People Who Hate Brenda?


I posted this on an old threat but no one's noticed it for a while. Note: I'm about to finish the series for the first time tomorrow! Anyway...

Personally, I think Brenda is the greatest character I've ever seen on a screen. So complex, so perfectly acted, and such an incredibly consistent supplier of both hysterical and really moving one-liners... Kind of sad about how much hate she gets. Anyone willing to explain their specific problems with her, other than the fact that she's quite flawed (aren't all the best-written characters)? I mean, some people could hate her as a person (I still wouldn't but I'd understand that), but as a character it's hard for me to believe people could deny how amazing Brenda Chenowith really is.

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I didn't hate Brenda at all. She's very complex and conveys a lot of emotions for one person and that is very honest and truthful with people in real life. I really grew to like her more near the end, her character is very real. I hope you enjoy the rest of the episodes, I just rewatched properly after years of missing episodes and I was a lot younger. Have a box of tissues on the last episode if your a softie, as I definitely am one! :)

???

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Great! Glad to hear it; it's kind of creepy to read some of the things people say about her.
One episode left, scheduled for viewing tomorrow night!! I usually don't cry but I've heard that almost everyone does for this episode. I'm so excited. I'll definitely be rewatching this masterpiece immediately...sorry, homework!

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Enjoy!
Xx

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I too grew to like her character and hated Nate for what he done in the final season.

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She's my favorite character!! I also don't understand all the hate towards her.

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I completely agree! At first I was a bit annoyed with her, but after you finish the show, she's without a doubt the most complex female character ever created on television. Claire is still my favorite character on the show, but that might be because I'm currently the same age as her now and relate to her more than any character on the shows geared toward my age group. When I'm Brenda's age, I imagine I'll relate to her more and when I'm Ruth's age, I'll hopefully find a new appreciation for what her character goes through (I still think she's a great character, I just don't relate to her well right now).

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It's amazing how versatile this series is. It continues to mean something, but those meanings change as you do as you continue to live life. It even has things to say about death - a lot of things...

Let's avoid a big emotional rant here and just say that Six Feet Under is something special.

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Ohhh I miss the show already and I only finished two weeks ago...haha! :)
Mad how you can miss a show so much!

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I finished it the day before yesterday and one I get over grieving I'm starting a complete rewatch for sure.

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I agree. I was sad as I approached the final episodes.

I grieved along with the family that Nate died. I would miss Nate and miss the show.

As far as feelings about Brenda,

I always admired Brenda for surviving that kind of mother. So toxic that it seemed like pure evil sometimes.

Brenda did the best she could under those circumstances

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I always admired Brenda for surviving that kind of mother. So toxic that it seemed like pure evil sometimes.

Brenda did the best she could under those circumstances


I was majorly disappointed with Brenda. She was supposed to have an I.Q. that was off the charts, yet she worked as a masseuse. We saw her in a college classroom once, some humanities course, and she never went back because she decided that grades were subjective and based on how much students flattered and fraternized with the professors.

Duh! Then why not go into a field that is more objective and scientific? In math or science there are clear cut right and wrong answers and you'll be graded on those no matter what the teacher thinks of you. With Brenda's brain she could have excelled in anything.

But no, she had to point out how the world is shÎt and give up on school and remain a victim.

What kind of hope do women have when even a gifted one is shown as having such modest aspirations on TV shows?

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What kind of hope do women have when even a gifted one is shown as having such modest aspirations on TV shows?


The show was not created to give women hope as much as to give people lessons.

Every character had flaws and gifts, not just Brenda.

I still say the show was pretty clear how Brenda survived being raised by a ruthless mother. One could have empathy and give her kudos for managing as well as she did. But isn't that part of the lesson?

So I agree, I don't align with those deciding to hate her.

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One could have empathy and give her kudos for managing as well as she did


In an early season Brenda was said to have an I.Q. of 170-180. Do you realize how smart that is? That's literally Einsteinian.

She could do anything with that brain. If she had to be dysfunctional, why not make her a workaholic in a high-level, high-pressure job in a scientific field? Oh, because that isn't as sexy as making her a masseuse who picks up strange men in airports and bangs them in the baggage area. Nate wouldn't have been attracted to her then.

Since this all Brenda was, then she didn't manage well at all. She's a colossal waste of space.


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...because intelligent people automatically have to go into the sciences, in order to reassure other people's stereotypes?

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because intelligent people automatically have to go into the sciences, in order to reassure other people's stereotypes?


And why not, for a change? You can do this without making it a stereotype. That was just one suggestion. Why not make her a doctor? We can and do see masseuses, hairdressers, bookkeepers elsewhere on TV (I'm not trying to put down those professions).

She wasn't just garden-variety intelligent, she was supposed to be phenomenal. A person like this would be bored doing the things she was doing.

They probably should have just left out this little detail about her.
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Why would the Brenda of seasons 1 and 2 ever be a doctor? She became a masseuse as a form of rebellion against her awful parents who ruined her childhood because they were so obsessed with her intelligence. Early Brenda was an example of a person who could have been more than she was, but because of how deeply her parents screwed her up, she ended up wasting part of her life.

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It was never clear to me what Brenda's parents did to her. Was it actual sexual abuse? All I could gather was that "They had no boundaries". It sounds like they committed adultery multiple times and maybe even held orgies in the presence of the children. But did they actually include the children in their orgies? Her relationship with Billy was twisted.

If it wasn't any kind of sexual abuse, I have trouble understanding her problems. Lots of kids are pushed by parents obsessed with their intelligence and they don't turn out like her. Wasn't she bored as a masseuse? When she finally gets in a college classroom, shouldn't she be elated?

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Every time they were together, Brenda's mother was horrible to her, taking every opportunity to cut her down with cruel, sideways comments and behavior. Could Six Feet Under be any more clear about that? Then it is not too great of a leap to imagine what kind of heartless upbringing Brenda had at the hands of her mother.

On a side note, Joanna Cassidy played that role so well.

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But you don't recall if there was anything more, anything like I just described involved.

When Brenda and her mother were together, they cut down each other. Can't say I like the mother, but she was deeply disappointed by her daughter. As I am.

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Brenda's parents had her studied like a lab rat. 'Charlotte Light and Dark' is enough reason for anyone to rebel against their parents perceived expectations. Brenda rebelled against every expectation that was placed before her in one way or another. I always took her attraction to drugs, promiscuous sex and the like as a way, at least in part, to dull her immense intellect. It was also explained further into the series that Brenda opted out of Yale after Billy tried to kill himself effectively taking up the mantel as his emotional caretaker. This is why it's such a big deal when it's revealed later on that he in fact didn't try to kill himself.

"Living our maggot lives, dreaming of becoming flies."

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I always took her attraction to drugs, promiscuous sex and the like as a way, at least in part, to dull her immense intellect.


I'm disappointed that female characters are always made dysfunctional in a sexual way, by sexual misbehavior, in TV shows. These writers have created the opportunity to take an exceptional female and show us something different, but they make Brenda into just another slut. Her whole life consists of being a messed up person, including a slut. And many female viewers approve of this outcome, justify it by her upbringing.

The writers would never show a male character trying to dull an immense intellect, especially not with sex. If he was dysfunctional, the male character would use his immense intellect to become a criminal, maybe. But at least he would use it. He wouldn't be a passive victim.

No wonder anti-feminists don't think much of women and don't consider them men's equals.

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So it's okay for a male character to sleep with as many people as he wants, but for a female character is makes her a slut? Slut is a pretty derogatory term and it emplies a lack of strength. I don't see Brenda as weak. She certainly wasn't allowing men to take advantage of her sexually. It wasn't to get them to like her. It was sex.

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People like her would be bored. Wow. Well, you have shown you aren't one of them. She was intelligent and chose a different line of work while she was figuring out her life. She became a therapist so you can calm down and bury your hatchet.

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Supposedly she had an IQ of 185. Yet, she NEVER spoke like someone with that kind of IQ! I have encountered a few with IQs equal to or greater than 160, and their thought processes are so lofty they can't easily converse with "normal" people. Of course, that would not make for compelling dramatic TV....

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Seriously? My brother has an off the chart IQ. He swears like a sailor and is a stay at home parent. Just because you have a gifted IQ doesn't mean you need to meet less intelligent people's expectations. My brother actually did what he wanted to do with his life. Although I doubt my brother's everyday vocabulary would bar you from conversing with him, I doubt he'd find you very interesting.

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The person that made that comment is obviously a feminist who is deluded or a troll.

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I'm confused-Did you watch the whole series? I haven't watched the show in years, but I recall as the show came to its conclusion, Brenda was back at school, studying psychology with the goal of becoming a therapist.

As far as her time spent as a masseuse, I don't understand the criticism of that career choice. I don't think she was under any obligation to become a rocket scientist because she was gifted. Frankly, I find your comments rather judgmental. Her character had an amazing arc-she was a fascinating person to watch, even as her choices could admittedly be confounding at times. Everyone has their own journey..

Cheers.

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As far as her time spent as a masseuse, I don't understand the criticism of that career choice


You don't think it's a waste that a person with brainpower that's off the charts chooses to become a massager of bodies and not use her brain at all? It definitely is a waste when someone doesn't use rare gifts. Gifted people can change the world when they use their gifts.

I don't think she was under any obligation to become a rocket scientist because she was gifted.


Not under an obligation, but why not show such a woman once in a while? They do exist. They are never shown in movies and TV except in adolescent-level science fiction, which is usually unsatisfying.

What do so many of you have against a woman in this kind of profession? Just can't identify with it? It's a rewarding profession that can earn one a good living. More women should try it.


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This is starting to feel more like a feminist debate... I agree that women should be portrayed as part of the sciences, and that, yes, such portrayal isn't yet sufficient. But at the same time I don't think it's fair to dislike a character just because she wasn't used by the show in the capacity that would've supported a cause of yours. The very fact that the show portrayed her the way she was has sparked this very conversation - which is not something that would've happened if they had gone the conventional "intelligent = scientist" route. And also, as others have said, her earlier career choices were clearly a part of her character that is not only understandable but meaningful given the context, and later on in the series, after already demonstrating forms of genius outside of the laboratory (which is an idea some people seem to have trouble "identifying with"), she does in fact enter a more intellectual field and she seems to show promise in it.

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Actually the overachieving, intelligent, but dysfunctional female is well over played. Ever see:

1.) Murphy Brown (Attorney)
2.) 30 Rock (TV Producer)
3.) Sex and the City (Every Female Character)
4.) Scrubs (Just look at all the female doctors running around there)
5.) Sons of Anarchy (main character's wife was a surgen with a genius level IQ)
6.) The Americans (Female Russian spy who gives up entire normal existence to be so)
7.) The Devil Wears Prada (magazine empire run by a female megalomaniac)
8.) Dexter
9.)

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Sorry, I accidentally posted too soon.

However, I think it is the underachieving female that has been underplayed on screen.

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Actually the overachieving, intelligent, but dysfunctional female is well over played. Ever see:

1.) Murphy Brown (Attorney)
2.) 30 Rock (TV Producer)
3.) Sex and the City (Every Female Character)
4.) Scrubs (Just look at all the female doctors running around there)
5.) Sons of Anarchy (main character's wife was a surgen with a genius level IQ)
6.) The Americans (Female Russian spy who gives up entire normal existence to be so)
7.) The Devil Wears Prada (magazine empire run by a female megalomaniac)
8.) Dexter


Six Feet Under premiered before all but two of those shows...

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My response may be kind of late, but here is an answer to what Brenda achieved after Nate's death. Just read the obituaries on the HBO page http://www.hbo.com/six-feet-under/episodes/5/63-everyones-waiting/article/obituary.html .
She remarried with someone else, got a PHD, wrote several books,and developed some research methodologies in the field of psychology I think.

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Ironic that her kid from when she remarries has the last name "Nathanson".

Oh and last but not least, this is my signature.

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''I was majorly disappointed with Brenda. She was supposed to have an I.Q. that was off the charts, yet she worked as a masseuse.''

Strangely that does happen-sometimes it's just life's circumstances,not every bright intelligent intellectual person is going to end up in a top job like a surgeon,doctor or lawyer etc. My mum's friend from school performed as one of the best in the country in the state exams yet she ended up packing shelves in a supermarket...

Another girl from my class in Uni was top in the class [and likely the college] and got a 1st in her degree and surpassed every single person in the class at everything and lecturers urged her to go into lecturing and get her PHD, in truth with her brains the girl was wasted in a teacher training course when she had the potential to be doing law or medicine or some of the top courses. Anyway several years after our graduation, she still works in a minimum wage job for a book company that requires little skill, it happens...

A good comparison to this is think of really good looking people you know, the expectation and jealously towards them was that they'd be able to pick an equally beautiful partner or at least have a desirable partner when infact this too often does not happen and I see some beautiful people settle for partners that are well beneath them when they could do much better...





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sometimes when you are really smart you also have issues relating to people properly. i was expected to be a doctor but developed extreme anxiety and according to my parents 'ruined' my life. i'm a total underachiever and feel weird and different. blech.

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''sometimes when you are really smart you also have issues relating to people properly.''



Yes I have too known highly intelligent people who had terrible social skills and just not street smart. I myself am not of high intelligence,just average really but I performed better academically than my brother yet he was much more street smart.

''i was expected to be a doctor but developed extreme anxiety and according to my parents 'ruined' my life. i'm a total underachiever and feel weird and different. blech.''

The same goes for beautiful people, society has an expectation that they'll do pick a perfect partner with equally good looks and do well in life when again I know many cases where this does not happen.

What do you then may I ask? I think the biggest underachiever in life is to be unhappy in your situation whether you are earning top dollar or a high flying doctor, it's still failure to 'have it all' and be miserable with it. I graduated as a teacher and earn an ok wage but I'd trade it all for a relationship.

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i don't work at all. when i did it was just a care aide in a convalescent home. i didn't finish college and i could have went back into nursing but i was always too anxious to be in a classroom.

i get you on the attractive person thing too, i'm not 'beautiful', but cute and now that i'm 45 and single because i was always looking for something better, yeah things change when you get older.

i shouldn't have put such high expectations on myself (in career and love), because no one could achieve what i thought i should. you are smart. good philisophical brain.

ignorance is bliss, it really is...

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Do you have any kids? I'm 30 too and seriously struggle at career and relationships,sometimes it seems so bleak.

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Wow. That is so vitriolic I can't believe it. She chose to be a Massuse because she enjoyed it. She also pursued a masters degree at the end at UCLA. One of the best schools in the world. Do you hate musicians that become drug addicts and don't pump out record after record to appease you? Sheesh.

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I loved the way Brenda was written and acted, don't get the hate either.

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People hate Brenda because she's so unconventional and sharp. I bet that scares the crap out of most people.


*May the force be with you*

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It's funny because I'm actually in the middle of watching the show now (about to start Season 4) and prior to her absence on the show, I was definitely in the group of viewers who disliked Brenda. Due to me spoiling the show for myself, I do know that this changes, but for the first 2 seasons Nate was a generally affable and good person, as opposed to Brenda who seemed to bring chaos and drama with her everywhere she went. The dislike for her was only elevated when she began cheating on Nate (who obviously did the same to her with Lisa), even though she did seem like a genuinely good person, Brenda's compulsive and sometimes manipulative behavior just didn't sit well with me and sometimes even dragged the show down.

But then she left and missed the first handful of episodes in Season 3 and suddenly I found myself missing her, and appreciating the realness and the vulnerability that Brenda brought with her. She clearly wasn't perfect but like I said, she did have a good heart and was well intentioned, not to mention she was extremely well-written and well acted by Rachel Griffiths. I actually cheered when Brenda showed back up into the show. In comparison to Lisa, Brenda just seemed so much more genuine and likable, her cynical view of the world seemed like a much better match for Nate than Lisa's head in the clouds and almost passive aggressive mentality. And now that she's back, Brenda's definitely not without her problems, but the difference now is that I actually find myself rooting for her and feeling for the broken person that she is, as opposed to rolling my eyes when she goes off on one of her tangents.

So that was just my perspective, Brenda was almost unbearable before she left. But I guess you don't know what you've got till it's gone, because now that she's back it's extremely refreshing to watch a character as raw and real as Brenda is.

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I agree.

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That's a blanket statement. Not wise.

Personally, I hate the character because I have ZERO respect for her. She LIES constantly and cheats. That's enough for me.

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I hated Brenda for the first 7-ish episodes of S1, when I was first watching, because I found her a flighty, annoying manic pixie dream girl who seemed to always be naval-gazing in a way that was pretentious and unconvincing to the extreme, floating in and out of scenes while uttering one or two "meaningful" lines and making doe eyes at Nate.

From the episode where she went home, though, I loved her (and, for all its cringe-inducing ugliness, I love her family), and I think she gives the best performance on the show, especially noticeable when she gets landed with a poor storyline (like her and Nate's affair in S4, IMO). Also personally it wasn't a Nate thing because I've never liked Nate THAT much (certainly didn't after S1, anyway).

You sing about the nights, and you laugh about the scars.

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I'm a big tv fan, I've watched hundreds of shows, and I've seen the whole 6FU five times (finishing up again for the sixth time actually). And I can honestly say that Brenda Chenowith is my favourite tv character ever.

Funny thing is, the first time I watched this show, I didn't really care for her, one might even say I disliked her. I was 16 years old, and could relate to other characters much easier (mostly to Claire and David). I liked her a little bit better the second time around (when I was about 18-19), and the third time around (22-23) she became my favourite character.

She really grows on you if you give her a chance. When I first watched the show, I had this... specific set of values, I'd say. And she didn't fit into that, so I didn't like her. With growing older and experiencing more of actual living and screwing up myself, I completely changed my opinion on her. I think that's sort of what determines people's opinion on her. She's definitely very flawed, she realizes it, she tries to fight it, and sometimes she just can't. I think it's very human, I think most of us have been there and it is something we all should be able to relate to, or at least empathize/understand why she does what she does. But I guess some people just can't. Maybe they need to do some more living or screwing up.

I love Six Feet Under, it's by far my favourite show, have seen more of it than of anything else, and Brenda manages to do something incredible, stand out as the most complex and the most real character on a show full of complex and real characters.

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I think she is a great character and extremely well acted, AND that her character is supposed to upset people. She is almost always discontent, and is quick to voice it, (everything is about her. She's very narcisstic), and she also puts herself in positions that will give her plenty to complain about. That paves the way for her to constantly be feeling hurt, and then responding with her pithy one-liners.

I think the character should have been described just as "smart" and not some sort of genious. If she had really high intelligence, she would have, for instance, limited the abuse her mother continued to throw at her, by telling her mother (after the first insult left her mouth), "Well I'm going to go now. When you're ready to talk to me without insulting me, we can spend some time together." But then, she wouldn't be the victim anymore and the writers would have had less to work with. So my ony problem with the character is that they state she is exceptionally gifted.

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I don't think being a genius saves anyone from lifelong patterns of bickering with their mother. We all get locked into certain behaviors with our family no matter how smart we are or how skillful at managing other things in our lives.

I do agree with you that they might as well have left out the gifted part because she didn't show it in any way. And I don't hate Brenda, by the way.

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I agree.

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