Christians?

Wonderful exchange. I can't really add anything of value, in all honesty, but I am enjoying this conversation. A nice, refreshingly even-tempered exchange of honest and open ideas. I will say this, Falwell is affiliated with WBC is Tacoma. Ever hear of a man named Phelps? That's one of his buddies.

I'm pleased to see Christians distance themselves from this particular ilk. Anyway, please continue...

"I actually found out about it because one of my Christian friends was as bothered about it as you guys are"

I found out about it purely by coicidence...by flipping stations last Saturday at noon and seeing something on TBN that made me gasp out in laughter, then disgust. I immediately came here afterwards!

"Not a problem, I just wanted to make sure I wasn't dealing with a Christian hating nut case. You know the type, but I assume you aren't a part of that group. You at least don't seem to be"

Oh yes, I definitely know the type. I very strongly dislike extremism from any side of the issue.

"I don't want to negate the fact that there is a significant number of people who do give them money, whether they agree with the station or whether they are fooled into thinking that it advances the kingdom of God, or whatever other stupidity they use to try and draw people in"

I personally watched a well grounded Christian believer and friend slowly fall into watching TBN on a regular basis. She at first claimed that there were some good things in between all the stupidity that was worthwhile, but before long she was worshipping on her couch with Paul and Jan Crouch on their Golden Thrones. TBN played in her home all of the time. I am only telling this as an example of how this channel can truly take hold of people and mislead them. I never in a million years would have expected this friend to be a TBN follower. It saddens me that this stuff succeeds as much as it does.

"which I took to construe that Christian people in general support TBN"

Yes, I know there are those believers who denounce the silliness that is TBN. I would be interested in knowing some statistics here, for no other reason than curiosity's sake. Really, I don't suppose there are any dependable ones available that aren't biased to one point of view or the other.

"If you're serious, and you seem to be, I sincerely feel sorry for both you and those kids. My apologies and prayers go out to you all"

Actually, I am quite serious, though I am not one that has been personally subjected to this treatment as much as simply witness to it. A friend of mine's mother forced him to watch all things Christian and to only listen to Christian music. He rebelled against this when he was old enough, though is now always in trouble, lies, sex minded, getting divorced, you name it. That forced Christian entertainment did him a world of good growing up. I have known others families as well that try to force their Carmen videos and other Christian entertainment onto everyone who enters their home. These are the audiences that tripe like Bible Man is made for, and I feel sorry for them. Why do some believers do this, for it leads to one of two places...the kid rebels as my friend did, or the kid grows up completely brainwashed and clueless of what his beliefs are really all about (not to mention being in danger of becoming the haughty type who judges). It is nothing but whitewashing reality in the end.

"I don't disagree with practically anything you think, at least in terms of stupidity amongst a certain group of people, but you also can't expect that a group of Christians are going to bite the heads off of another, less intelligent group. This doesn't happen with any large organization or community of people"

Whilst I agree that this isn't the normal reaction, I think I may have this expectation of Christianity to deal with it's own who misrepresent them simply due to the very nature of your doctrine. Christians wish to go out and help others and bring them to God, but really, how can this be accomplished when morons like Robertson and Falwell are forever linked as the voices of Christianity. You and I know they don't reflect the true spirit of the doctrine, but then again, many others don't know this and are increasingly put off from Christianbity by their actions. I have heard believers complain about the current state of Christianity right now, but have any of them ever stopped to think of why so many are down on religion? It is because of the overly loud voice of ignorance from the fundamentalist extremists who don't know their own doctrine, but are in a position to speak for it. To date, overall Christianity doesn't really seem to speak out against this like it should, and it leaves me scratching my head in amazement.

"Besides that, I will personally denounce Falwell for being a simple minded, ignorant jerk and Robertson for being the same."

Kudos to you, for certain!! Still, you mentioned pastors and such who don't endorse these types, but do they make others aware of just how wrong what they say actually is? It can be done without speaking names, without direct references. That is what I am talking about, for if more spoke out against it, these types would lose their effect and no longer be seen by the world as the voice of Christianity. It is just my thoughts, perhaps I am wrong here.

"Case in point, during a gay pride rally/parade/whatever, and this was in Texas too, a certian number of people thought it would be really cute to portray Jesus Christ in various sexual situations with other men, while other held up posters that read "suck **** for Jesus," the edit being my own. I happen to think that this is pretty offensive, but I don't remember any public outrage coming from leaders of the homosexual community (granted, there were a number of leaders in the Christian community who were outraged enough to make up for it)"

Was bringing this up pure coincidence, or did you read my profile?? Anyhow, you make an absolutely excellent point here. Sadly, many in the gay community ARE NOT willing to step up to the plate and put a stop to the outrageous actions that go on in these parades and such. In fact, their blindness to the actual problems it causes our own efforts to advance in the arena of equal marriage rights and such really irritates me to no end, much like your position with the Jerry Falwells of Christianity. This is an EXACT parallel.

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OK, so what's the speed of dark?