MovieChat Forums > Final (2001) Discussion > More Questions *spoilers*

More Questions *spoilers*


Okay, this is following up on the other Questions post. I agree that there were a lot of hints to suggest that the whole thing was going on his head, and I was surprised and a little disappointed at the total lack of a twist at the end. Firstly, as the other person said, it was a little strange that when he awoke, he already knew:
a) He'd been cryogenically frozen.
b) It was the future.
c) He was going to be getting a lethal injection.
As someone else said, it's possible that while in a coma, he heard people discussing the operation, and perhaps he even made up the memory of going to sign up for a cryogenics study to go along with that. But what about knowing he was going to get an injection? Did he overhear something about that when they first brought him back? That seems like a bit of a stretch.

Beyond that, there were other strange things. Like, where did the electric guitar and the walkman come from? Was I the only one who thought it was really strange that they just happened to be there? I mean, the orderly apparently brought in the guitar (why?), but the walkman just appeared in one of the last scenes. Maybe it was in his jacket when he was first injured, and they kept the jacket while he was frozen? I dunno, it's pretty strange.

Also, why did they go to the trouble of trying to convince him it was 1999, and that he was basically crazy? I mean, okay maybe I buy that they needed to wake him up and assess his physical health before operating, but why should they care about his mental state? And what effect was pretending it was 1999 supposed to have on his mental state?

Anyway, I think if it had all been a delusion, it wouldn't have been a particularly original ending, but at least it would have made a more coherent story.

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Well, it was easy to miss, but the guard brought the walkman at the same time that he brought the guitar and amp. Watch it closely again and you'll see that the guard takes the headset from around his own neck, and removes the walkman from his belt, where it is clipped. Don't know why I particularly remember that, but I do.

In any case, a good film, very well acted, from my view.

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Yep Yep....if you look closely, you can see him leave the walkman at the same time.

My question is whos idea was it to leave it?

When Leary asks if he did it, Jim Gaffigan shakes his head no, but he never asks if anyone else.

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Sorry, I should have replied to your questons in one post. The whole deal with the way they treated him early on in the film is that they had somewhat of an ethical problem. They were attempting to obey some of the forms of legality even in their difficulty (the plague), and hoped to have him voluntarily sign the consent form for the operation (which they knew was likely to be fatal).

Later in the film, you see them discussing this in a meeting, and it is then that the conversation turns to abandoning the ethics in favor of expediency. Hope Davis' character protests loudly, and eventually she and another doctor are ejected.

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The film did not turn on a plot twist because it was a drama rather than an adventure. The doctors did not tell Bill the truth because it would have verified his suspicions. The woman director only told Bill the truth when his signature was no longer a legal essential. It was not explicitly stated, but the guitar and walkman were undoubtedly a last request by Bill.


Illegitimus!

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I kept waiting for some, anything to happen. Never did...

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why were the other mental patients watching a movie on VHS?

In regards to the ending, I got the impression that the facility is actually underground. They either used holograms, or otherwise simulated the outdoors, because Bill commented on there being no bird sounds. Yet when she goes outside at the end of the movie, you can hear birds.

An aside comment: It was odd seeing Jim Gaffigan play a dramatic role.

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"why were the other mental patients watching a movie on VHS?

In regards to the ending, I got the impression that the facility is actually underground. They either used holograms, or otherwise simulated the outdoors, because Bill commented on there being no bird sounds. Yet when she goes outside at the end of the movie, you can hear birds.

An aside comment: It was odd seeing Jim Gaffigan play a dramatic role."

I agree, that watching this future drama unfold with primitive technology at every turn was kind of anti-climatic (sp?). Perhaps that was the point, they didn't want any super high tech futuristic gizmos to betray the elaborate character study they created with the the mise en scene. I don't know about the facility being totally underground, I think there were parts that were above ground and accessways below where the most severely ill were kept. Kinda like a quarantine zone. I don't think there was a simulated enviroment outdoors, there wasn't really anything to suggest they were into that kind of subterfuge. The birds could have either been muffled by the interior of the hospital (ie: sound dampening to keep Bill unaware) or it could have been a plot device to add more tension to Bill's plight. Like when the doctor finally goes outside all is revealed so there are birds singing and sunny weather and stuff.

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When Bill is in his room and is looking out the window, he comments to the ward aide that he noticed odd movement at the treeline. The aide did not respond. I found it very odd that Bill was harping about the treeline, once everything was explained to him I thought that he may have noticed a glitch or a break in a projected image of what was suppose to be a treeline. I feel that his external enviornment was projected especially in light of the condition of the area in which he resided.

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I was under the impression that Ann requested to have the guitar brought in to allow Bill to indugle in playing one more time; the "hospital" must've have had a complete history on him to know he played, and the soundtrack, which often seems to emanate from his mind, indicates his love for accoustic music.

As for the walk man, I'm still a bit confused; was it a "relic" to try and convince Bill that the year is 1999, and Dayton indulged in listening to it before bringing it over, or was it Dayton's own little gift to a man about to die for the greater good?

Everybody's a critick
http://canuckcritick.blogspot.com/

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As to:

"I mean, the orderly apparently brought in the guitar (why?), but the walkman just appeared in one of the last scenes. Maybe it was in his jacket when he was first injured, and they kept the jacket while he was frozen? I dunno, it's pretty strange. "

Who put fresh batteries in the Walkman? By 2027, it should have been corroded nearly beyond recognition.

I see this film as defective on many fronts.

I am an astrophysicist, and am a sucker for any film involving time, and I am very understanding, such as forgiving the creation of the watch in Somewhere in Time with Christopher Reeve, but this is just plain badly done.

I will not watch it again. Well, I may have just lied. I am incapable of that much self control. ;-)

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Good point on the batteries, even if a minor issue. Why was there no TOILET in his room? There was a sink, but no toilet...

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look at technology. Back in the 60's they thought we'd have flying cars by now, yet we don't. Hell, watch Back to the Future Part 2. I know it's a work of fiction but it still says things about how the director thought technology would progress in the future.
When were batteries invented? They were made in 1800 and since then they've progressed but yet we still use them for most of our electronic devices.
All I'm saying is that we dream big for the future but ask someone who is older and what they thought the future would be like. We've made great strides yet our cars are still on the ground, we still use batteries not unlike those of 50 years ago, architecture hasn't changed much, and overall technology isn't as advanced as our dreams.

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I assume that the guitar and the Walkman were packaged up for him by Sheri(his ex-fiance) in the past (when he was frozen in 2000). I assume that she would package up a few things for him so that when they brought his body back from the frozen state that he would have a few familiar things that were important to him. They would have been kept in some locker or whatever and definitely not subjected to freezing which would have destroyed the 2 objects.

As for the batteries, WELL..After all 2027 is only 18 years away...18 years before today(2009)would only be 1991..Think about it in that framework....Things just don't change THAT much in this small amount of time. Also the world had been going through some very tough times with the virus and all. Remember Dr Johnson said the place they both had lived(The U.S.) didn't even exist anymore. I doubt if there had been tremendous strides in new inventions...The thing I find unbelievable is that they could bring a cryogenically frozen human back to life in such a perfect state only 18 years from now. But I guess "neccesity is the mother of invention"

Besides the batteries in the Walkman could have been rechargable and therefore would not have corroded. Whoever packaged up the batteries could have thought of even putting a recharger in with the guitar and Walkman.

Very interesting movie!

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The film did not turn on a plot twist because it was a drama rather than an adventure. The doctors did not tell Bill the truth because it would have verified his suspicions. The woman director only told Bill the truth when his signature was no longer a legal essential. It was not explicitly stated, but the guitar and walkman were undoubtedly a last request by Bill.


the guitar and walkman were not a last request by bill at all. they were given to him before he really knew about the whole situation and had resigned himself to his fate. If you understand what they were doing from the very beginning, you would understand that the guitar and walkman were brought in to make him more comfortable and bring his "rehabilitation" along smoothly. It was also a tool used to help him to start to trust his doctor. ann was trying to gain his trust. by showing she understood what was important to him, his music/guitar playing, she was able to gain more trust. He never ever had a "last" request. He was fighting to live right up till he say his old fiancee and was taken back to his room.

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SPOILERS (of course)

I realize I'm really late to this party but here's what I think happened....

The doctors know that Bill may carry the cure in his head. They are monitoring him because they aren't sure how successful his “thaw” was---this isn't so far in the future that we can assume the technology has been perfected. There was some discussion about another possible donor but she wasn't doing as well...remember how Bill was weak and staggering at the beginning of the film? I assumed that his cognitive functioning is telling them, somehow, that his brain thawed successfully and the part they need is functioning properly.

This is important because ethically, they don't want to kill him and remove his brain etc. only to find out he did *NOT* have what they needed. They want to know for sure before they even ask for his consent so they're monitoring his functioning. That, I think, may be why they gave him the guitar. Maybe his motor skills would tell them something.

At one point in the film there's a big meeting among various doctors. Ann says something about needing to get Bill's consent and someone (probably from the government) says something like, “We don't need that any more.” Another doctor replies, “When was that decided?” Edward says that Ann has lost her objectivity, shouldn't be on the case, and so on. These two argue in the hall and Edward starts bleeding from the nose.

My conclusions are that the pandemic has worsened. A doctor is now infected; as one who is studying the disease and who has access to protection and knows procedures and protocols, that isn't supposed to happen. Something is definitely amiss...maybe it has mutated or there's a second strain. If the doctors all die, there's nobody even left to work on the cure.

At some point during the film, someone mentioned that Bill had been frozen before this plague hit and therefore he wasn't exposed to it. Note, that doesn't mean he has immunity. If the disease is now totally overrunning the human race, even penetrating this secure facility, there are two possibilities left. One, Bill can die so others have a chance to live. Two, everyone (Bill included) dies. The government's position is probably that if he's going to die anyway, better that it should happen before he's infected, thus the “we no longer need his consent” urgency. At least he'll die with the hope of giving life to others.

So what if the substance in his head doesn't save the world after all? If it's a pandemic, maybe nothing will, but then he'd be dead anyway. Reflecting that idea, at the end Ann goes to the beach, per her promise to him---but her sister isn't going to be saved because she already died.

Why were the doctors so evasive about the year? I'm not really sure but mainly I think it was a mind game. By making him question his own sanity, they sold him on the “need” to stay there. They really couldn't let a potential cure walk out the door and it worked in their favor that he thought it was 400 years in the future. If that were true, there would be nobody he could contact to help him escape, for example, and being isolated it would be harder not to cave in to their demands.

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