MovieChat Forums > Pisutoru opera (2001) Discussion > wtf

wtf

posted 18 years ago by dvelizflores07
21 replies | jump to latest

dude what the hell is this movie?????

i picked it up at blockbuster expecting some absolute hilarity consisting of this woman assasin, but instead, i got some lolicon and very incoherent junk. Like really, if anyone reads this and takes me to be an immature viewer, they might as well consider themselves a artsy-movie elitist prick. How was anyone supposed to possibly cohesively comprehend what the crap was going on in this film?
Perhaps the director was looking to make viewers take their own meaning of the film. Perhaps the direction was actually a live-version of the often construed "superflat" anime style which criticizes post-war easternized otaku japan culture. However, if youre just watching the movie, like alot of people will probably be doing, this movie is a load of BULL SH!%. I personally dont speak any japanese, so perhaps some of the film's integrity is lost in translation, but what I have been able to gather from discussing it and reading about it, I can't say I even totally understand what went on now. Yes, people can make all kinds of deep connections and say that certain characters represented different social classes or whatever, like the young Sayoko demonstrating the wide-eyed, naive youth of the asian culture who involve themselves in situations and with people far beyond their years or comprehension, or Hundred Eyes illustrating some type of masculinated woman, turned sexually dominant and freaky with power; seriously though, if the director was trying to do that, he pretty much sucked at it.

so what if I'm from the US and I expected something else. Give this movie to anyone in Japan and let me know if they understand any of the crap that just happened on their screen. I realize it's a style of movie, but seriously, it seems like theyre trying a bit too hard to be aesthetically clever when a person watching is only going to remember the various crude sexual innuendos sprinkled into the script.

like seriously.... wtf

p.s. japan is awesome

p.p.s this movie still sucks balls

[–] kungfucowboy83 18 years ago

can't really dissagree with much of what you said however i have to say i really like this movie. I'm still tring to figure out why. i normally hate these ultra artsy strange type of movies (hated the last ~30mins of 2001 a space odessey, Izo, ect.), but for some reason this just grabs me and makes me like it and i whish i could figure out why. Normally lack of continuity, usage of weird items/people for backgrounds, scenes and characters that are in no way important to the plot and a general complete lack of reality annoy the hell out of me but not with this movie. anyone else feel the same?

[–] the_deathmonkey 18 years ago

i'm very suspisious of people who admit they hate what they don't understand. i didn't understand every little thing in this movie, but to me that's what makes it interesting. there are some movies you watch with your left brain and some you watch with your right brain.

[–] JonathanWellington 18 years ago

I'm guessing you're one of those people that think that a movie has to have a coherent plot and political, spiritual, and philosophical messages to be good.

Never watch another Suzuki, boy. Go beat off to "Persona".

[–] dirkbelig-1 18 years ago

I'm guessing you're one of those people that think that a movie has to have a coherent plot and political, spiritual, and philosophical messages to be good.

And I'm guessing that you're a film snob who believes that the less coherent and more alienating a movie is, the better it is because it allows you to feel superior to the proles who "don't get it". Get over yourself.

I watched this last night and found it too long and nearly incomprehensible, though I enjoyed the way it was framed and lit like still fashion photography and not your typical movie. While it had energy at the beginning, the constant bewilderment rapidly tired me and my g/f out and it was at least a half-hour too long considering the paucity of actual story.

While it was interesting to look at, there's little to latch onto for those not looking to snob out and sneer at the fools who like coherence in their entertainment.

[–] zillion29 18 years ago

I simply don't understand why people who have such close-minded approaches to film (especially foreign) even bother to watch these movies. Seriously, why on earth would you watch a Seijun Suzuki movie and NOT expect there to be some ambiguity and incomprehendible shiiiizat?

At his age, Suzuki just doesn't give a flying crap about anything but making visually stimulating silly stuff, even less so than he did in his 40s. Why can't you just let yourself be immersed in the imagery of the film instead of trying to create a definitive synopsis that simply cannot exist?

The folks who have trouble with this type of flick probably can't even handle the more artsy elements of a Spielberg movie. Why don't you all just stick to Ron Howard and Rob Reiner movies and leave the weightier stuff to those willing to enjoy it?

[–] kungfucowboy83 17 years ago

why is this nessicarrily a wightier flim than a film with a more coherant plot. film is bolth literature and art just because a director decides to focus more on the art aspect than the storytelling doesn't make it better or worse than a movie that with a focus more on storytelling than being visually artistic or unreal.

IMO In this movie the story was mearly a canvas for the art to be painted on. It worked well and was a very interesting movie i can watch over and over agian. however there are other movies that use the art as their canvas to paint the story and i think they are just as good movies.

[–] Sanjuro-15 17 years ago

I find that the focus on style and imagery over conventional plot makes it easy to watch over and over again. It's not that difficult to grasp the plot after a couple of times if that's what you really want to do. Whatever you do don't try watching any of David Lynch's recent films if you're frustrated at not understanding the 'story' in Pistol Opera.

[–] Bogart91 17 years ago

how old is the nude girl when she filmed that part names Bond James Bond

[–] sdsungod 17 years ago

***I'm guessing you're one of those people that think that a movie has to have a coherent plot and political, spiritual, and philosophical messages to be good. ***

Um, that actually sounds pretty reasonable. You can put me in that category, too. This movie gets 3 out of 10 from me. Entertaining but plotless.

"Enough of that technical talk, Foo!"

[–] kazenokishi 17 years ago

"I simply don't understand why people who have such close-minded approaches to film (especially foreign) even bother to watch these movies. Seriously, why on earth would you watch a Seijun Suzuki movie and NOT expect there to be some ambiguity and incomprehendible shiiiizat? "

Well, like the poster, I picked this up at Blockbuster on an impulse. I regularly rent Japanese movies from the foreign films section at Blockbuster on impulse, sometimes for good (I stumbled onto some of my favorite action movies that way), sometimes not. I had no prior knowledge as to the nature of Suzuki's movies, so I must confess that I also found this movie rather baffling. You don't necessarily have to research a movie to watch it first.

[–] morbid_misanthrope 17 years ago

I just finished watching this film, and although many here seem to be baffled by the movie's meaning, I can tell you it's very simple.

You see, purple monkey pringles can. Who let the shampoo out, dogs? Hamhock flonaise; Mary had a little lamp post. Flim-flam and shim sham. Flibberty jibbetts. Bee-dee bee-dee bee-dee. Pancreatitus, uvulitis--hotdog, freetos, chilimac. Slap the watermelon. Paella.

[–] immersedreality 17 years ago

Are you guys kidding me?

Both the people that hate Pistol Opera because they don't understand it and the one's blindly defending it and grasping weakly to your arbitrary defenses.

You are all morons.

Not a single one of you has a rhyme or reason to your opinion regarding this film.

You that hate this film don't understand it, and you people defending the film are defending it on the grounds that it's just a bunch of fun, meaningless images.

If the movie was some sort of ridiculous hodgepodge of random images that would be one thing, but this movie clearly has a message and, frankly, it's not even one that's difficult to grasp.

Suzuki always uses absurdity in his films to represent the absurdity of the political issues he concerns his films with.

The colors in the film represent a visual contrast among people, as does the explicit dialog about flags.

The movie satirizes war in every shape and form, showing how war is basically a bunch of different countries competing for a momentary frivolous ranking at #1.

No, this film is far from being a masterpiece. If you are interested in film (or art) I recommend Suzuki's 'Story of a Prostitute'.

Even so, Pistol Opera is not the work of some ridiculous Japanese madman that wanted to confuse everybody.

[–] thrillhousejhs11 17 years ago

^Exactly, Suzuki utilizes various self-contained milieus that give an almost disorienting sense of a "hodgepodge" but there is an obvious method to his perceived madness. As hochje articulates, "Pistol Opera" has political subtexts beneath its mantle of a Yakuza film. It's as if he's completing his original vision for "Branded to Kill" (which was obstructed by lack of a budget and the absence of color he uses so masterfully in films like "Tokyo Drifter" and "Youth of the Beast"). It's unfortunate that most audiences today are quick to submit themselves to a "surrealist" analysis of certain films (especially in Lynch's oeuvre, but I also see it being applied to Suzuki among others) as almost nihilistic expressions of nothingness. Every film has a meaning, whether implied or inferred; even "nothing" is something...

Personally, if you want Suzuki's real vision unmarred by the connotations of the "Yakuza film" I'd recommend watching the complete Taisho trilogy (except for maybe "Yumeji"), these films truly exhibit his cinematographic prowess. However, his uniting of B-movie stories and characters with arthouse aesthetics is what makes him such a unique director in my opinion, unparalleled.

***

On a side note (why I came here), I was wondering if anyone (maybe you hochje) was familiar with Yasaharu Hasebe's films, particularly the "Stray Cat" series (which I imagine the "stray cat" name in "Pistol Opera" is a reference too). As the two directors were both with Nikkatsu Studios in their prime I imagine they had some connection. Both were pretty visually dynamic directors--just check out a few scenes from "Black Tight Killers." If anyone knows anything about their relationship, connections please inform.
________
Yeah, I'm so bad I kick my own ass twice a day...
-Creeper, the Hamburger Pimp from "Dolemite"

[–] cd_boy_33 17 years ago

this is not gory is it?

[–] immersedreality 17 years ago

thrillhousejhs11, you just restored my faith in humanity.

No, I'm not familiar with Yasaharu Hasebe, but I'll certainly check him out.

I haven't watched many Nikkatsu films as most Japanese cinema I've been watching has been Kurosawa, Ozu, Kobayashi, Mizoguchi, or Teshigahara.

I haven't had the time to delve into the underground cinema as of late.

[–] cd_boy_33 17 years ago

this is not gory is it?

[–] immersedreality 17 years ago

Ignorance.

[–] cd_boy_33 17 years ago

this is not gory is it?

[–] 17 years ago

[deleted]

[–] Grethiwha 12 years ago

That's an interesting reading of it, but I worry you're using that reading to justify your enjoyment of the film. I just watched the film, didn't know what to make of it - but I enjoyed it, on a basic level. Finding a deeper meaning - a method to the madness - I believe is secondary to enjoying it.

This is not a coherent or sensible film and it's not supposed to be. You act like the film's message is obvious, like your reading is definitive. No. I mean, I just read Jonathan Rosenbaum's analysis, and his reading is completely different. He goes into some themes, and he explains why he thinks it's a masterpiece, but he admits he doesn't completely understand it - he likes it for its formal elements. Whether you do or don't like this film depends primarily on whether you dig the formal elements of the film, and those who don't ought not bother looking for some deeper meaning, while those that do, may not have developed their own readings yet - and may be content not to look for any. Either way - their opinions are not invalid.

--- grethiwha -------- My Favourite Films:
http://www.imdb.com/list/Bw65XZIpkH8/

[–] HungLouMeng 12 years ago

The director was trying to use a genre predicated on violence to make a political statement about the uselessness of violence.

However, Suzuki's Elegy to Violence is probably the only one of his films that has been seen as somewhat political by others for the way it connects Japanese schools and militarism. Even so, that film is also undermined by Suzuki's penchant for cartoonish, theatricalized violence.