Janeway outranking Picard
I'm hoping it is only because Picard has to be a Captain in order to remain on the Enterprise.
Admiral Janeway v Captain Picard?
The Federation must be full of politics for this to happen.
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MovieChat Forums > Star Trek: Nemesis (2002) Discussion > Janeway outranking Picard
Isn't voyager set waaay ahead of TNG? How is she even alive?
I hate how you can't tell people's signatures from the rest of thier posts
They were set about the same time, he ship leaving shortly after the Enterprise's sixth year in space. Additionally, following backstories and general information from the producers he refused admiralcy in order to remain in command of the Enterprise and not as he puts it "behind a desk." Her stance after seven years lost in space, is she's done with active duty and is teaching at Starfleet Academy whilst working as Admiral. It's quite simple.
shareAh. The timeline on Wikipedia is misleading, I guess.
I watched TNG every week, religiously, with my parents. When the other Star Treks started coming out, it sort of cheapened the experience. I never got into DS9 or Voyager.
I have been revisiting Star Trek in the past few months. My wife, kids, and I have been watching TNG and the movies in chronological (aired) order. We just finished TNG and all the movies, and are moving on to Enterprise, DS9, then Voyager.
I hate how you can't tell people's signatures from the rest of thier posts
I've long loved Kate Mulgrew, so went from being a super Picard fan, to falling in love with Voyager, NEVER got into Deep Space 9 except for the Worf or O'Brien centered ones. Felt like old times. ;)
shareFollowing general backstories and information from the producers is just a cheap way of getting around the fact that it is a mistake to show Janeway as an Admiral while Picard never was. You'd think that something like that would warrant a mention somewhere along the way in the series or movies, but instead all we have is what the producers say after they decide to put in a lame and unneeded cameo from Mulgrew.
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Whose idea was it for the word "Lisp" to have an "S" in it?
If you have such a problem with it, don't watch the movie... the rest of us simply got a kick out of her giving him an order. It's not a big deal man.. Both Mulgrew and Stewart loved having the piece, and Patrick Stewart pointed out that Picard has long despised the idea of having to give up the Enterprise for a desk job, berrated his counterparts for doing so.
shareIf you have such a problem with it, don't watch the movie >>> That is seriously one of the dumbest responses a person can possibly offer up. But thanks for saying what basically amounts to the fact that you can't argue the facts but desperately felt the need to chime in anyway! Who cares what actors point out when the plot doesn't bother to explore it at all? Your love of Kate Mulgrew doesn't magically change anything.
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Whose idea was it for the word "Lisp" to have an "S" in it?
Dumb response or not doesn't change the fact that you have problems with a movie you insist on watching. I don't have to argue any facts at all, simply put... she's Admiral and he's off to save the Federation. You can either watch it, or don't watch it, it AMAZES me the amount of people who complain about canon of Trek, just watch the show. It didn't alter timelines, it didn't screw with the temporal plane of the 24th century, she took a promotion, he did not.
shareNothing dumb about it just because you can't repudiate it. I guess by your logic, if someone has a problem with any aspect of a film, then they aren't allowed to like any or it or to view it. Now THAT is what I call a dumb point of view, a call to be a blind sheep who likes it all or who can't have any of it.
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Whose idea was it for the word "Lisp" to have an "S" in it?
After everything that Voyager went through in the Delta Quadrent, and the wealth of information they were able to provide for Starfleet, is it any surprise that Janeway was promoted to Admiral? As others have said she took an offered promotion, Picard didn't. I really can't understand this hatred of Janeway and Voyager. She and Picard are both excellent Captains on their respective ships. I would loved to have seen a Voyager movie, it would have been a damn site better than JJ's killing of Star Trek.
"I thought you said your contact was in the car..."
"No I said my contact WAS the car!"
i think men just have a problem with a woman being in authority!!!!
shareJaneway = Promoted to admiral after her triumphant return from the Delta Quadrant.
Picard = Refused promotion, following his own previous precedent and also advice from Kirk, to continue as a captain in command of an active vessel.
Actually, at some point, Starfleet would probably establish a regulation that an Admiral could command an active service vessel if he/she so saw fit and Starfleet Command gave its approval. So no more gymnastics necessary like Kirk having to demote Decker or shove Spock aside.
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4) You ever seen Superman $#$# his pants? Case closed.
The problem with that idea is, who would be handing down the orders to an Admirals ship? There wouldn't really be a whole lot of missions on offer, I don't imagine.
Prof. Farnsworth: Oh. A lesson in not changing history from Mr. I'm-My-Own-Grandpa!
Incorrect. I was not privy to the information provided above, yet came to the exact conclusion stated.
Look at Picard as a character. He is NOT the type to sit behind a desk and give orders. He's an explorer and adventurer. It only makes sense that if it was offered, he would reject an Admiral position.
Prof. Farnsworth: Oh. A lesson in not changing history from Mr. I'm-My-Own-Grandpa!
Picard was offered at promotion to admiral & the position of commandant of Star Fleet Academy back in TNG's season 1. He chose to turn those down because he liked commanding a Starship on the "final frontier" better. When he met legendary captain James T Kirk in "Star Trek: Generations" Capt Kirk even told him 'don't let them transfer you, promote you or do anything to get you out of that Captain's chair.'
shareAHH A voice of reason. That's what I said (minus the quote from Kirk).... I love how people have such an attitude over it. Some people accept a promotion and within cannon, Picard will always turn it down. So if Picard keeps turning it down, I ask our 'friend' here they can't offer Janeway a promotion? Stupid.
share"don't watch the movie..." the point of this board is so we can discuss the movie. That's an answer for censors, not people who want to share opinions.
As for the Captain/Admiral thing... does anyone remember she left a guy behind? Maybe she wanted to get married and settle down. At any rate, after 7 years in space trying to get home, it's understandable that she might prefer not to go into space again.
But I also think it suits the characters. I can't say why, exactly, but it seems more appropriate for Picard to remain in command of a Starship, and Janaeway to take on administrative duties.
Patton belonged in the field. Bradley belonged at the Pentagon. And while one might argue that Patton ought to have an honorary fifth star, i guess Captains must remain at the command of the admiralty. Can't have a Captain saying "I outrank you, and I'm going in to fight the borg."
(Better to have him do it as an act of mutiny?)
Coordinates 0/0/0/0 is God's kitchen
"Don't watch the movie" becomes that end all cause someone's being dumb about it.
Anyway, the guy she left behind married, so that wasn't happening, but maybe she found a new guy? :P
The only one being dumb is you, with your ignorant "don't watch it at all" attitude if someone disagrees with you. Jackass.
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Whose idea was it for the word "Lisp" to have an "S" in it?
The reason Janeway is an admiral is that they wanted to give Mulgrew a cameo and that's how they wrote it in. Theories are stupid because there is no base for them, they're just made up. They don't mean anything. Someone else can come along, write something and blow your theory out of the water even if that's what the original writer intended. Heck, there are some writers who do whatever they want even if it contridicts previous work.
And complaining about them not explaining why she is an admiral is stupid too. Who cares? It really didn't contribute anything to the movie anyway. All it did was make people complain about it.
And he's right, if you don't like something you shpuldn't be watching it. There's no rule about bitching about it on IMDb though
Bristol Palin is only a "star" in Bizzaro Worldshare
Thank you ;) Didn't say they couldn't bitch about it, but it started off as an over the top irritated pissy attitude about a cameo role Mulgrew played. Done.
shareThat you keep fueling. Not liking something in a movie doesn't mean not liking the movie. It's the absolute most ignorant thing that can come out of a viewer's mouth. I don't like a few things, but I like other things, therefore I am forbidden from watching the movie by your dumbass logic. And I don't know why you are thanking him, for he basically wrote a paragraph explaining why you are wrong. Way to focus on one small point while ignoring the whole. You started the whole thing with your stupid comment to an opinion, end of story. Now get the hell over yourself and stop pretending like you are innocent.
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Whose idea was it for the word "Lisp" to have an "S" in it?
Well, I do agree this is being blown out of proportion, it's insanely simple.
Picard has rejected every offer of a promotion.
Janeway was offered a promotion and clearly accepted.
We can interpret why as much as we want (and really, sick of 7 years away from Earth is perfectly plausible), but it really is as simple as the above. Why be mad about it?
The most logical reason: Janeway was in a quadrant of the universe long enough were no other Captain was before. It makes sense to have her as an Admiral at Earth to lecture at Starfleet about it. And before someone says anyone else of the Voyager crew could be at Starfleet for that reason hell it's only movie entertainment not science.
share"The most logical reason: Janeway was in a quadrant of the universe long enough were no other Captain was before. It makes sense to have her as an Admiral at Earth to lecture at Starfleet about it. And before someone says anyone else of the Voyager crew could be at Starfleet for that reason hell it's only movie entertainment not science."
I really didn't read this and intend to be a jerk, but that's actually the least logical reasoning. It's not an admiral's job to lecture about it, and technically Sisko spent more time in the Gamma Quadrant than any other captain and since the Gamma Quadrant is even less explored than the Delta Quadrant, why isn't Sisko an admiral lecturing about it?
Anyway, captains, commander and even ensigns can lecture. I would assume that active admirals have the least amount of time available to them to lecture.
It really didn't contribute anything to the movie anyway.
And pointless scenes that don't contribute to the story are what every great film needs more of.
That said, it's not how little the scene adds that I find as the biggest flaw, it's how it takes away from Starfleat competence. Janeway as one of the three highest ranking admirals ever seen? Sh-t, they're all doomed.
share
It's just a movie. There is no such thing as Starfleet.
Ohhh, a lesson in not changing history from "I'm my own grandpa".share
God what a baby and sexist turd you are.
I think she's the saddest girl ever to hold a martini.
Janeways BF had moved on. But it's quite simple. Jean Luc Picard and many of his crew were able to get full on promotions but chose to remain where they were. Picard could have become admiral multiple times during TNG. Especially after First Contact and Insurrection, Picard could have become an Admiral. Picard simply doesn't want to. He likes being Captain of the Enterprise. He's basically a super captain. Riker could have become a captain many times during TNG and again each film. They dealt with that back when Picard became a borg. Crusher and Worf had actually moved forward at some points but returned. Geordi is the same way.
For Voyager, they were certainly all tired of the mission. Janeway did more then enough to become an Admiral. Hell her crew destroyed the borg or at least a massive invasion into federation space.
She outranks Picard only because she chose to be promoted. Picard could probably get promote to the tippity top if he desired.
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That was an offer back in season 1. I would find it very unbelievable that in the next 6 er.. 14 years he never got a new promotion offer, one that would not entail leaving the Enterprise. Why would an admiral only do desk jobs? In All Good Things (TNG finale) Riker said as admiral you get to command any ship you want.
shareSimple. Picard still wanted to explore. Janeway probably wanted to stick close to Earth.
And Picard probably remembered what Kirk told him in Generations.
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Star Destroyer said it best...
JANEWAY: Hello, Jean-Luc. I'm an Admiral, and you're not.
PICARD: Fu** off, b*tch! I saved Earth a half-dozen times and all you did was find your way back there after getting lost.
Ah...but they've both shared a bed with Q.
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Best explanation I got,
Picard is happy where he is, on the Enterprise. Really, in the Star Trek 24th century, if you're happy somewhere, why would you want to leave?
Janeway, however, after being lost in the Delta Quadrant for seven years, is fine to not be on a starship anymore. She just wants to stay on Earth, and who could blame her. She was likely seen as a hero of sorts after returning to Earth, so why not promote her?
Agreed Action on deck
shareI thought it was The Dilbert Principle in action.
The thing is, Bob, it's not that I'm lazy, it's that I just don't care.
How about this for food for thought:
TNG, DSN were off the air when Voyager came back at the end of the series. The next series Enterprise was about the past. The only thing that happened after the end of Voyager was Nemesis and then next thing that happens is JJ's Star Trek.
So pretty much, the standard canon Trek series timeline ended when Voyager returned to Earth. And next apperance of Janeway is as an Admiral in Nemesis.
Why is this so complicated and causing this much of an arguement? Are you looking for the "offical" explanation like they wanted Jeri Ryan to do a part in Nemesis but she turned them down because she was doing that TV show and Kate Mulgrew was out of work, so they wrote her in as an Admiral to give Picard orders? Ok, there you have it.
You're pissed off because they promoted Janeway over Picard to admiral? Really? You're pissed off because of that? Oh dear lord, the Star Wars nerds are right...Trek nerds can be as bad as they say...
Its teeny tiny arguements like this that make me ashamed to call myself a Trek fan. Sheesh.
I think people have also forgotten that Janeway almost single handily destroyed the entire Borg Collective in Voyager's final episode and brought with her new toys from future Admin. Janeway.
Fostering alliances in the Delta Quadrant on part of the Federation may not have lead to a promotion to an admiral but ridding of the galaxy's greatest scourge more likely will.
I don't get why people have such an issue with that, Picard didn't want promotion because he was happy being a captain. Janeway obviously had enough action and wanted a nice safe desk job.
Don't you hate it when a signature looks like part of the post?
Janeway was given the position because she bought a ship home after being lost for seven years. Plus she probably accepted a position at Star Fleet command or at a large station near Earth and was given the rank to match the position.
http://reviewae.blogspot.com
What did Picard have on earth for him to be promoted to Admiral for (to be stationed at Starfleet HQ)? His brother and his family died, he was the last of the Picard's (see Star Trek: Generations), never settled down and in his advancing years wasn't likely to start a family.
Plus as other posters have said, he never wanted to leave the Captain's chair, the Enterprise was his home, the crew was his family.
Janeway on the other hand was a fast track officer IIRC (see Caretaker), and was out to make her way up the chain of command. Her crew was to be broken up upon returning home and more than likely replaced. No doubt due to having more of an insight into the Borg than any other captain (bar probably Picard) she was a valuable and key asset for any Borg intelligence/ counterforce division at HQ.
Besides her rank was only Vice Admiral, which is one above Rear Admiral (which took over from Commodore some time between TOS and TNG). She is a career woman, and one that is looking to make a name for herself.
Look at Spock and Scotty, they were made Captains, but still stayed under Kirk's command. For some in starfleet, like real life, so many people are used to one way of life, and dont want anything to change, they are happy with their station in life and are contempt and satisfied. Picard is one of these people. Janeway is not.
"My name is Lt. Aldo Raine"
Picard, like Kirk, probably doesn't care for Admiralty. He would prefer the excitement of traveling the galaxy. Picard is an explorer, not a desk jockey.
Prof. Farnsworth: Oh. A lesson in not changing history from Mr. I'm-My-Own-Grandpa!
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Re: Janeway outranking Picard
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reachrob-1
ยป 12 hours ago (Wed Dec 18 2013 14:26:46)
IMDb member since April 2008
The most logical reason: Janeway was in a quadrant of the universe long enough were no other Captain was before. It makes sense to have her as an Admiral at Earth to lecture at Starfleet about it.
The only person that promoted Janeway was...........Admiral Owen Paris (Tom Paris Dad). According to this article it says "Janeway was promoted shortly after her return to Earth in 2378 by Admiral Owen Paris." Here is the rest of the information
http://memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/Kathryn_Janeway
This is a wiki, therefore not credible or valid. share
In Star Trek: Nemesis, why did Kathryn Janeway get promoted to admiral before Picard?
https://www.quora.com/In-Star-Trek-Nemesis-why-did-Kathryn-Janeway-get-promoted-to-admiral-before-Picard