had been an interesting what if up until then.

What I don't get is why the guy who changed his glasses was killed...anyone?

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[–] smithsome 18 years ago

The guy who changed his glasses was the assassin dressed in black. Sakamoto knew the glasses from the fight - saw that he changed his glasses, and knew that he was part of the frame-up.

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[–] theslimone 16 years ago

@bumfromkorea

So have you forgotten the Americans that saved Korea from Japan? Have you forgotten the America that saved you from the North Koreans? Have you forgotten all the millions of hard earned American tax payer dollars that have paid for your countries rebuilding after World War II? Have you forgotten the American soldiers still helping to rebuild your country's military and infrastructure? We Americans are really bad........we allow our money and service men/women to aid countries. Countries who don't appreciate it or remember the millions of lives lost in wars we didn't start. The very fact you have a computer can be thanks to the USA. Without us you would be under a communist country that limits your freedom.......shame on America and our culture that allows our people to aid around the world. Look up the facts on how much aid we give around the world. It isn't corporation tax dollars, it is average GOD LIKE AMERICANS, who you should be thanking for your freedom of speech to say such things.....to weep if you want...but you can because of AMERICA.

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[–] kawada_shougo 15 years ago

Maybe you have forgotten what your America did with Hiroshima and Nagasaki? Are you proud of this? Or maybe you have forgotten what your soldiers did with tens thousand of Japanese women during the occupation. Are you proud of this too? Yeah, these are really a worthy actions of a great nation!

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[–] vicky_lc2001-1 13 years ago

I would also like to thank the Great America for eliminating the remaining Japanese out of Intramuros by bombing the once very glorious & beautiful city of Manila & millions upon millions of it's native citizens. You did wise by killing our men, women & children just to get at the Japanese, thank you AMERICA.

& let's not forget your great service by almost completely extinguishing from the face of the planet a warrior & proud native people of the Americas with your filth, diseases & murderous rampage. They as well as we are truly grateful to you!-------------> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3RhU6l_550

OPEN YOUR EYES! dailymotion.com/video/xbi2hi_1993-chandler-molestation-extortion_news

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[–] kawada_shougo 15 years ago

There is nothing wrong with melodrama when it looks sincere. Then it's beautiful and touching. But when it's totally false and manipulative like in this film, it's disgusting. And the director must be blamed for such a cheap manipulation.

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[–] Radalan 15 years ago

Bumfromkorea says: Boo hooo hooo hooo

At least most Europeans don't talk about the Nazi and Soviet occupations like they happened yesterday, even though the Soviet occupation in some countries lasted till the 90's.

But wooo ooo ooo, you East Asians talk about Japan like it wss yesterday when the *beep* storm started.

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[–] bumfromkorea 15 years ago

Radalan says: bunch of strawman arguments that were so random, it might as well be a non sequitur.

At least East Asians don't eat cheese imported from the moon! Traitors!

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[–] mradfaber 13 years ago

@Radalan: sure we do! as an Eastern-European whose country was under Soviet control until the 90s I can say that we probably feel the same towards the Soviets as Koreans towards Japanese - they say 'move on', we say 'where's my grandpa's grave'?

Western Europeans don't get it since they first used us as a buffer for both Germans and Soviets during WWII and then left us to be exploited for 70 years in exchange for their peace and prosperity - so stop talking about something you don't understand (Kor vs. Jap, ex-Soviet-block vs. Soviets, small nations dominated by stronger)

In fact we kind of feel like we're living in an alternate version of history which turned really bad for us 70 years ago since our elite (militery, civilian) was herded up and shot in the back of the head somewhere in the forest - maybe we'll find some artefact within the next 30 years and restore it the the proper course

or at least make a movie about it... with long stares and melodramatic scenes ;-)

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[–] judantis_vaizdas 17 years ago

thanks for this thread I've found people, who are asking the same questions about Korean cinema;
I've asked the same questions in the "Natural City" board:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0378428/board/nest/81615345

What the hell answers about Nippon-phobia and Japanese war-past has to do with the the theme of this thread and main question about melodramatism in Korean movies? I can't figure it out.

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[–] grosser Baer 16 years ago

I agree, the director spent too much time with dramatisation. Even the fights were over the top dramatised.
This made the movie too long and nearly boring. But the story was interesting enough to make a quite enjoyable movie.

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[–] kawada_shougo 15 years ago

You are totally right. It's awful. I still can't forget this scene with a little boy in the cellar. How much time were they under fire? It was just ridiculous and stupid! Absolutely unbelievable.

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[–] parodic 14 years ago

Even M. Night Shamalaya didn't take this long to show people staring at one another.

If con is the opposite of pro, wouldn't congress be the opposite of progress?

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[–] vicky_lc2001-1 13 years ago

I actually hated that scene, it was too melodramatic & over the top IMO.

OPEN YOUR EYES! dailymotion.com/video/xbi2hi_1993-chandler-molestation-extortion_news

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