MovieChat Forums > Ash Wednesday (2004) Discussion > Catholic Symbolism

Catholic Symbolism

posted 18 years ago by Sjack585
6 replies | jump to latest

I see a lot of posts that say they are disappointed with the ending. It would seem that a very minor character shoots Fran just to give a shocking ending to the film.

I think some have missed the whole Catholic symbolism of the movie. Fran knew he was going to die (he even says to his brother, Sean that he has things to do to make sure its all over). Fran dies for his Sean's sins (and even his father's - he mentions paying for his father's sins earlier in the movie). He dons his brother's pea coat (his brother's sins), his watch cap (crown of thorns? - I know, that may be a stretch), he streches out to close the cage and he is shot. When the cop arrives and turns him over, he is laid out like Christ on the cross. His death frees his brother.

The shooter has to be a minor character - he can't be someone that knows that he killed the wrong man. I was trying to remember but I cannot not - who told him the Sean would be dressed like a sailor? Was it his friend that helps him in the shoot out in the bar? If so - Judas?

It became obvious early in the film that Fran would die. While not the best film I've seen, I found interesting the way the film was molded to fit the symbolism of the death of Christ.

[–] benjo18 18 years ago

Interesting. I didn't pick it. I'll have to watch the film again.

[–] judepear8 18 years ago

growing up in a catholic world, watching this film made me remember how EVERYONE walked around w/ ashes.
the film?
a relatively recycled idea.

the idea of catholicism being represented? you make a pretty valid series of points...but, I've also heard such symbolism w/ other films just as non specific. you can relate anything to anything. I can relate the star wars saga to religion, method acting, and enter the dragon.

the ending, albeit rather commonplace sums up the overall theme of a gangster code of ethics. no one here gets out alive. take any gangster movie, and you notice that the relation of sins (i.e. murder) to contrition to penance always catches up w/ the sinner. these films are morality plays, and not much more. there are no winners. everyone takes a fall, no matter how much you think your debt is paid.
this film is no different.
slainte.

[–] The_Dying_Flutchman 18 years ago

Being raised a staunchly conservative Irish Catholic and being in the monk house for a few years, I found this a huge, musty bore and no more real than a pig dying in its own slops.

Nothing exists more beautifully than nothing.

[–] benjo18 18 years ago

Graphic !!!

Barry McMullen: "I like being a pessimist. It helps me deal with my inevitable failure."

[–] jasontgreat 18 years ago

Well I would've thought that Catholic symbolism was fairly obvious, at least to any catholic.

I don't understand judebear8's comment when he refers to the religous over-tones in this movie as non-specific. The name of the movie is Ash Wednesday!! A catholic holiday for crying outloud! Why does Ed Burns choose to have this movie take place on ash wednesday of all days? I doubt its so he can have those nifty ash crosses on all the characters.

Ash Wednesday is the holiday for penitence for us catholics and that is exactly what Frances achieves.

You could make the point that perhaps the movie relies too much on it's audience to be catholic in order to grasp the plot in its entirety BUT that is why Ed gives us the scene where the detective describes to Father Mahoney the meaning of Ash Wednesday.

[–] ImATomato 17 years ago

I don't understand judebear8's comment when he refers to the religous over-tones in this movie as non-specific.

Yeah, its just too blatant (to Catholics anyway). If Burns had discovered the meaning of a little subtlety he might have managed to pull this film back from totally awful to just plain old mediocre.

(Although a less obvious plot might have been even more advantageous).

ketchup is murder