I liked Michael well enough but - Queer as Folk (2000) Discussion

[–] katiedyd 12 years ago

I think the majority of people would probably agree with you. Hell, so did Brian.

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[–] skinny_school_girl 12 years ago

*SPOILERS* Didn't Brian actually punch him in the face after Michael suggested that he should've left Justin to die when he had been attacked after his prom?

Money isn't the root of all evil. Love of money is.

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[–] Faintlp 12 years ago

yes. probably my absolute favorite moment of the series. Michael should have been punched in at least every other episode.
Michael was probably the whiniest, most annoying character in the series. I think one of his only redeeming qualities lies in his choice of men. Ben is just wonderful; way too good for Michael. I may have hated him so much because of the actor's portrayal of him. Hal Sparks just generally pisses me off as well...

"Memory loss: the free prize at the bottom of each vodka bottle." - Sheldon Cooper

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[–] skinny_school_girl 12 years ago

*DING DING DING* "AND THERE YOU HAVE IT, FOLKS! THE INSTANT RECAP OF THE SURPRISE PUNCH THAT KNOCKED MIGHTY MIKE NOVOTNY ON HIS KEISTER!" Sorry but that cracks me up every time I watch that scene on YouTube! XD

Money isn't the root of all evil. Love of money is.

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[–] Mark_Graisons_Moustache 12 years ago

Dreadful character. I wish he had died.

"Mr. Bond, you defy all my attempts to plan an amusing death for you."

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[–] dvlaries 12 years ago

Dreadful character. I wish he had died.

No, I can't go that far, but I understand your frustration.

Somewhere in the run of the series, Michael states that his higher education amounted to all of one semester of community college. We can then intelligently infer that he has been in the working world about 10 years when we meet him.

Michael Novotny's problem is that back when he was around 20, he needed to put about a day's traveling distance between himself and not only his buttinski, overbearing mother, but also his useless crush on his best friend, who ain't havin' any.

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[–] dvlaries 12 years ago

yes. probably my absolute favorite moment of the series. Michael should have been punched in at least every other episode.
Michael was probably the whiniest, most annoying character in the series. I think one of his only redeeming qualities lies in his choice of men. Ben is just wonderful; way too good for Michael. I may have hated him so much because of the actor's portrayal of him. Hal Sparks just generally pisses me off as well...

This annoyed me to no end. We never really saw Michael grieving the loss of David in any genuine way. He doesn't even admit it's over with David until Emmett realizes Michael had sex with some drag-home from Babylon in the old bedroom of the apartment they shared, when Michael's only supposed to be back in Pittsburgh "visiting."

Then, after Michael opens his comic book store -something that only happened as an extension of Brian's generosity- the show hands Michael a second Prince Charming in the form of the first customer to walk in the store. Give us a break!

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[–] dergil27 10 years ago

Michael's second Prince Charming may have come along a little soon. But due to the early departure of Chris Potter, the writers may have needed to scramble for a new romantic path for Michael sooner than they had planned.

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[–] dvlaries 12 years ago

*SPOILERS* Didn't Brian actually punch him in the face after Michael suggested that he should've left Justin to die when he had been attacked after his prom?

Yes he did. And Michael deserved it. The occasion was a birthday party for Gus in Mel & Lindsay's yard.

Michael was not the host and had no business commenting, or getting worked up, about who Justin showed up with, who Brian showed up, who anybody showed up with. If he wasn't having a good time, his option was to leave. Brian tolerates as much as he can, but finally lets his "friend" have it, when Michael suggests that the baseball bat should have killed Justin.

The only thing wrong was Brian's aim. David got Brian square in the mouth, when Brian himself pulled a repugnant stunt at a party, but at Mel & Lindsay's Brian got Michael's eye instead. And if there's anybody you want to aim for in the mouth in this series, it's Michael Novotny.

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[–] dergil27 10 years ago

Some time ago, someone on this thread suggested that the powers that be included the punching scene as a sort of fanservice for all the viewers who disliked Michael. Didn't buy it at the time and am still not sure. But now wonder if that poster (post now deleted unfortunately)wasn't onto something after all.

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[–] dergil27 12 years ago

I really don't get the dislike of so many qaf fans for Michael.This seems especially prevelent among the Brian/Justin group.It's almost as if many people need to have someone to hate.So much so that everything Michael does is interpreted in a negative way.Michael's snotty to Justin, he's a jerk.Michael's nice to Justin, he has some hidden agenda. Michael tolerates and makes excuses for Brian's excesses, he is an enabler. Michael calls Brian on his crap, he is a bad friend.Is there a term for looking at someone through the opposite of rose colored glasses? For this is how some appear to look at Michael's character.If they had done an episode in which Michael actually sacrificed his life to save Brian's,some would probably say he did it so Brian would owe him in the afterlife.

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[–] katiedyd 12 years ago

Lucien... is that you?

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[–] charmingnancy 12 years ago

I am a big fan of the Brian/Justin pairing, but I also love Michael. I love all of the characters for various reasons, but I acknowledge the faults in all of them. Every character on the show had their share of selfish moments, and Michael certainly did. I enjoy scenes where Michael and Brian are just hanging out, like when Michael brought food over to the loft to cheer Brian up during the Kip thing, and I also enjoy scenes where they are fighting, like when Justin left Brian in season 5 and temporarily stayed with Michael and Ben. Brian's episode 3.1 punch was awesome, Michael totally deserved it.

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[–] 12 years ago

[deleted]

[–] dergil27 12 years ago

........imp32

Somehow I missed this post until now.

Of course I would defend the actress in "Desperate Housewives" if I were a fan.As to the qaf fans insulting her,they must be completely deluded if they continue to see Brian every time Gale Harold appears.

Don't know if I agree that the punching scene was a gift to people who don't like Michael,although they certainly enjoyed it enough.But it was odd that we never got a follow up on that.No way do I believe Ted and Emmett would let such an incident go.They would insist that Michael tell them what happened.Of course if the whole thing was a gift this would play into it. As some Michael haters do write "if only" scenarios about what would happen if everyone found out.Enthusiastically describing how Michael would be cast out and abandoned by all.With even Michael's own mother and lover rejecting him because of the awful things he said about Sunshine.So I can see how the punching could be a gift.But I doubt it.And I think the reason for no follow up was the typical "fill in the blanks yourself" mode of operation this show often employed.

Oddly enough,I came to this show originally for the erotic B/J scenes.But soon became more interested in the lives of all the characters.And like many others, I started out as a Brian/Justin fan.But by the mid first season,Michael became and remained my favorite.

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[–] 12 years ago

[deleted]

[–] dergil27 12 years ago

Didn't mean for it to sound like I believe anyone who thinks of Brian when they see Harold is deluded.If so,I'd have to include myself on that list.But from the poster's description I get the idea that some fans seek out Harold on DH with the idea that he is Brian Kinney,then get angry when they see him with someone other than Justin.If this is the case I would call those fans deluded.

As for filling in the blanks,I also like it most of the time.So much more to argue and debate about when there is no definitive answer.And in the diner scene when it became obvious that Michael's eye was not going to be further discussed,I too filled in the blanks.My interpretation of what happened with Michael,Ted and Emmett is pretty much the same as yours.But there are a lot of qaf fans who don't think such a conversation ever took place offscreen.Not sure why this is.

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[–] 12 years ago

[deleted]

[–] dergil27 12 years ago

imp32

Think you missed my meaning about the punching incident.And since you and the other poster both misunderstood this and other of my comments,it must be my fault.No onscreen disclosure to third parties of Michael's rant about Justin means viewers can see things in a number of ways.I think that Michael told Ted and Emmett what happened offscreen and, like Michael and Brian,they declared the whole thing a wash.That is why there was little discussion of it at the diner.This is how I interpreted things.And though I have no proof,I believe a lot of other people saw it this way as well.Can't buy that nobody else knew because,as I said before,no way would Ted and Emmett ever shut up about it until they were told.But some do believe only Michael and Brian know the details leading to "the punch".Have read comments on other boards,many old but some as recent as two months ago,bemoaning the fact that nobody knew what Michael said to Brian.Most of these comments go on to suggest that if everyone knew the truth,Michael would be scorned by all.Perhaps these people hate Michael so much they refuse to believe that everyone knowing why Brian hit Michael could result in anything less than complete and total rejection for the man.So while it's doubtful that all this was a deliberate gift to those who hate Michael,it could be seen as an accidental one.After all, not only do Michael haters get to see him hit in the face,they can also indulge in "if only" discussions about Michael becoming a pariah were the truth to come out.

About Michael's deluded hopes with Brian.

I think you're asking if I believe the writers of the U.S. version intended Brian and Michael to remain best friends,or if they planned to follow the U.K. model but the Brian and Justin thing took over either by design or accident.But as opinionated as I am about so many things on this show,I just can't make up my mind about this question.Early episodes have examples for both positions,as if the creators were hedgeing their bets til they themselves made a decision.

One thing I do know is that as Michael and Brian were written,I would not have wanted them to be a couple.Not just because Ben was a better match,but because I like Michael too much to inflict Brian on him as a partner.Michael could never have tolerated Brian's promiscuous lifestyle. Also,as you said, Brian was often written as an a!!hole to Michael.While Michael usually allowed Brian to use him as a doormat.And this was when they were friends. How much worse this situation would be if they had become lovers.

Are you asking if I think so many B/J people hate Michael because they see him as a threat, due to the occassional B/M exchange that hints back to the U.K. relationship?For an example I'll mention the "love of your life" comment Brian made when Michael married Ben.As someone who never wanted Brian and Michael together for reasons already mentioned,I could have done without it.Often wondered if this rankled fans of Brian and Justin.Never heard any of them bring it up though.If some B/J followers do see Michael as a threat, it could be for a completely different reason,the onscreen chemistry between the actors.Harold and Sparks always came off well in their scenes together as Brian and Michael,both as friends and when things took a less appropriate turn. And with the exceptions of the "red sweater kiss" and one or two others, the kissing scenes between Brian and Michael are just as,or even more erotic than those between Brian and Justin.But if anyone is threatened due to this,they shouldn't be,since chemistry between actors is accidental and unintended and not part of the plot.But do I think anyone who loves B/J fears that Brian may really have romantic feelings for Michael?Never considered this before.I know there are viewers who see and support a strong romantic connection between Brian and Michael.Never saw it myself.But maybe there are some B/J fans out there who do see it and don't like it.I don't think the majority of qaf fans see Michael as a threat to their favorite couple.But for a few,probably the ones who hate him beyond all logic,this may be the reason.

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[–] dergil27 12 years ago

Glad that a few B/J fans have some use for Michael.Didn't mean for it to sound like I objected to Brian's actions in season three point one.I like Michael's character but am no apologist for him.He said terrible things about Justin.He got hit in the face for it.Michael deserved to get hit in the face for it and he himself accepted this as his due.He is certainly no angel.However,there are plenty that see every move Michael makes as some plot to get rid of Justin in order to have Brian for himself.Others discount the importance of Michael in Brian's life.As if Brian should be close to Justin and Justin alone.

And no, I am not you're pet troll.I don't say things just to piss people off.Believe it or not there are some posters here who genuinely have tastes and opinions that differ from the majority on this board. Stand behind my statements about the B/J Michael haters. But perhaps I did get my back up a little more than this post warranted.

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[–] clofa 12 years ago

Stand behind my statements about the B/J Michael haters.
Why does there always have to be one correct opinion? I'm sorry if you think that Michael haters are wrong but I'm probably the most "Michael hater" (I don't think I've never seen any poster who hated Michael more than I do. On the contrary, I got into many discussions with fellow marathoners -even fairpenguin who's a Justin fan!- who were defending him and/or his behavior). I think it's more accurate to say that most posters here are B/J fans, some of them also hate Michael but not all of them.

Personally speaking, I can't see any redeeming quality in that character. I myself am surprised sometimes when I agree with him or think he did something right but I do say it when I see it (and I joke about it because he's supposedly my least favorite character on the show). There's no point in trying to convince each other to love a character; that's a personal taste (you can try and convince them to see a certain behavior/action differently).
The strangest thing is that based on my character and real life, I should've loved and shipped the Brian/Michael relationship and not Brian and Justin's, because I always value friendship over romance; in fact romance never had any value for me in my personal life (friendship and family have always come first). But I don't know, I think I was affected by the ways the actors played their characters: to me, Brian and Justin had amazing chemistry and Michael seemed more like "a jealous ex in love" with Brian and not like a best friend.
I hate Michael for many reasons and not only because I like Justin (Melanie comes before Justin on my list of favorite characters) or the B/J relationship. I mostly hated the discrepancy between how Michael is supposed to be (the innocent sweet next-door neighbor according to other characters and the viewers) and how I saw him (completely the opposite).
I never discounted the importance of Michael in Brian's life but I did say that Brian deserves much better friends than Michael and Lindsay.

I am not you're pet troll
That's obvious from your intelligent posts (even if I disagree with some of them :)). I'm sure the poster was just kidding because there's no way that Lucien would be able to write anything past "I hate Justin" in different "creative" ways, lol.

Brianwashed!

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[–] katiedyd 12 years ago

There were some tolerable moments and interesting contributions from his character, but most of the time I found him really annoying and kind of squicky. Everytime I think of that scene in 201 where he comes back from Portland to Brian's loft and catches Brian with the bloody scarf... the part where you see just a close up of Michael's eyes perving at Brian through the slats as he undresses for his shower, I shudder.

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[–] dergil27 12 years ago

Even though Michael is my favorite,I don't see him as the incredibly sweet, excessively kind person some of the other characters believe him to be either.He rarely thinks before he speaks and he can be quite spiteful.But for me his good qualities far outnumber the bad.If Michael were actually the near saint that his mother makes him out to be,he would be very boring indeed.

Funny that you should name Mel as one of you're favorites.Because Melanie, almost entirely due to her actions in season five,is the one qaf character I hate.Swear I'm not saying this just to be annoying.

No, there shouldn't be one correct opinion.But I suspect that many qaf fans come here,check out the board,then stay if they agree with the consensus and leave if they don't.If this is so, it's too bad,since different ideas would make for more interesting discussion.

.................

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[–] mysteryjdc 12 years ago

He was never a favorite but I think by about mid season 3 the character never bothered me anymore.

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[–] Suki_Weeks 12 years ago

He was one of my favs. I think Justin should have gone at the end of S1 for sure. Michael was the most interesting thing about Brian imo.

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[–] 12 years ago

[deleted]

[–] dergil27 12 years ago

I really don't think the creators were trying to pattern Michael off of Vince.If they were they would not have cast a comic actor of short stature and boyish appearence.And even in the earliest scenes Brian treats Michael with much less respect than Stuart treated Vince.Michael is also more immature and less confident than his British counterpart.And these differences are in the script not just in the portrayal by the actor.Likewise Brian and Justin are not Stuart and Nathan.In the original model, after an affair of sorts, Nathan becomes more of a disiple of Stuart rather than a long term lover.Since the US creators obviously were not taking this route,there is no reason to suspect that they wanted an American accented Vince either.

Wasn't bothered by Michael's jealousy of Justin early in the series.Because it was to be expected under the circumstances.Michael wanted Brian,Justin was a romantic rival.If anything Michael should have been even more hostile.How many people would have a meal with the person who is moving in on what you believe to be your territory? At any rate,over time,as Michael's romantic designs on Brian faded,so did his jealousy of Justin.This did take awhile.Michael still had pronounced sexual feelings for Brian up til mid season two,with a few brief flashes in the third season. But by the fourth season, Michael has moved on from Brian and has become friends of a fashion with Justin. There is little to no Brian lust or resentment of Justin by the fourth season that I can see.By the fifth season Michael is practically a cheerleader for Brian and Justin's relationship.Almost irritatingly so in my opinion.

As for the idea that they needed less Michael and more of the other characters.More Emmett? While Emmett was certainly a more fleshed out character than his UK counterpart,(yet another major difference between the two series),he didn't have enough edge to carry more screentime than he allready did.More Justin? Actually liked scenes where Justin interacted with "the gang" as much as anything in the show.Certainly wouldn't mind more of that.But these scenes were rare.And more Justin would most likely mean more Brian/Justin scenes.Which would mean more B/J sex scenes, since this is what this couple seemed to spend most of their time doing. And there's already a surplus of those.More of the girls? More of what exactly? More of Mel's screaming,Lindsay's annoying speach habits,more of both of them complaining almost constantly? I would rather see an explicit sex scene with Debbie and Horvath than be subjected to one more minute of Mel and Linds. So no,there was not to much Michael in the show.

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[–] 12 years ago

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[–] dawnlxix 12 years ago

By the fifth season Michael is practically a cheerleader for Brian and Justin's relationship.Almost irritatingly so in my opinion.

I didn't see it that way at all. Michael, if anything, has finally become resigned to the fact that Brian and Justin's relationship is serious and Justin isn't going away anytime soon. If Michael was really such an exuberant cheerleader on behalf of their relationship his reaction to getting their marriage announcement wouldn't have been "this is bullsh!t." I would have liked, just for once, to see Michael be happy for someone else without b!tching and moaning about how unfair his life is. At his age he shouldn't need to have Ben and Debbie constantly point out to him that everything isn't always all about him. Michael never thinks of anyone but himself and is constantly whining. That's why I hated him as a character, not because I'm a B/J shipper and see him as a threat. Michael was never a threat to that relationship. Not.for.one.second.

http://i43.tinypic.com/2mda2o.jpg

http://bit.ly/GIA9PI NSFW

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[–] charmingnancy 12 years ago

I love all the characters on the show, but I usually found the Brian/Michael relationship to be a bit annoying. I think Michael knew that Brian was probably never going to be his, and just nibbled on whatever crumbs that Brian offered him. Even when Michael met David, Michael was still concerned about Brian, to the point of most of their problems being about Brian. I always thought it was silly that Michael only moved in with David after Brian outed him to Tracy at his birthday party. David knew it, but he took Michael back regardless.

It took the bashing for Michael to realize that Justin was more than just a boy-toy to Brian. Seeing that bloody scarf when Brian took his shirt off when he thought Michael wasn't looking was a big clue. Once Justin moved back in, Michael accepted them more. Then he met Ben, and he devoted himself more to him than he did to David. It hurt Michael to learn that Brian and Ben hooked up before, and it took all his strength to tell Brian to leave when Brian offered himself to him.

By Season 5, Michael was ready for Brian to grow up and was disgusted with Brian when Justin briefly moved in with him and Ben. He was angry at first to find out that Brian and Justin were going to get married, after Brian was so anti-commitment for so long before and belittled what he had with Ben, Hunter, and JR. But then he remembered that Brian and Justin really loved each other and was happy that they were wanting to make it official.

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[–] jaroslaw99 12 years ago

dawnlxix - It has been a while since I've watched S4 & 5 so I can't honestly say if Michael was a cheerleader or not for the B/J relationship. I think Michael was supportive with a touch each of resignation and slight yearning. BUT Michael's reaction to the wedding announcement had nothing to do with any of that. Brian trashed conventionality and tradition every single chance he got, which included anything that mirrored heterosexuality especially weddings. Michael's reaction was completely rational, expected and had nothing whatsoever to do with whether he liked Justin, the B/J relationship or not.

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[–] dergil27 12 years ago

.....On the Vince/Michael everyman question.

I just meant to say that Vince and Michael are not identical characters.As to Michael being the person with whom we are supposed to identify,maybe,maybe not.Since I never identify with any television characters ever,I really don't give this much consideration.Since it doesn't matter to me,I have no opinion on Michael as our window to the qaf universe or not.So I concede you may be right. However,I don't believe the creators meant for Michael to be the sweet lovable boy next door.Michael did describe himself that way,but he also said he was five,ten, eight and a half cut.Pretty sure we're not supposed to believe all that.But if the creators really did envision Michael as a sweet innocent everyman,then yes,they definitely failed.And thank goodness they failed.For a cuddly, angelic Michael would be a major yawn to watch on screen.If an ultra kind, Miss Melanie Wilkes level of goodness Michael was who we had been presented with,I'd be the first to complain.

I don't have any sympathy for Michael still following after Brian after fourteen years either. Just saying his treatment of Justin was not so out of line given Michael's deluded romantic hopes.Michael did get over Brian but I believe it ended sooner than you seem to think.In the early third season and a couple of episodes later in the year there are a "few brief flashes" of Michael still hung up on Brian.Perhaps brief flashes was an understatement.You really can't tell how Michael feels about Brian at this point,but he doesn't seem to yearn for Brian as before.When Brian asks Michael to come out with him in episode one,he refuses,and only agrees to go after Ben(sometimes I wonder if Ben is as smart as everyone thinks)tells him he should.And Brian certainly steps up the suggestive behaivior with Michael at Babylon and two eps. later at the underwear party.Don't think Brian would need to do this if Michael were still as smitten with him as he used to be.Michael does go off on Justin twice in ep.one, once to his face and once to Brian.Michael's extreme hostility here is,according to the man himself, due to his outrage over Justin's ingratitude after all that Brian did for him.I'll go with this.Had Michael still been hell bent on having Brian,Justin's leaving would have suited his purposes perfectly.His anger would not have been so great.At any rate,it all ended when Ben threatened to move out and Michael said no to a trip to New York,effectively choosing Ben over Brian.As I see it,there was still a little bit of longing for Brian and jealousy of Justin,but not much.When first seeing Michael looking pissed at the"greatest reunification since Germany", I could only assume he was upset that Brian had taken Justin back so easily after Justin's betrayal of him. Don't think it's jealousy because if Michael had been pursuing Brian, he had stopped some time ago.Of course there is no evidence to support any of this. The writers give no clue as to why Michael is so upset.As for the handprints comment in the fourth season.I confess to not remembering this.But even if I saw it and forgot it,which must be what happened,I still believe if it had registered as romantic longing I would have at least remembered that.

Justin as a moving man I do remember.It really is too bad they didn't do more with his character.But as it was he was little more than an appendage to Brian and as such deserved no more screentime than he allready had.All the characters had their moments,but in my opinion Brian and Michael were by far the most interesting people on the show.Both deserved every second of airtime they got.

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[–] 12 years ago

[deleted]

[–] dvlaries 12 years ago

there were some points where I just really REALLY wanted to punch him in the face. How do you guys feel about him?

Happy to jump in; I was just dealing with this same point at YouTube.

Michael is an overgrown child. After the first sex between he and David (at the old apartment Michael shared with Emmett), Michael is, the very next day, spilling his guts at the gym to his usual trio of familiars. Before they've even met David or shook his hand, Ted, Emmett & Brian are all fully versed in David's bedroom technique, thanks to no other cause but Michael's big mouth. That's not the behavior of anyone who is ready to be anybody's devoted lover (regardless of where your opinion of David falls).

Michael's lack of class -and inability to recognize it when it's in front of him- was made baldly clear the night of he and David's first date. After bringing Michael home from the expensive restaurant, Michael starts to go down on David in a parked car, on a public street! When he's respectfully dissuaded, Michael heads off to Babylon's backroom in tantrum mode, and the first willing and nameless stranger.

Then later, when trouble comes to their relationship, and David confesses being at the baths, Michael's reaction is to hurry to the old apartment and spill his guts -again- to Ted, Emmett & Brian (who already knew).

Whether the news is joyful or sorrowful, Michael Novotny has no sense about keeping anything private.

I got plenty of complaints about Brian, but while he will brag to Michael about doing some inconsequential underling on his desk at work, he does not sit around the diner or gym exclaiming all the ways he and Justin tried the night before. Brian, unlike the three stooges he hangs with, knows what to keep private.

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[–] dergil27 11 years ago

Michael was quite immature in the first season. But he shouldn't be judged to harshly on his behavior with David on the first date. When David was hesitant to sleep with Michael, he was confused and insulted. To Michael, David not wanting to have sex with him at the first opportunity was seen as a rejection. But Michael clearly had little to no experience with actual dating. And it's implied his concept of "romance" had been limited to trips to backrooms and allys or the odd one night stand. The man who followed him home in the first episode didn't even want to make small talk.

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[–] dergil27 12 years ago

.................dvlaries

If you don't mind someone asking? Who are you talking to exactly.Maybe it's just me,but in your posts I can only make out one side of the conversation.Only bothering you about this because I thought I saw something addressed to me earlier.Came back later to answer and it and it was gone.Maybe I imagined it.Stay away from here less than 48 hours and I'm already lost.

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[–] dvlaries 12 years ago

.................dvlaries

If you don't mind someone asking? Who are you talking to exactly.Maybe it's just me,but in your posts I can only make out one side of the conversation.Only bothering you about this because I thought I saw something addressed to me earlier.Came back later to answer and it and it was gone.Maybe I imagined it.Stay away from here less than 48 hours and I'm already lost.

I've tried to correct my earlier ones for you, as to whose remarks I was answering or continuing from.

I'm sorry if I confused you.

I've been spoiled in recent years by far more advanced boards that let you embed pictures, embed videos and music players, pick your own fonts and colors and have abundant emoticons. More pertinently, they will immediately indent and quote the post you're answering so there's no confusion. IMDB really needs to get into the 21st century that way. I thought I'd left these types of rudimentary functions behind at the Sho board in 2005.

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[–] dergil27 12 years ago

Thanks for clearing that up.

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[–] Suki_Weeks 12 years ago

I love Michael. If only he had done in Justin at some point- the show would have been great and not the huge let down that it was.

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