MovieChat Forums > No Man's Land (2001) Discussion > If you liked this, see Welcome To Saraje...

If you liked this, see Welcome To Sarajevo


If you thought this was powerful, Welcome To Sarajevo (directed by Michael Winterbottom) is, in my opinion, even more powerful and gives a more realistic view of what the war was like for civilians.

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yeah, Welcome to Sarajevo is another classic. but I liked No Man's Land bit more.

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Well My friend lived in Sarajevo during the war and she was extremly mad at Welcome to Sarajevo cause it pretends to be realistic and doesn't show 20% of what really happend there!!! basicly it is a bad movie! (the Wlecome to Sarajevo I mean)

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[deleted]

Well, Im from Serbia, which was in war with Bosnia and Croatia and I can tell you that these movies dont show a slightest bit of what happened in those wars. If you want to watch a more realistic movie about those wars take a look at the movie :"Lepa sela, lepo gore" (i'm sorry i dont know the English title).

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Iristic, the english translation of Lepa sela, lepo gore is "Pretty Village, Pretty Flame" I am an American, born and raised, but a friend of mine in Belgrade reccomended this movie to me and it was a real opener. When they all drink the "Diet Coke" bottle, that is certainly an eye opening seen. One of the most powerful movies I've ever seen. I think I am going to check out this one though, hopefully it will impress.

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This movie is a complete lie. It shows serbian soldiers beeng terrorised, captured, without food, drink...no amo and other things, but in reality things was completely opposite.

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No, in reality both sides did horrible things, just as happens in any war.

Fanboy : a person who does not think while watching.

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I've been trying to get Welcome to Sarajevo from online but it's quite hard. If anyone has this movie on their computer, can you please send it to me either by email or through msn? Or can u recommend a software I may download that has this movie so I can finally download and watch it?
email and msn: [email protected]

Thanks,

Irny

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posted the link in your request under Welcome to sarajevo discusion.

enjoy:p

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Have any of you seen Savrseni Krug, "The Perfect Circle", saw it as a young kid, one of the best movies I have seen in my life.

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I've seen it and I own a copy. It touched me more than any other Bosnian war movie I've ever seen. And being Bosnian they are practicly pushed on you by parents who hardly speak any english and would rather watch a Bosnian movie every night than American television. The only other movie that touched me this much was the recent movie called Grbavica (but you've probably seen it already...)

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hi,
i'm working on a documentary film on three cities in Croatia and Bosnia Herzgovinia (Vukovar,Visoko and Zadar). I'm trying to see as many films from these regions as possible. Who directed "the perfect Circle" Is it available on DVD, or do you know where I could get a copy somewhere/somehow?
Any other sugestions of movies i "must " see would be really helpfull. I grew up in the USA (Croatian father), and live in France. It is very difficult to find movies from these regions. Any suggestions on servers were i could download some x-yugoslavian films?

Cheers,
Elizabeth TESLA

PS
Our film will focuse on contemporary music artists, rap, heavy metal, rock, drum and bass.......or klapa and Sevda

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Both movies are fantastic and show a lot about the Balkan war. I wouldn't say one is better than the other. Both are good in their own way.

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I agree, im a croat who lived through it and I must say I felt that it was a very fair and realistic film

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"Perfect Circle", now that't the true, realistic classic...Maybe I even liked it more than No Man's Land...

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I loved it because it is a true Bosnian movie. No matter how sad the movie is there are still funny scenes. . . LOVED IT

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If you thought No Man's Land was absurd...

You should definitely find a copy of Emir Kusturica's Underground. Now that's a masterpiece.

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Harisson Flowers, Behind enemy lines, Welcome to Sarajevo, Grbavica, those are the movies (and there are few more I can't remember) that should be seen.
I am from Bosnia and I went trough hell there.
Stamenkovic your friend must have been Serb so that is why she doesn't agree with the movie- she likes it better from your POV which is Muslims are the ones that started the war. If thats true what about Srebrenica? What about killing thousands and thousands of kids, pregnant women, and men there??? Why? To defend themselves? Com'on don't make me laugh. Women and kids weren't killing anyone.
Serbia was bombed by US in 1995 I think or 1996 why? Because they didn't want to stop killing innocent. The reward for your president Karadjic is 5 million. Why?
He wasn't killing right.
Don't make me laugh pls.

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Are you going to lough at this too?

"Video “Radical Islam drowing in Europe 1992-1995 Bosnia”
Posted by cd under Religion , Politics , Videos


Comments from the original video poster

EL MUDJAHIDIN contains original video footage of persons belonging to this squad and fighting on the side of the so called Army of Bosnia and Herzegovina. An army which Muslims (Another-words Bosnian politicians) introduce to the world as the ONLY army fighting for the unity of Bosnia and Herzegovina, for the good of all ethnic backgrounds residing there, and presenting their people (Bosnian Muslims) as the ONLY constitutional people in Bosnia and Herzegovina. However, judge for yourselves how true these claims are……..

You are also able to view a huge presence of Mudjahedins from Islamic countries belonging to Al’ Qaide who, as is well known, committed atrocious war crimes against Serbs and other non Islamic people in BiH. Keep in mind that those Mudjahedins were and STILL are protected by the Bosnian (Muslim) political leaders. "


" Videos showing Muslim war crimes against Serbs in Bosnia
Svaki zarobljeni Srbin je na licu mjesta streljan ili zaklan:

Bobasi kod Viteza 8b
Muslimanski „Alahovi ratnici” se izivljavaju i na kraju streljaju nenaoruzanog Srbina uz uzvike „Allah-u-egber” i „Tekbir”:

http://rs-icty.org/galerija/video/B...%20Viteza8B.mpg

Bobasi kod Viteza 9
Muslimanski „Alahovi ratnici” skacu po tijelu nenaoruzanog prethodno zaklanaog Srbina:
http://rs-icty.org/galerija/video/B...d%20Viteza9.mpg

Odred El Mudzahedin
Promocioni video snimak muslimanske „El Mudzahedin” jedinice u kome su prikazana tijela izmasakriranih zaklanih Srba. Na tijelima izmasakriranih Srba su ocigledni tragovi prethodnih zvjerskih mucenja. Narator poziva na islamski sveti rat „Dzihad” protiv hrišćana i na klanje Srba. Čitavo vrijeme snimka narator poziva muslimane na rat i ubijanje Srba pod izgovorom da to islam od njih zahtjeva propagirajuci neopisivu mrznju prema svemu hrišćanskom. Na snimku su prikazane i odrubljene glave prethodno zlostavljanih Srba. Narator poziva na slaganje srpskih tijela na kamare kao moralnu obavezu muslimana i islama. Jedna srpska majka iz Republike Srspke je prepoznala odrubljenu glavu svoga sina i nakon toga pokusala da izvrsi samoubistvo. Na snimku se vidi najmanje sest tijela izmasakriranih zaklanih Srba i nekoliko odrubljenih srpskih glava.Na video snimku su prikazane i velike kolicine naoruzanja koje vode porijeklo iz islamskih zemalja. Čitav snimak neodoljivo podsjeca na zlodjela koje je srpski narod prezivio tokom Drugog svetskog rata od svojih komsija Hrvata i muslimana. Istorija se ponavlja a tijela Srba razbijenih i odrubljenih glava su ponovo pred nama. Snimak je napravljen da bi se podigao moral muslimanskim „Alahovim ratnicima” i prikazao kako je lako zaklati Srbina dok se onima koji to ne učine prijeti odlaskom u pakao. Upozorenje - video snimak je zaista stravican, morbidan i veoma potresan:


http://rs-icty.org/galerija/video/O...0mudzahedin.mpg

Odred El Mudzahedin 1
Bosanski muslimani oplakuju „Alahovog ratnika El Mudzahedin” odreda koji je dosao čak iz Alzira da ubija Srbe i koji je poginuo u napadu na jedno srpsko selo u Republici Srpskoj a prethodno ucestvovao u klanju nenaoruzanih Srba:
http://rs-icty.org/galerija/video/O...mudzahedin1.mpg



Odred El Mudzahedin 8
Pripadnici muslimanske „El Mudzahedin” jedinice - „Alahovi ratnici” izbacuju u jarak tijela zaklanih izmasakriranih Srba zajedno sa pozamasnim naoruzanjem koje su dobili iz islamskih zemalja. Kao i na ostalim snimcima, scene su krajnje potresne jer prikazuju monstruozno izoblicena i iznakazena tijela Srba koji su ocigledno umrli u strasnim mukama. Čitav snimak neodoljivo podsjeca na zlodjela koje je srpski narod prezivio tokom Drugog svetskog rata od svojih komsija Hrvata i muslimana. Istorija se ponavlja a tijela Srba razbijenih i odrubljenih glava su ponovo pred nama. Snimak je napravljen da bi se podigao moral muslimanskim „Alahovim ratnicima” i prikazao kako je lako zaklati Srbina dok se onima koji to ne učine prijeti odlaskom u pakao. Upozorenje - video snimak je zaista stravican, morbidan i veoma potresan:


http://rs-icty.org/galerija/video/O...mudzahedin8.mpg

Odred El Mudzahedin 12
Mudzahedin Abu Ubai iz Tunisa negoduje kada ga snimaju. Postoje fotografije i snimci na kojima isti pozira za kameru u rukama drzeci odrubljenu glavu jednog Srbina:

http://rs-icty.org/galerija/video/O...udzahedin12.mpg



Napad na Pocjelovo 1
Bosanski muslimani pjesmom proslavljaju kljanje Srba.

http://rs-icty.org/galerija/video/N...0Pocjelovo1.mpg

http://rs-icty.org/galerija/video/N...0Pocjelovo2.mpg

El Mudzahedin Unit killing Serbs


http://www.pogledi.co.yu/izetbegovic/pic/video/5.rmm

Maybe you should see those movies or you think they are funny too?

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domagoj1973, stop spreading Serbian propaganda. We all know Serb politicians started the war because they were mad all states (Croatia, Bosnia, Slovenia, Macedonia) were gaining independence and Serbs would loose too much land. Muslims were and still are a majority in Bosnia, there's nothing wrong with that. Radical Islam is nothing different than Radical Orthodox that Serbs practice.

Serbia has lower GDP per capita than Bosnia, Croatia, Slovenia, and Macedonia. You can thank Serbian politicians for that. What once was a great strong and power country is now bunch of small separated and independent nations. Oh well, at least we know Serbs have no chance of committing genocide ever again.

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warriors is one to put on that list :) about the english un soldiers in 1992/1993

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Domagoj you are posting a pictures and stories about how Bosnian people were forced to defend themselves by killing as well- the same way America was forced in a way to bomb Serbia so the would stop killings. If it was Bosnian fault how come the only ones waiting trials in Hagg and the only ones spending 40 years in prisons are Serbs? I won't be opening those files you posted because I don't really care. I was in the war and know what happened.

I was just thinking about how 80% of the Serbs coming to IMDB and posting comments moved out of Yugoslavia in the beggining of 1992(just before the war) , they never spent one single day fighting for their life, they moved to either America, Canada and other continents but now they know everyhting about what happened. They seem to know everyhting, better then people who were there during the war like myself. How is that? I know how.
You guys are believing whatever u want to belive, and not the truth because you just can not accept the truth.

Bye




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How can you hate Serbs so much since your grangranparents were Serbs long time ago?I think you have to prove that you are really Turkish or so called Bosniak.Is that the answer?

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And still you ask. The turks came 550 years ago and conquered Bosnia. But that isn't important. The important thing is that the Serbian goverment have always wanted to conquer all surounding nations. They spent the last 90 years trying to establish a "Great Serbia", a fascist country in wich the Serbs would rule over other Yugoslavic nations. The poeople to blaim are the politicians. Milošević usd mass propaganda to delude the people and make them bloodlusty animals.Before the war we where all Yugoslavians, but as soon as it started everybody took sides. But still after a three year long bloodbath you think we care about our grandgrandparents being serbs? You can not judge an entire nation. If one Serb or Bosnian kills someone does that make every Serb or Bosnian a murderer? When one says he hates Serbs he hates the Chetniks. The Serbs that have killed, raped and pillaged during the war. But the *beep* has already hit the fan and we can now only smell it. The war has drasticly changed all of us and will echo for an eternity and maybe one day the tolerance will be like before the war at least until another Milosevic/Tudzman/Seselj is born and the seed of hate and evil is replanted. Today the hate still remains our only hope is to raise the future generations to be tolerant but never forgetful. But considering how narrow minded most people are around here I doubt that will happen any time soon.

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Looks like you forgot to mention one of the worst war criminals called Alija Izmetbegovic.Did you forget his islamic declaration?That declaration started the horrible war but you obviously ignore it.You wanted to make the mujahedini nest in the heart of europe but sipak you papak.

P.S Kostala vas je ta deklaracija pa slijedeci put dobro razmislite hocete li je pisat opet.

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The war began because we wanted to be independent and you didn't like it.Slovenia, Croatia and Bosnia wanted to separate for a reason. If you take a politics or history class in any college in the world, the professor can show you the unbiased statistics. Serbia was taking in most of the money from Jugoslavia's income, while Croatia was making most of that money. Bosnia was contributing more then it was receiving from the budget. People were not treated fairly, thus the need for separation. It's as simple as that. And as much as I remember Alija didn't order ethnic cleaning of Bosnia.

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I guess you are approving the incoming separation of Serbian Republic which is part of Bosnia now since you care so much about independency?
P.S Alija Izmetbegovic is burning in hell

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Domagoj and haker,

You guy's both have seperate views, of course, and that's fine. But check it out. The entire thing was all a mess, with corruption, greed, and pride on BOTH sides. MYSELF I am a Bosnian Muslim, and i accept that bullsh*t was happening on both sides. NOT ALL SERBS ARE CRIMINALS, AND LIKEWISE MUSLIMS. Serb nationalism started with people like Milosevic, and Kardzic at the top starting nationalitic bands(CETNIKS) in villages often in Bosnian Serb settlements. Bosnian muslims also had inner corruption with the greed of Alija Izmetbegovic, as well as rebel bands. All this whole fuss has proven is that the utopia of a united south slav of "Yugoslav" nation is impossible because there will always be desire for a NATIONAL TERRITORRY. Croatians and Bosnians also imposed hell on eachother and now they live in peace and cooperation. Why can't we all just abandon the accusations and bias and just live in peace? It's a new century, BOSNIANS AND SERBS: Dont fight now, because when war was happening, you both wanted peace. Just accept the peace life has provided and move towards progress and getting both Serbia and Bosnia-Herzegovina into the EU!


Peace in 2006

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love it when people like this speak ^^

i would really like to see a lot more tolerance in discussions ><
what's with the generalizations?
the prejudice is ripe, even after all these years of feeding 'civilized-ness' into our brains. guess it just doesn't click.

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glad to know that some people think like me.

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Thank you...finally someone smart on these forums

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"And as much as I remember Alija didn't order ethnic cleaning of Bosnia."

Oh, he was carrying it out alright, and praising criminals such as Jusuf Prazina who tortured and killed Serbs in a Sarajevo prison. He had a lot of ex-cons in charge the first year, in order to carry out his dirty work. Then the army was made more professional and he liquidated Prazina, Caco, and a bunch of other murderers. Civilian Sarajevo Serbs, caught in the Muslim-controlled parts of Sarajevo were killed, often beheaded, and their bodies thrown down the Kazani gorge. Muslims have confessed to this.

Also, there's a tape of one of his commanders ordering the killing - whatever it takes - and permitting his troops to rape - against OTHER MUSLIMS. There were some rebel Muslims under leader Fikret Abdic who fought with the Serbs, and set up an autonomous area in northwest Bosnia.

They were attacked and defeated in 1995:

http://www.adnki.com/index_2Level_English.php?cat=Politics&loid=8.0.337271508&par=0

BOSNIA: SERBS PRESENT NEW EVIDENCE OF ALLEGED MUSLIM WAR CRIMES

Banjaluka, 6 Sept. (AKI) - Bosnian Serbs, the second largest ethnic group in the country, have presented fresh evidence of crimes allegedly committed by the Bosnian Muslim army during the 1992-1995 civil war. The Centre for Public Security (CPS) in Banjaluka, the capital of Bosnian Serb entity Republika Srpska, has said it submitted evidence to the Bosnian public prosecutor against 20 individuals for crimes committed against the civilian population and prisoners in western Bosnia.

The crimes were allegedly perpetrated against Serbs, but also against a rebel Muslim group headed by Fikret Abdic, who opposed Muslim wartime leader Alija Izetbegovic, the CPS claims. It says they were committed in 1994 and 1995 by the Fifth corps of the Bosnian Muslim army, led by general Atif Dudakovic.

A total 800 people were killed in the Fifth corps offensive, including 350 civilians, and 100,000 people were displaced, mostly Abdic’s Muslim supporters, according to the CPS report.

A video that appeared to show Dudakovic’s forces killing civilians and burning villages was recently shown by Serbian television. But Dudakovic rejected the accusations, saying he only "defended his country."

Bosnian Serb officials have said they submitted evidence against Dudakovic to the United Nations' Hague war crimes tribunal for the former Yugoslavia. But the tribunal, which plans to complete its work by 2008, is not accepting new cases and is referring them to local courts.

Most of the 150 individuals indicted by the UN's Hague tribunal are Serbs, which has prompted accusations from Serbia that the court was practising "selective justice" and trying only Serbs.

Bosnian Muslim leaders, including Sulejman Tihic, Muslim member of Bosnia’s three-man rotating state presidency, have rushed to Dudakovic’s defence. Tihic said he was "proud of Dudakovic’s war record," describing him as a hero.

In a related development, the Banjaluka Alternative Television channel late on Tuesday aired another video apparently showing one of Dudakovic’s commanders, Hamdija Delalic, ordering his soldiers near the western town of Cazin to use all means to retake the lost positions.

"We must break through - kill everything that comes in your way," Delalic is heard telling his soldiers. "I approve and order the destruction of the enemy by all means – knives, bombs, teeth," he says. Asked by soldiers whether rape was allowed too, he is heard replying: "You have the right to do everything."

Apart from murder, looting and burning of villages, many women were raped as a result of Delalic’s orders, Esad Covic the Muslim president of western Bosnia’s war prisoners’ association, told Banjaluka Alternative Television. He cited the case of a Muslim woman, now living in the United States, who suffered a nervous breakdown after repeated rapes. "Unfortunately, she will never be a person to whom one could talk again," he said.

Covic said his the western Bosnia’s war prisoners’ association sent the documentation on the crimes of the Fifth corps to Hague in 1999, but never received a reply from the tribunal.

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[deleted]

[deleted]

[deleted]

maybe the serb *beep* should give the real criminals who lead the executions? no! instead, They are hiding them, what the hell is up with that?

*beep* noobs :)

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STOP THIS! BE THE BETTER PERSON AND DONT OFFEND!

Come on man! We're just DEEVOLUTIONIZING OURSELVES!

MOVE ON, THOUGH IT'S HARD, SWALLOW THE EARLY 90'S JUST DO IT. LOOK AT PROGRESS, IF THEYRE NOT ADVANCING THEIR LOSS! WE'VE DONE ALL WE CAN NOW LET THEM CONTINUE.

Prejudice, and hatred can never be justified, just move on, for the sake of the future generations.

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"The crimes were allegedly perpetrated against Serbs, but also against a rebel Muslim group headed by Fikret Abdic, who opposed Muslim wartime leader Alija Izetbegovic, the CPS claims. It says they were committed in 1994 and 1995 by the Fifth corps of the Bosnian Muslim army, led by general Atif Dudakovic. "

I guess offical report doesnt count if its not from serbian propaganda?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7ESBQhNZpU

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Your IQ must be limited to imagine Serbs as fascists. If there was any fascist nation in the Balkans it was the Croats and their Ustasha. They massacred hunderds of thousands of Serbs, Jews and Gypsies.... you should think twice who is a fascist here. If I remember well, the Bosnian Muslims happened to be very supportive of what the Ustasha were doing.

The very idea of a Greater Serbia can about when Serbs were able to help to defend Austo-Hungary from the Turks. As a reward, the Austro-Hungarians promised to the Serbs that they could have a Great Serbia, and they were willing to give those lands to us. Your should be grateful that the Serbs refused it back then or otherwise you would have no idea what Bosnian would mean right now.

Btw, almost 90% of Bosnian Muslims have Serbian roots. That means that you have them too. That is why you would hate me but I won't hate you.

If you think that Serbs were privileged during Yugoslavia under Tito-think again. Most of the people sent to Goli Otok were Serbs and Montenegrins because they may have said something against the regime.
I knwo that because the son of one of my mother's frineds was sent there and he died soon afterwards of insanity. The Sebs there were given the most difficult and dangerous labour work while the Croats and Bosnians got the lighter work.

Oh yeah, in Srebrenica women and children weren't killed. They were spared and even delivered to safety by the Serbian army. So shut up and stop spreading hate-Serb propaganda.

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These movies are very different. Welcome to Sarajevo i havent seen but lepa sela lepo gore and no man's land are different. One is about the war while the other one is about the UN presence.

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oh and who ever said muslims are a majority in bosnia is right. Now they are. Before war it was 50% serbs, 20% croats and 30% muslims.

So don't talk about what you don't know please.

Or did you and do you still belive 911 was orchestrated by Osama?

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[deleted]

If you consider your grandgrandparents that were Serbs weho accepted islamic religion...well yes you are in right then...Bosnians were a majority then.

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Hahahah sticks m you really are insane. Where on earth did it say that before the war Bosnia was 50% Serb? Please give me a link or something. That's just absurd

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Well you know what the Croatians done to Serbs in World War II...learn a little and then think about those 90 years of planing and a facist country

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In Srebrenica only men have been killed....children, women and old ones were released....sh't happend there...an all sides...But i must say that Welcome to Sarajevo, Harrison flowers, Behind Enemy Lines are not realistic movie..."Savior" is a good movie. It shows both sides of the war

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But he has a point, Bosnia didn't exist until this war and before the war it was populated with all ethnic groups. If theres one thing that pisses me off is when people say only muslims are Bosnians, its not true theres Bosnians Serbs, Croats and Muslims and they're all Bosnians. Its discussions like these were nationalism prys its ugly head that started the war.

By the way the one thing Tito and the regime worked on was to try and supress extreme nationalism, and anyone who knows anything about the Yugoslav territories in WWII would agree that it was a pretty damn good idea. This extreme nationalism is the only reason the war started and all the ethnic cleansing happened, and please don't blame it on the Serbs everyone was equally guilty. Both sides committed genocides and Srebrenica wasn't even the biggest, it was the most shocking one due to the fact that it happened in a protected area. Scum like Tudjman and Milosevic should have been tried and improsined long before they died. And please lets not have all these Americans talking about the war, because the truth is you don't know *beep* You all just know that there was a war between these crazy Slavs and that you sent your army over there. This wars roots go all the way bak to Jasenovac and the Cetniks and Ustase in World War II.

As far as I could tell Croats were glorifying and hiding their war criminals as well, Gotovina's still looked as a hero and his crimes are as bad as those of Mladic. I hate the fact that everyone here's trying to act like their more superior then the other nationality your not, for *beep* sake your all the same you retards. The only thing different between a Bosniak, Serb and Croat is the religion, you guys have the same *beep* mentality and the same *beep* outlook on life which again explains why the war and the genocides happened. Its because of you guys with your "Oh its all (insert nationality here) fault!" that we won't be able to get past this blemish on our history. I myself am pro Jugoslavia but then again I can understand why some people wouldn't want to be together thats fine, there was an easy way to resolve that situation without resorting to ethnic cleansing, but I put all the blame on the three leaders Milosevic, Tudjman, and Izabegovic and the stubborn need for nationalism in our people.


By the way "Welcome To Sarajevo" sucked and this is much better and much more poignant.

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[deleted]

There also wasn't any muslims in Bosnia before it was taken over by Ottoman's, so whats your point?

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[deleted]

They weren't I didn't say they were but its a simple fact that Serbians and Croats were in Bosnia before muslims, so I don't understand how Bosnia belongs to only muslims like you and all the others here are stating. Whats your arguement? I wasn't agreeing with Damogoj either so I don't really get why you're comparing us two, or was that some lame attempt to insult me? But anyway it seems like you and most of the other nationalistic morons on here didn't even get this film so I don't see why you're talking about it.

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all i have to say to you is that you should be more concerned about the fact that we're (and by 'we' i mean most of ex-yu countries) choking in evergrowing depts, failing economy, criminals who rule our countries ect rather then who killed whom 15 years ago. ok, there was *beep* on every side caught in the war, all of them should be processed and if it was up to me, those proven guilty should be erased from the face of the earth (that's just my humble opinion though). you can't just shift the blame to another side and say you did nothing wrong. Yes, even if you don't want to hear about it, Serbs have killed, raped, tortured and so on. but so did the others. saying that, for example, Croats did the same does not belittle everything Serbs did.

as for this part of Mantas84's comment: 'but its a simple fact that Serbians and Croats were in Bosnia before muslims, so I don't understand how Bosnia belongs to only muslims like you and all the others here are stating.'

i partialy disagree with this. you are mixing nationality with religion. Bosnia has existed as a country (independent or as a part of other great empires trough history) since 10th century and therefor Bosnians aswell. ofc you are right though that islam as a religion was not present in this area until the conquest of Ottoman Empire. Until then, concerning religion there was a special form so to say of church called 'crkva bosanska' (bosnian church) and 'bogumili' and the breaking point was indeed mid 15th century when Turks were about to conquer Bosnia, that's when Bosnian king Tvrtko had to make a decision whether to stick to tradition, or accept the change that was coming. today, majority of Bosnians are muslims, but there's a significant percentage of catholics and orthodox too. it's not a religion that defines what nationality you are, it's where you're born and where you've lived since.

most people here don't seem to get that and that's the cor of the problem imo.

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So ,who are te Hercegovinians then?

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you are right, i didn't mention Herzegovina, but the only reason for that is that in Middle Ages Herzegovina, as a provence, was included in the kingdom of Bosnia and it was added to the official name of the country later. as far as i remember, Herzegovina was never independent.
i don't leave out Herzegovina on purpose, it's just that for me it's normal that when i say 'Bosnia' i mean Herzegovina too. you can't have one without the other. saying only 'Bosnia' is just shorter ;)

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so tell me then who built those pyramides and was that ancient Bosnia part of the Egyptian empire?

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those pyramids do not exist, simple as that. that osmanagic dude or whatever his name is, is a prick.

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[deleted]

[deleted]

Meh, Welcome to Sarajevo is okay.

Don't knock masturbation! It's sex with someone I love.

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Thanks for the recommendation.

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