"Argentina"


In this film, as well as in Belle Epoque, the some of the characters, while clearly still in Spain, talk about "Argentina" as if it were just a short drive or jounrney away. I could find no city, region, or province within Spain in any atlas, either current or as much as 60 years old. The only "Argentina" is the one in South America, many thousands of miles away. Does anyone know what the characters are referring to - is there, in Spain, a theater, playhouse or landmark known to the citizenry as "Argentina?"

reply

Belle Epoque was about the Civil War in Spain and many of the Republicans fled to Argentina after Franco took over, but other than that I don't know why they mention Argentina so much in Spanish movies.

"When I die you can eat my brain, it will give you power". -Duke Phillips, "The Critic"

reply

They refer a lot to Argentina and Mexico in spanish movies because they are the biggest and most populated spanish-talking countries in south america as well as an usual destiniy for migrator during the 19th and 20th centuries, especially during the Franco dictatorial repression.

In All About My Mother, it is referred a lot because the main caracter played by Cecilia Roth is from Argentina, as noted by her argentinian accent, but I assume that hasn't been kept in the english translation.

reply

Argentina and its culture and people have always been very closed to Spain. A lot of people immigrated to Argentina during the Spanish War and Franco's dictatorship, and there's a kind of union between Spanish and Argentinean people (Mexico too). And though I haven't been to Argentina to know how it is there, in Spain it is common to find Argentinean people, that just like we did in hard times now immigrate to Spain to find out their roots and try to have a better life. And I suppose that's the case of the main character of the movie played by Cecilia Roth: a recent Argentinean immigrant in Spain.
I supposed that as they didn't keep the Argentinean accent in the translation it was difficult to guess that what she referred was her country.

reply

They referred to Argentina as where she and Lola (formerly Esteban) were originally from; when she talked about having played Stella in an amateur theatre group, it was in her "pueblo" back in Argentina. She says that that's where she and Esteban met and married; he then took a trip to France, sent for her, she found out he'd become a transvestite, and they moved to Barcelona. I think symbolically it shows how different Manuela's life turned out from what she probably once expected, and it ties her to Stella and Blanche in Streetcar - they end up far away from the plantation where they started out, geographically and metaphorically.

reply

So is the main character Argetinian because Cecilia Roth is, or was Cecilia Roth cast in the role because they wanted an Argentinian.

Does Lola speak with an Argentinian accent ?

reply

I think the main character was created for Cecilia Roth 'cause she is a personal friend of the director.
Anyway, she plays at the movie as an Argentinean who has been in Spain for years. Because of that, she has some accent but fakes sometimes some Spanish accent talking with the tongue in the roof of the mouth. When she pronounce some s or c like when she say "Tienesh que sher fuerte Lola" (You have to be strong Lola) but in Argentinean she should say "Tienes que ser fuerte Lola" with no sh.

The other question due to Lola's accent. Well, no. Cecilia Roth is the only Argentinean on the entire cast but in the theater scene, for 2 seconds at first seats, there's an slim guy with curl hair and lens. He's Fito Paez, Argentinean musician and husband at that time of Cecilia Roth. Right now they are divorced.

Bye! 007

reply

"Because of that, she has some accent but fakes sometimes some Spanish accent talking with the tongue in the roof of the mouth. When she pronounce some s or c like when she say "Tienesh que sher fuerte Lola" (You have to be strong Lola) but in Argentinean she should say "Tienes que ser fuerte Lola" with no sh. "

First of all, Spaniards (not all) do the "tongue in the roof of the mouth," thing, as you call it, for the letters C,Z followed by an I or an E. The S is for all intents and purposes the same everywhere that Spanish is spoken. Although, in lots of places in the world where Spanish is spoken the letter S is often silent or aspirated. But when it is spoken, the S is the same everywhere. It's only for C/Z that most spaniards have the "th" sound. (not "sh")

In any case, in Argentinean she would say "Tenés que ser fuerte Lola" not "Tienes que ser fuerte Lola"

And I don't know anyone in Spain who says "tienesh que sher fuerte" Maybe some S's sound like that to you, but it's mainly because lots of spanish people talk very closed, but it has nothing to do with the "tongue in the roof of the mouth thing" Totally different things.

I'm not even Spanish, but people have some weird stereotypes about how Spanish people speak.

reply

mmin, different regions speak very differently so maybe whoever said what you were referring to was talking about a particular region that they knew. Just a thought...you kind of jumped down their throat...

reply

Lola is played by catalan actor Toni Canto, who puts on an Argentinian accent in the movie. Cecilia Roth is the only Argentinian on the entire cast. In the movie, however, her Argentinean accent does not really come out very noticably.

reply

I'm from argentina and I can tell that he doesn't have an argentinean accent at all. Roth does have an argentinean accent. She may speak with TU, but her accent is clearly "porteño"

reply

[deleted]

"rgentina and Mexico in spanish movies because they are the biggest and most populated spanish-talking countries in south america"

Flamming, Mexico is in North America!!!!....have you ever seen a map?

reply

The Spanish talk about Argentina so much because many of them moved there either temporarily or permanently to escape the problems caused by the civil war in Spain.My mother is Spanish (from a tiny village called Arcos near Pontevedra,Galicia) and most of my grandfathers family moved there and stayed there.After the war ended my grandfather had no money to live on so he went to work with his family in Argentina and sent his wages home to my grandmother and my mum, so you see a lot of Spaniards will have friends and family there.

-----------------------------------
'We're not sheep'-Edward Scissorhands

reply

Hey, I'm from "Argentina" and it denotes some ignorance the fact that you had to search to find that "Argentina" is a country.
But, sticking to the point, in spanish, mexican and argentine movies, those countries are often mentioned because there is a sort of bond between them, culturally.
Like US and Canada....they are so related...

reply

[deleted]

[deleted]

Before you call OTHERS ignorant, read the original once again and you'll see that the guy knew Argentina is a country, but he thought there might ALSO be a city in Spain with the same name, dildo.

reply

[deleted]

It is a common belief that everybody that comes from Spain has a gallego accent. Galicia is a region in northwestern Spain (near north of Portugal). Because gallegos make up most of the Spaniard population in the American continent, it is assumed by many Latin Americans that everybody from Spain is gallego. In this particular case, now that you mention it, neither David Bisbal nor Alejandro Sanz are from Galicia. Off the top of my head I don't remember where exactly Bisbal is from (I know he is from somewhere in the south), and Alejandro Sanz is from Madrid.

reply

You didn't see the links between Mexico and Spain??

Well, for some reason Mexico was called the New S-P-A-I-N in colonial times...

And most cities are named after spanish cities, and the people have spanish names,
plus Mexico has its own culture, but certainly nowadays Mexico has a lot in common with Spain.

reply

There's definately a clear connection between the cultures of Spain and Mexico, as the influence of the spanish conquistadores who came to Mexico is deeply imbedded in their history and culture. Mexico will always have a close connection with Spain because of the profound impact that Spain had on Mexico developing into what it is today.

reply

[deleted]

I can't see where your explanation conflicts with what the others said.

reply

Joder, que ignorante debo ser yo. Que ni sabia que tengo accento muy parecido al accento argentino, por que sho me shamo Che.

That was me being ironic, you are incorrect Argentine accent is very different from Spanish accent. We have what you call a lisp and Argentines make the shhh sound in pronouncing the double L.

reply

[deleted]

No it is completely unique. I do not know accent from Chile but when I lived in Spain I had an Argentine teacher and she has a very different accent. Galicia has its own dialect and its own language. And the only place that has an accent similar to Cuban is in La Islas Canarias. This where Antonia San Juan is from, the actress who plays Agrado.

reply

[deleted]

Don Francisco? LOL!!!

Well i really don't think that any accents in South American resembles to Spanish accent, we don't use the Z or C, you know how they pronounce it, we don't.. we have some resemblances among latin american countries, like our accent (Ecuador) is a bit similar to mexican accent..

Bitch.. you don't have a future.. ~ The Bride ~

reply

[deleted]

Andre:
I love Argentina. Love your food and the way you talk (jaja). But, please take some time to look at world populations. Mexico is over 100,000,000 these days. Argentina (last I checked) has maybe 40 millions.

reply

Hm...How can you say that Javier Camara and Javier Bardem sound like Cubans????

reply

As someone mentioned before most of the people who lived in the exile during Franco's rule went to Mexico or Argentina. Probably that's why they are mentioned more than the rest of Latin American Spanish-speaking countries who also had long periods of Spanish colonization. Trying to debate which country has stronger ties or closer bonds to Spain is therefore a futile excercise, mainly when it comes to overall culture and religion. It's like trying to debate which nation has got stronger ties to the UK: the US, Australia, Canada or South Africa. They are as close or as different as one wants to see them. In Latin America, racially-speaking the degrees of mestizaje vary depending on the inhabitants of the land prior to the arrival of the Spanish and the subsequent incorporation of African slaves.

reply

Marco in " Talk To Her" was also an Argentinian.

Last seen film:
The French Connection (1971) by William Friedkin 9/10

reply

I really believe that México and Spain have some many things in common in people and culture. I see the connection between the two countries. Most of Mexico is made up by indigenous people but there are some parts of Mexico where people are so white as white as peoplei n spain. 10% of Mexico's population is white. Im from Costa Rica and i have to say that i see the resemblance in the accents among latin americans countries. For example, Argentinians and uruguayans sound a bit similar. Puerto ricans and Venezuelans sound a bit similar. Peruans and ecuadorians speak kinda similar. Panama and cuba have kinda the same accent. Costa Ricans and colombians sound a bit similar and so on.

Spain have many dialects but none of em' are similar to latin americans accents. There is only one city in Colombia whose accent resembles spanish accent.

ivan

reply