Really? Pike?


I was rooting for Dean and Henry. They never really showed a developing romance between Pike and Henry. Yes, Pike had a crush on him, his first gay crush, which most of us gay people know doesn't end up being "the one." They are definitely at different stages in their lives. That is not to say that Dean would have been perfect for Henry, but as a viewer I was much more moved by the whole dynamic between those two. The Pike thing wasn't developed and so you just felt sorry for him but really wanted Henry and Dean to live happily ever after. I have read others' posts about Dean being really straight but it doesn't make much sense. Maybe wishful thinking on my part, but they left me desiring for Henry and Dean to be together in the end.

Also:
What was he going to say when he returned to the store only to find Pike and Henry talking, and why was he so sad too? They weren't kissing or anything... When I see him crying in that scene I think to myself that he's definitely gay and in love with him. Do straight guys really fall in love with us? If so, I want to know...

I think the movie was beautiful but a bit "muddled" as another poster put it, and also a bit idealistic. Although it was refreshing for the film to show how normal it is to be gay, it was in Montana and I'm sure it is a struggle for gay men and women there. And although he ends up with Pike in the end, it also had the typical gay movie syndrome in which there is a failed love, leaving someone with a broken heart.

Frankly, it was a sad movie for me.


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While I did like the film, I have to agree. Though... I do think that Dean being completely straight makes perfect sense.

He clearly loves his best friend. But, he was born straight and can't change that - even though he clearly wants to. THAT's why he's so hurt by Henry's treatment - he's willing to do anything for Henry (several times even attempting a physical relationship). Yet, Henry wants a miracle and when he can't have it, he cuts himself off from the one true best friend he had. It's clearly a very complicated relationship, but I really don't think that Dean was gay or bisexual. If that had been the case, they would've ended up together a long time ago.

But, I do agree with the rest. I really think that they both settled. And that really bothered me, but only because, like you said, it wasn't really developed. I really disliked how they had that huge argument in the pantry, but then were cool with each other later on. I wish they had included whatever off-screen discussion they had, instead of focusing so much on Pike.

But, then, that would be a completely different film.

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Well therein lies the struggle. I think Dean wanted to love Henry. I think the reason he kissed Henry was in the hope that it would awaken something in him that would make that possible. It's almost as thought Dean was trying - even WANTING - to be gay, just so he could love his best friend as much as his best friend loved him.

The only reason I never rooted for Pike was only because he gave Henry no reason to fall for him in the first place. I don't think Pike had two lines in the film that were anything more than a short bashful response to a question. A handsome man can only coast on "bashful" for so long. Then it just gets annoying. At least Dean had some sort of passion. Even misinterpreted as it was. Henry had far more chemistry with Dean than he did with Pike. Pike was sweet and handsome, but it felt like Henry only settled for his second choice.

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I think Pike's character was grossly under developed; but I rooted for him. Pike had pined for Henry for the same 20 years Henry had pined for Dean. Pike had spent so much time hiding who he was, he even hid from the one he liked. And the irony is that everyone knew about the meals but Henry. He was so caught up in his fantasy of who he wanted Dean to be, he couldn't see it. And Pike knew the whole time Henry liked Dean and maybe felt he couldn't compete with that much history.

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I agree that Pike was underdeveloped. To just start cooking one day for Henry out of the blue because he liked him? I guess there needed to be more realization of Pike's thoughts early on. I did get the inference that Henry knew Pike was gay when they were in school but he was too hung up on Dean. Nevertheless, the overall theme is unrequited love

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I agree with you more than the other posters....

I think that Dean had an internal dilemma...

...but then maybe the writers were all over the place....The movie had loose ends!

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I don't think Dean was gay at all. His attraction towards Henry is purely brotherly. He says "you are my family". He only kissed him because he wanted to feel close to the brother and best friend he lost 20 years ago.

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haha one of my pet peeves in queer cinema is when the a guy chases after the ideal straight man and refuses to move on to other potentially great relationships. That might sound weird but I've seen a lot of short films that revolve around that and I am so done. After all, if Dean was Henry's first love, as you say Dean wouldn't have been 'the one' for him either.

It did seem a tad muddled, I would have liked to see the relationship between Pike and Henry a bit more, but I was really pleased when Henry sort of realized there was more to the world, and that someone else felt that way about him.

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Has everyone forgotten the lengthy and beautiful story Pike told Henry? I think that's when Henry started seeing something in Pike.

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I totally agree with you. I don't think Pike's character was underdeveloped, I believe Pike was written to be TERMINALLY SHY. But when he had something to say--the story--he said it and it was meaningful.

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I really liked reading the explanation some of you have for what Dean felt for Henry, and it kinda makes sense, really love as a brother and tries to love him more. But, if that's all he does, why would he be so utterly crushed and then burst into tears after seeing him "be close to Pyke" (when he brings him the painting)? Did he actually expect Henry to be satisfied by having a non-sexual/romantic relationship with him and remain single forever?
And also, there is no development of the romance between the mayor and Dean either.
The thing with Henry and Pyke never convinced me, and close to my tenth viewing of the movie, where I still pick new things up, leaves cold at the end scenes. Pyke and Henry kissing seems just unconvincing, forced, because there was never any hint of any affection from Henry's side.
There are still many unsolved mysteries in this movie for me, like who's the man who helps Sam with his rollchair in the beginning and seems to be Grace's date on several occasions? Never seen speaking yet he seems to be there quite a lot.

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Glad to have some new posts on this board!

I've watched this film several times and am always amazed at what is not actually said and what we viewers are not allowed to see develop. It's a deliberate tactic by the directors/producers/writers and, in my opinion, a brilliant one. There are definite signs that make sense of all the outcomes. Regarding Dean:

why would he be so utterly crushed and then burst into tears after seeing him "be close to Pyke" (when he brings him the painting)? Did he actually expect Henry to be satisfied by having a non-sexual/romantic relationship with him and remain single forever?


IMO, Dean is just as confused as Henry. Dean has been through a recent divorce and does not have a current love in his life. I do believe he loves Henry--with a love that runs deep--and, knowing that Henry loves him, Dean feels that, perhaps, Henry may be "the one." And if it weren't for one important little detail--Dean's not gay--then maybe a relationship with Henry may have worked out. (In fact, it's pretty much Henry's story as well (divorce notwithstanding), with an opposite sexual orientation.) When Dean sees that Henry and Pike are establishing a real bond--one with the potential to be a complete, romantic relationship--it's the end of Dean's fantasy and he mourns the loss of the dream.

there is no development of the romance between the mayor and Dean either.


No, we don't see this development. But we do see that when she is out with Henry and Dean, Dean grabs her hand and there's an awkward moment between Henry and the mayor, so she pulls her hand away. We also see Dean and the mayor exchanging flirty glances at the Thanksgiving table. When Dean breaks down after seeing Henry and Pike bonding, she is the one there to pick up the pieces.

Pyke and Henry kissing seems just unconvincing, forced, because there was never any hint of any affection from Henry's side.


I respectfully disagree with this one. Sure, much of the movie involves Henry's pining afer Dean, but deep down, Henry knows that fantasy isn't going to become a reality (he even admits to that in the "closet" scene with Dean). Quite early on in the movie, Henry finds Pike attractive (there's a quick little moment where Henry "checks out" Pike). Henry does want to, at least, get to know Pike better, which finally happens when they eat supper together. Henry is an artist and Pike not only appreciates Henry's art, he recognizes it for what it is (the Taurus constellation). When Pike adds his own version of the story it represents, Henry is fascinated. For me, this is the moment where Henry starts to feel a deep connection with Pike. Shortly after that, Henry is quick to invite Pike to Thanksgiving and, when he does so, Henry is as awkward as an adolescent around his first crush. After that, Henry actually gives his finished painting to Pike, which is a huge gesture (artists rarely give away their work, to anyone).

Of course, the end of the movie (before the kissing scene) shows Henry almost desperate to talk to Pike, who ignores him. I've always felt, at this point, that Henry was still deciding whether to go, or stay and pursue a relationship with Pike. And this is before Henry finds out the real truth about Pike doing all the cooking. Then there's scene at Pike's store, which happens at Christmas, looking like the start of a match made in heaven, with everyone supporting it.

Cut to the last scene. It's seven months later, the 4th of July celebration (assuming it's even the same year). In my opinion, the kiss was a must. We viewers have had to fill in so many details for ourselves, throughout the entire movie. The kiss shows us that--yes, indeed--Henry and Pike really were soulmates and lived happily ever after, in the fictitious world of Big Eden.

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Thanks for the detailed reply!

I actually did pick on the few hints between Dean and mayor but they were really just hints that it feels like something is missing. On this subject, two more questions I need to ask:
-if the mayor was there to pick up the pieces after Dean's breakdown (which is number two of my list of most touching moments in this movie, and I always find myself rewinding it a couple of times each time I watch the movie - great acting by both), then she surely must have been ok with knowing that a relationship with a possibly bisexual man has its risks? And she's a single mother...although you can still "Eden" this one out
-that night out at the pub/pool place, when Dean puts his hand over the mayor's, a guy quickly comes bi and it looks like he leans in to kiss her but he's made to change his mind. Who is he? Why did he change his mind, when he clearly went over there knowing and seeing she was there with Dean and Henry?

As for the chemistry between Pike and Henry, I really still not feel it. And given that the (let's call it) passion between Dean and Henry was so blatant (compared to Henry and Pike's), it does feel like there is none between Pike and Henry, even if you want to explain it by saying that they had a different connection, so the chemistry would be less physical than Dean and Henry's.

---POSSIBLE SPOLIER------ After having watched the deleted scenes, and finding out that Dean flat-out asked Henry about his love and reasons for leaving, it highlights once again more how there is so little shown between Henry and Pike. So much that after you explained it above, I feel that at the pace the movie was going with their thing, a simple loving glance while dancing in the moonlight might have been more appropriate. After all, it took them forever to even probably say to each other in words that they were attracted to each other. That's possibly why to me, the kiss looks forced.

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she surely must have been ok with knowing that a relationship with a possibly bisexual man has its risks?


Interesting question. The mayor, Anna, does pick up on the Henry-Pike chemistry at the Thanksgiving table, when all the glances are shown. In fact, that scene happens just after the Henry-Dean kissing scene where Dean "can't." Henry and Pike are exchanging almost flirty glances, when Dean picks up on that and looks unnerved by it (which leads to Dean following Henry into the closet saying he wants "to try again"). Nevertheless, Dean's own glances at the table shift to Anna quite quickly. Henry has already resigned himself to the fact that his fantasy with Dean is just a fantasy.

We don't know what happened between the time that Anna comforts Dean crying in the truck and what actually lead to the Anna-Dean relationship. Anna strikes me as a pretty smart cookie, so I doubt she would dive into a relationship wih Dean unless she was sure he was indeed straight. Also, Anna--along with the rest of the villagers--knows all about Pike's feelings for Henry. There's a quick little moment, when Henry is getting ready to leave town and dashes off to see Pike, where Anna is seen giving a knowing and approving glance. She's also the one who told Mary Margaret about "the Indian." (Mary Margaret to Henry: "I had to hear about the Indian from the mayor?")

when Dean puts his hand over the mayor's, a guy quickly comes bi and it looks like he leans in to kiss her but he's made to change his mind. Who is he? Why did he change his mind, when he clearly went over there knowing and seeing she was there with Dean and Henry?


From what I saw, the guy didn't change his mind. He walked over and went to kiss Anna, but she was the only who quickly pulled away.

As for the chemistry between Pike and Henry, I really still not feel it. And given that the (let's call it) passion between Dean and Henry was so blatant (compared to Henry and Pike's), it does feel like there is none between Pike and Henry, even if you want to explain it by saying that they had a different connection, so the chemistry would be less physical than Dean and Henry's.


Fair enough. I too would have liked to see at least one more scene between Henry and Pike that led up to their getting together.

The way I view the movie is this: I see Pike as the lead character, not Henry. (Yes, I know they are both "lead actors" and Henry does have a bit more screen time than Pike.) Sure, the movie is very much about Henry's "running away" from Big Eden and spending "years in therapy" to get over his crush on Dean.

But I get the feeling that, in the twenty years that Henry was in New York, it wasn't that Henry had no personal or sexual life. But the Dean crush was always there in the back of his mind and may have kept him from being open to forming "real" romantic relationships. In fact, Henry wasn't even expecting Dean to be in Big Eden when he returned to take care of Sampa. He hadn't even kept in touch with him enough to know that Dean had been married and had kids.

Back to Pike: he is pathologically shy (he avoids any kind of crowds and large gatherings, not even attending the big 4th of July gathering), but the townspeople clearly love the guy. Pike has never left Big Eden and, due to his extreme introvertedness, it's hard to imagine he's been in any kind of relationship. Heck, he might even be a virgin.

I'm not sure how many people would have known that Pike had a 20-year unrequited love for Henry, but Grace seemed to know that from the beginning. She was the one who made sure that Pike delivered the meals from the Widow Thayer. There was no real reason for Pike to do that, as Jim even said he could easily do the same. But Grace insisted that Pike do it personally. I've also noticed that Grace did not seem at all amused by the playful/sexual banter between Henry and Dean. I have no idea exactly how Grace knew that Pike loved Henry--I can't imagine Pike confiding that to her--but she must have picked up signals along the way.

Pike must have made little comments here and there over the years about Henry. Jim even says that Pike has talked about Henry's being an artist in New York. When Pike begins making the meals, it's quickly realized by everyone in town that he loves Henry. Even Sampa knows ("I'm sorry, son."). This, to me, is when the movie becomes more about Pike than Henry. Of course, everyone gets behind Pike and even assist him, while keeping his secret as long as they can hold out.

The kiss: I understand how it could seem forced, as there weren't any scenes of real sexual chemistry leading up to it. But, up until the point that Henry and Pike get together as a couple (just after Pike returns from the airport), Pike's love for Henry has been as unrequited as Henry's long-term love for Dean. For Pike, it has been even more unrequited, since he and Henry never had much of a relationship at all. Considering Pike's incredible shyness, it's hard to even imagine him getting to the point where he could have a physical relationship with anyone at all. But, at the end, there is Pike, finally at the 4th of July gathering he avoided his entire life. And, when the two of them are dancing, Pike is the one who stops dancing and kisses Henry, in clear view of everyone. For me, Pike is the one who undergoes the biggest personal transformation and is the real hero of the movie.

if the mayor was there to pick up the pieces after Dean's breakdown (which is number two of my list of most touching moments in this movie, and I always find myself rewinding it a couple of times each time I watch the movie - great acting by both)


Okay, I'll bite: which touching moment in the movie is your number one?

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Another wonderful reply, thanks!
You said one thing that changes things for me, which I had not realized and can explain the seemigly-forced Pike-Henry kiss: Pike might very well have had no relationships at all, gay or straight, maybe virgin, maybe not even kissed anyone.

I need to rewatch to see the mayor's glance of approval now :)

Anna is indeed a great character, I like Corinne Bohrer a lot!

My no.1 touching moment is what SamPa says to Henry on the couch, the whole "the whole town wants to shower you with love/did we teach you shame" and Henry breaking down in tears on his lap.
However I don't think I reacted so much to this scene before this last viewing, before then I was always thinking of Dean breaking down.
Of course when SamPa dies is very sad and makes me cry too, but the others are more touching.

I love the "Indian" line by MM about the mayor, but I guess I never thought about what she could have said to MM. I guess I brushed it off as "Pike cooks food for the two because the widow's cooking can kill anyone without a solid heart".

Unrelated note: did you notice there is a train passing by the school when Henry and Grace are taking down the desks after the summer? I found it weird because I don't think they show a train in the movie?
I definitely need to watch it once more :)
It's great that every time I watch it I hear or see new things, and thanks for the reading up here, it's going to be easier.

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I really like Corinne Bohrer, too. (Seems like she hasn't done all that much since Big Eden. Sigh.)

I sure would have liked to know what Anna (Corinne) said to Mary Margaret about Henry and Pike. I also would have loved to know what the Widow Thayer said to Henry about Pike doing the cooking; what Dean and Anna discussed before their becoming a couple; how Dean and Henry resolved their differences before the end of the movie; the Henry-Pike progression between the last two scenes of the movie; and so much more.

Train: near the beginning of the movie) after Henry first sees Sampa in the hospital), when Grace is driving Henry back home, you see them going over an overpass with a big train moving underneath. That's the only other time I see a train.

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Yep, I sure remember the underpass scene.
What I found weird about seeing a train passing so close to the school (or any school for that matter!) is that Big Eden seems like an isolated town on the lakeside where a train would have no way of passing and I wonder if it's a sort of goof, a train happened to pass by while they were shooting and they didn't think of it.

As you can see I'm ready to dissect every scene in this film! :)

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who's the man who helps Sam with his rollchair in the beginning and seems to be Grace's date on several occasions?


The character's name is John Cornwell, so it must be Grace's husband.

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I totally agree with Sebita...
I don't know if my mind blinded by the end that would Henry and Dean, I REALLY didn't see something had developed between Henry and Pike, romance I mean. Sometime I think that Pike was just Henry's escaped that his relationship with Dean going worst even he waited it for 20 years.
I don't get it. The ending REALLY sucks. I hope much more. Even if the end not happily ever after with Dean, I REALLY hope that this story focus on Henry and Dean. It'd much right.

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How can you not root for Pike? How?

The nice guy who wants things to be nice for the guy whom he loves. The nice guy who cooks meals for the one he loves and don't even want him to know. How??????

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Since Dean was pretty much straight, I can't see the point in rooting for Dean and not Pike.
I liked the character Pike.

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That's what your perception of the movie is, and your decision who to root for.

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I interpret the movie tells us 3 times that Dean is mostly straight. If I'm wrong, what are the clues he is gay or bi? I'd love to get other's take on this and then watch again.

Clearly these two were drawn to each other in their younger days. Henry never gave up hope for something more.

A lot of friends mess around when they are young but most of them move on after they have processed those kind of feelings.

My perception is that Henry is very dear to Dean, but not in all the physical ways that Henry wants. Dean can't seem to go there.

As for Pike, I think my favorite line in the whole move was
"we just want you to be happy too Pike" of something like that.



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I agree with you. Dean was straight, but loved Henry enough to give it a "try." I feel that both Dean and Henry knew it wasn't going to happen. Even Henry admits he knew that.

Pike is the hero of the movie, in my eyes.

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However, how many straight guys do you know who love another man, even as friend, who would want to try to try and be intimate just to be closer to them? That is why I don't like people saying "he was clearly straight".
Also watch the deleted scene in the tree house.

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Straight guys play around when they are young. It happens sometimes. Sexuality can be fluid.

Their big blow up at Thanksgiving dinner was Dean's anger and hurt about being cut out of Henry's life. Henry cut Dean off because their relationship was never going to be marriage-like. Dean could not live that way and Henry hurt too much to be around it. That's the best way I can describe it.

In another scene the movie shows that physical affection with Henry just doesn't work for Dean.

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Ok but to me that's still a bit more than the classic college experience.

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Straight guys play around when they are young. It happens sometimes. Sexuality can be fluid.


True dat. We don't really know if Dean and Henry "played around" when they were young. Of course, the beauty of this film is that we, as viewers, can imagine a lot of the unseen scenarios in whichever way we want.

I didn't get the feeling that Dean and Henry actually had a physical/sexual experience together when they were young, but I do think Henry had a mad crush on his best friend and was emotionally paralyzed by it.

As for Dean being straight or bi, that's a tough call. Another poster (perhaps in another thread here) pointed out that gay men sometimes go through an experimental period of dating women and even sleeping with them, as a way of figuring out their own sexuality. I went through this in high school. I was attracted to guys and had some gay sexual encounters. But I was the only boy in the family and felt pressure to get married, have kids and carry on the family name. So I tried. After a couple of tries with girls, I went through exactly the same thing as Dean ("I can't"), with reverse sexual orientation.

In order to make others happy, I wanted to be straight. But it was not to be and, thank goodness, I quickly accepted my true sexuality and got on with my life.

Dean is coming off of a divorce. His ex-wife must have had major issues, since Dean has custody of the kids (husbands rarely get custody). So the marriage, more than likely, was a very unhappy one. After the "breakup" with Henry, it didn't take Dean long at all to begin a relationship with the mayor.

In the pantry-closet scene, Dean says to Henry, "you may be in love but it's not with me." I think it's pretty obvious Dean is referring to Pike. Two scenes lead up to this: when Henry asks Pike to Thanksgiving dinner, Dean is already sizing up the chemistry between Henry and Pike, to the point where Henry says to Dean "what's wrong with you?" Then, at the dinner, Dean notices the glances between Henry and Pike and is unnerved by it.

(One more thing, just my opinion: I think Henry is a lousy kisser! In the kiss with Dean, Dean is the one who passionately plants one on Henry. For me, that kiss seems particularly forced, because Henry is so passive. Plus, it never goes beyond the closed-mouth stage. In the kiss between Henry and Pike, it's much longer and romantic but, even then, it looks like Pike is really into it and Henry's just kind of a limp dishrag. Maybe Dean and Pike should have been a couple! Lol!)

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I always thought of Dean's line "you might be in love but it sure as hell isn't with me" as the classic "you're not in love with me even though you say so" etc.

Yes Henry IS a lousy kisser for sure.

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Good interpretation (I've been there on that one!).

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While I don't think that Henry and Dean should have gotten together, for all the reasons other people have pointed out, I also don't see a happy ending for Henry and Pike either. Considering just how skittish Pike is about everything, I just don't think it's realistic to believe their relationship lasted more than a couple of months after the movie ends.

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When Pike and Henry finally do get together (Pike running to the airport, then coming back to his store to find Henry there), it is just before Christmas (all the Christmas lights and decorations at the airport show this). At the last scene (with the long kiss), they are at the 4th of July dance. So, seven months later, they are together and still hot for one another.

(Plus, I always assumed Pike was a virgin before getting together with Henry, but he ain't one anymore... that in itself can bring a suppressed gay man right out his shell lol!)

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