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Embarrassing 50's-era gay stereotype mars otherwise GREAT movie.


Embarrassing 50's-era gay stereotype mars otherwise GREAT movie.

"Made" is a truly funny movie, well paced, well-written, acted and directed.
But about a third of the way through, there's this scene with an effeminate gay interior designer-- striped hair, pink coat-- who sexually harasses the workers until they threaten to beat the crap out of him. He takes their names and has them fired.

I wanted to like the movie. There's so much to like here. But it took me a long time to get back into it after that scene.

There are other gay slams throughout, which is fine. A director has to be true to his characters and some characters are homophobic. But this interior designer character was different. It isn't real. I've been "out" for twenty years. I've lived in New York, the Midwest, the south and Los Angeles, including West Hollywood. I'VE never seen a gay guy like this. Never. And I'm betting with Jon Favreau's limited (we have to assume) contact with gays, HE hasn't either.

The character is an assembly of cliches and stereotypes he's seen in other movies and heard about from homophobic friends.

And there's a anther problem. These guys are being taken advantage of by their boss, but who gets the blame? The gay guy?? Oh, yeah, THAT'S why we get into exploitative economic situations. It's those darn gay guys!

It's bulls**t and it's cheap scapegoating and it's beneath Jon Favreau. And it's also beneath Bud Cort, the frequently underappreciated actor who performed the role.

I am not saying, "Don't see the movie." It's a GOOD movie. REALLY funny. But I wish I'd known this character was in it before I saw it so I could decide whether I wanted to spend money supporting it or not.

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Wow, I just pictured you saying all of that with a lisp. Am I right? So what did you study at Berkley anyway?

You know what I'm tired of.....liberal spewing like what you just wrote. God forbid a writer put in a cliche character. Would you have been as turned off if they had put in a cliche Arkansas redneck? Probably not. Besides, a gay interior designer isn't exactly a cliche.....it's a reality. Why don't you go back to watching old "Ellen" reruns, or do what ever it is you do.




- Cornbread. Ain't nothing wrong with that.

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[deleted]

The movie is a comedy. It's not a historical biography. Realism is not an issue. The gay charater may have been extreme, but I found the scene hilarious. The whole whip thing had me in tears. But maybe I'm just the type of close minded demographic that Favreau was going for. How about the white trash stripper, the black pimp, or the neanderthal ginnys. The movie is loaded with stereotypes. It gives it a lot of it's humor. I'm just tired of people singling out gays and saying we aren't aloud to tease them like everyone else.


- Cornbread. Ain't nothing wrong with that.

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How did you know I had an old Ellen re-run on? Are you spying on me? Excuse me, I meant, are you THPYING on me?

While you're right, clichés are a common comedic tool, the problem was less about the cliché and more about putting the gay guy in the position of sexual harasser. This is like men in the military. They're terrified that there would be gay men in the military ogling them, but have little or no concern for what they're doing to women in the military (Tailhook, the recent West Point sexual harassment scandal).

In the construction scene, these guys are being economically exploited. Their BOSS is their problem, not the gay guy. But the scene scapegoats the gay guy and makes HIM the problem.

And a smart guy like Jon Favreau might have found a way to turn the gay cliché on its head, rather than simply-- for the millionth time-- dragging out this threadbare one.

So there.

I mean-- tho there.

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[deleted]

No, perhaps I wouldn't be insulting Berkley as much if it weren't plagued with long haired, dope smoking, maggot infested hippies! I'm a University of Washington grad, but I'm not really sure what that has to do with anything. And if you were to make fun of UW I surely wouldn't flip out and take it personally. By the way, this is great movie, regardless of any cliche characters.

- Cornbread. Ain't nothing wrong with that.

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Wow, I just pictured you saying all of that with a lisp. Am I right?

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Best comeback ever! Nice, Jason!




I want the doctor to take your picture so I can look at you from inside as well.

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I'm sorry that you aren't a funny gay stereotype and all, but I've known plenty of gay men who were very like that interior designer, as a matter of fact I've known plenty of straight men who are every bit as effeminate as that interior designer. Furthermore, I'd have to say it's incredibly ignorant to dismiss jon favreau as a homophobe who's never come into contact with a gay person. I mean, clearly there's no such thing as gay people in the movie business, you've got to be right about that.
Moving on, what the hell are you talking about? Maxi has nothing to do with that scene. He's the guy who's paying them, but I don't recall anything about unfair wages. If anything it's the other way around, Ricky Slade is ripping off maxi. Second of all, gay or not, the interior designer is their boss and also happens to be a huge dick. There's no way around that. The comedy doesn't come from his being gay it comes from his being a jerk. Ricky isn't mad at the gay guy in his presence, he's mad at the disrespectful jerk who hit him with a freaking horsewhip.

personally, I'd even be pissed if a strait guy hit me with a horse whip. Especially if it was an ignorant one who has no place to do it.

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[deleted]

Bud Cort did the role as a favor to Jon Favreau. Knowing that there wasn't much on paper about 'Bernardo,' Bud was allowed to improvise the part.

When I saw it on DVD, I was at first, in shock when I saw him, all get-up in loud, bright clothing, a blond streaked wig, feminine-styled make-up on his face, jewelry on his neck, hands and wrists, and even his fingernails painted in a soft purple or lilac coloring. "No he didn't," I said to myself, aloud, hands over my mouth in surprise, but enjoying his interaction with Favreau and Vaughn in the scene. A definite over-the-top look and performance, but a hoot to boot!

I don't think he meant to insult any gay people, as some of his best friends, from what I have read about him, are gay, but I think that he did it because that's what was best for his character's appearance, and personality, in that one scene in the film. I have to agree with the poster who said that 'Bernardo' isn't all that stereotypical.

Plus, from studying his films, Bud's a bit of a show-off, and I've noticed that whenever he's been given a small part in a film, or is in a scene where he doesn't have much to say or do, he'll do something to stand out from the other actors in the scene. He, in my humble opinion, owned and enhanced that scene from the moment he walked into it.

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[deleted]

a lot of people think that

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What the *beep* Are you serious? Did you feel the same about Fear and Loathing because of Christopher Meloni's character? And that's a serious question, I'm not trying to attack you at all. I just don't see it. If I dismissed a movie's worth every time a dramatic stereotype was employed I don't think there'd be many movies to enjoy. As far as him not being real (what your personal sexual preference has to do with that I'm still unsure of) I don't know how there can be a character without some basis of reference. I mean, he had to be based on someone. And yes, I have seen several people even more over the top than the character displayed. Whether they were gay, straight, or acting out a role I don't know, nor do I think it matters. Everyone you could imagine exists, whether you've seen them with your own eyes or not.

If there's any personal attack in me, this is it, though it is not intended as an attack. I think you may have been gay-bashed one too many times, whether verbally, emotionally, physically, whatever, and have become hyper sensitive to seeing any comically dramatised use of gay stereotypes. Easy for me to say, I'm sure, but I mean who would you blame if your boss was coming down on you other than your boss, regardless of who your boss was? And I'm sure you've no idea to what extent anyone other than yourself and circle of associates have had contact with gays. I also feel gays in general have little to bitch about as far as economic oppression goes, especially compared to women and minorities. And would Cort have taken and performed the role if he opposed it? Now I am attacking and that's pointless and completely unecessary. I honestly just feel that you are passing judgement very quickly by overanalyzing something obviously very sensitive to yourself. Kudos for stating your opinion, and no offense intended...

And to mr. meyer, 'liberal spewing' is the language this country was founded on, not that that should make a bit of difference to you...

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He was supposed to be cliche'. It's called farce.
Moron.

"Airborne!"

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I didn't say GAYS are suffering economic oppression. Please read the message again.

Even if the effeminate stereotype DIDN'T bother me (and it did) there was still the problem of scapegoating. This second issue doesn't have anything to do with Bud Cort or his choices as an actor, but with the filmmaker.

As I said that in my first message, the two lead characters are being taken advantage of economically by their boss. Who gets the blame for the troubles? The gay guy! It was just stupid. The obvious cause of their problem was the exploitative boss, but we suddenly deflect the blame onto an effeminate gay guy.

The rest of the movie was so smart and good-hearted, but this scene was cheap and it took the whole thing down a notch.

By the way, I saw Elf on DVD with my niece and nephew over Christmas and it was fantastic. Jon Favreau is a wonderful director.

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About the whole scapegoating thing....

When I watched the movie I saw the gay boss smack them with the whip and I laughed my ass off and I thought to myself "i would hate working for a jerk like that"

Never once did I blame it on the fact the character was gay. Nor have I read anyone's posts saying they did either, beside yours. I blamed it on the fact that he was a horrible boss, that I personally would want to kill if he ever smacked me with a whip and talked to me like that.

I could care less if the boss or you or anyone is gay. People's personal lives belong to themselves. I watched that scene and thought of the character as being an *beep*

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Economically exploited?

Huh?

Ricky is pushing around a broom, doing nothing...a big lazy lump - and he's being "economically exploited"? You need to rent the DVD, watch the movie WITH COMMENTARY TRACK and LISTEN to Vince and Jon talk about that scene. Jon specifically makes an effort to point out all the workers slacking off on the job site (notice the big muscle-bound guy walking in the background in the scene where Bobby is talking to the supervisor - he's strutting all the way out real slow and picks up just ONE 2X4 and walks back with it). It's designed to look like there are bunch of deadbeat hangers-on working for Max. It plays into the image of the Ricky character.

These guys are stuck in ruts THEY created. The whole plot of the movie is about a good guy (Bobby) who's made some bad personal decisions and wants to improve himself.

If you know anything about Jon Favreau, you know he's a guy who believes in picking onesself up by the bootstraps and making things happen. He's not one for scapegoating and crying about other people being at fault. He's a doer, not a complainer. He makes his own moves.

Your "worker's rights," Socialism-based take is way off here.

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explain to me who the scapegoat is and why. and in what part of the movie does anybody blame 'the gay guy' for their troubles? i have watched this scene several times and not only cannot see the taking advantage of which you refer, but i also cannot see how you came to the conclusion the insane (15 3/4 studs?)interior designer is gay other than by stereotyping him as such yourself.

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I've got a question. How much were Jon & Vince's characters being paid? Because I don't remember them ever mentioning that. And if they don't mention that, how do you know there were being "taken advantage of economically"? You might want to think about that.


- Cornbread. Ain't nothing wrong with that.

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I wrote that comment a couple of years ago. I say in my comment that they're being taken advantage of by their boss. I don't remeber in what way, but I do remember they were upset about what they were being asked to do for the amount of money they were getting.

But you're picking out a detail to miss the larger point. This is an example of deflecting the true cause of a problem onto a stereotype, in this case a gay guy. It's lazy, crappy writing and not worthy of the rest of the script.

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Okey Dokey.


- Cornbread. Ain't nothing wrong with that.

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this is one of the stupidest things ive ever read.. im gay, and i find nothing wrong with this scene at all..also the designer is not the one who gets the fired, the funny fat man does!

i think stereotypes are hilarous..i enjoy movies about black stereotypes, white ones, and ones of all colors and types.. and this movie is full of them... jon favreau is a brilliant man, and i thank him for writing such an amazing script

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Well put. You are my new favorite person.


- Cornbread. Ain't nothing wrong with that.

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[deleted]

Stereotypes can be useful writing shorthand if used in a fresh way. Or turned on their heads. In Kung Fu Hustle, there are a couple of simpering, wimpy gay guys who can still kick ass in a fight. That's what I mean.

This movie was great otherwise.

No reason to "stop John Favreau". I think he's a great writer. Just a disappointing moment in an otherwise great film.

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[deleted]

Realizing this post is 7 years old....

I don't really see that the gay guy is being scapegoated. I think he is just being portrayed as on obnoxious person, given that there are obnoxious people of ALL persuasions I don't think that is too much of a stretch. I don't think the lead characters ARE being taken advantage of, if anything it is the other way around. Ricky is taking advantage of Max, if anything, by taking a paycheck and pretending to sweep.

I don't think the gay character has all that much to do with the rest of the movie. He is not being scapegoated, I really don't see how that could have been implied by anything in the movie, he is just pompous and full of himself. I don't see that he was being blamed for anything with regard to Jon/Vince, he was just a jerk.

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You obviously have yet to see an episode or commercial of "Queer Eye for the Straight Guy". There are true stereotypes out there. And they are not hard to find. Also, check out the interior decorator for Anna Nicole Smith. Or go to a gay pride parade in SF and you will see all kinds of stereotypes in real life.

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realscience

your original post was 2 years ago and maybe youve changed but- lighten up man
you are one sensitive guy. its a COMEDY. dont watch comedies if you are afraid of encountering a character based on a stereotype.


"is everyone in this house named bobby ricigliano?"

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I'm lightened up! I'm lightened up! I didn't say it ruined my life or anything. I said it threw me out of the movie for a while because it was a cheap shot and put the blame in the scene on the gay guy who wasn't really the source of their problem (although some other posters have disputed my interpretation).

I loved the movie. I did. I think I said that in my original post. I think Jon Favreau is a brilliant filmmaker. (And sexy as hell, too!)

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[deleted]

John Favreau would break me in half? For what reason?

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Okay, Real Science : Watch this movie again, because it's one of my favorites and I've seen it more times than I can count, and what you're talking about never even happens. NOBODY in the movie EVER blames ANYTHING on the gay guy. Got it? Good. Gay guy comes in, hits Vaughn with whip, Vaughn yells at him for it. Interior decorator yells at Favreau about studs, leaves. End of scene. End of any character in the movie even MENTIONING Bud Cort's character, let alone blaming anything on him. You were obviously just looking for a reason to complain because no one ever blames anything on him, and the reason they were fired was not because of what happened with the gay guy. Bobby was fired for punching a bachelor in the face at a strip club. None of the complaints you have made so far have ever actually happened in thhe movie, so look a little closer.

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do you have a horse outside? you don't have to hit me with the f u c king whip man

thats all i have to say

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You make a valid point, headchange. I watched the DVD last night (its fresh in my head) and read this entire thread wondering, "What the F--k is this guy talking about?" To reiterate, the fat boss man calls Bobby aside at the jobsite to see Max because of the thrashing Bobby had put on the guy at the bachelor party. Oh, these construction guys are hardly 'oppressed'. 'I have enough guys pretending to sweep on my payroll.' When you see mafia and construction workers interacting, you should think union boss payoffs, no-show jobs, and teamsters...How is that for stereotyping?

Secondly, since when are homosexuals ever portrayed as the empowered initiators of sexual harassment? If you have never seen it before (I haven't) then it cannot be a stereotype, it reeks more of role reversal, satire, and farce. Watch it again; without the pink shades this time :-P

P.S. The casting in this movie was marvelous. How in the hell did he get Sam Rockwell to play that peon 'the Captain?'

the cause of my ambivalence is the effect of your own--me

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you're 100% right. what about the black pimp (Horrace), the italian mob boss (Max), the single mother that whores herself around (Jessica), the female flight attendant, or the male highschool football coach. this movie has so many steroetypes.

as bad as those are, i feel the most offensive one is the goldfish who "stereotypically" just swims in his little fish bowl and "sterotypically" flops around like an idiot when his bowl is knocked over onto the floor.

John Favreau is a hate monger!!!



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Good one.

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gays are crybabies. not everyone is gonna watch what they say around you because you take it up the ***

Thanks for the fuqqin drinks pal- Donnie Brasco

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You're right. Asking people to watch what they say around me because I take it up the *** does seem unreasonable.



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