MovieChat Forums > Rules of Engagement (2000) Discussion > there are no legal reasons for Childers ...

there are no legal reasons for Childers acquittance


the juri should find him guilty.
only from the evidences, and not considering the actual facts:
all eye whitness said it was a peaceful mob, praying, throwing flowers and protesting;
the tape is gone and the only soldier who suppose to saw the weapons is dead, so there is no proof of the weapons existence;
the yemen officials officially stated there werent no weapons;
even his soldier said in testimony that only the snipers were a hazard;

so we have all whitness and documents saying there was a massacre against a peacefull crowd and only the defendent denying.

the jury decided against the evidences present in the due process of law.

if only we have a twist, with a new tape and a new last minute testimony, we have a good film. the end only shows the juri rotten corporativism.

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"all eye whitness said it was a peaceful mob, praying, throwing flowers and protesting;"

Eye witness testamony is NOT evidence, just because someone claims they didn't see something is not proof that it didn't happen.

"the tape is gone and the only soldier who suppose to saw the weapons is dead, so there is no proof of the weapons existence;"

300 hundred bullet holes in the embassy building is proof weapons existed, the onus was on the prosecution to proove from where the shots came, they couldn't.

"the yemen officials officially stated there werent no weapons;"

The Senator destroyed a tape exhonorating Childers for the sake of good relations, what do you think the Yemenese government would do?

"even his soldier said in testimony that only the snipers were a hazard;"

Again what one individual thinks he did or did not see is not evidence, his word in a court of law would be no more important than Childers.

"so we have all whitness and documents saying there was a massacre against a peacefull crowd and only the defendent denying."

We do not! That's what you don't get, the official military report would declare Childers side of it, he was court marshalled under suspicion that his report was wrong and it was up to the prosecution to proove this which they couldn't, the only people claiming a masacre were the media!

"the jury decided against the evidences present in the due process of law. "

No Childers was innocent until proven guilty, the prosecution were required to proove Childers report was incorrect and that he ordered the slaughter of unarmed civilians, they couldn't, the remaining evidence eg the bullets in the building and the missing tape was resonable doubt.



I started out with nothing and I still have most of it left!

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You might want to educate yourself on the American legal system before you post. A person must be found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. The existence of a tape at one time and the number of bullet holes were enough to cast reasonable doubt, therefore he could not be found guilty.

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you might want to educate yourself on political pressure and the class system. people are often found guilty on flimsy evidence or get away with murder (hello OJ) based on who they are. with all of the witnesses against him and the heavy political pressure to convict, it's likely he would be.

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What?

If I could, I would excuse you (and your offspring if you have any) from ever serving on a jury.

The jury shouldn't consider actual facts? Are you insane?

Have you ever heard the words "reasonable doubt"?

Let me tell you about a jury I served on. The defendant was accused of auto theft. It was made clear to us that to be found guilty, the prosecution had to prove that he intentionally deprived the victim of her property.

We went through 2 days of testimony and while there was absolutely no doubt that the defendant was driving a stolen car (and little doubt that he was wasted - but DUI was not the case before us, so we only heard that he was found passed out crashed into a cul-de-sac with the motor still running), the prosecution had not offered any evidence that he even knew the car was stolen.

His story was that he borrowed it from a friend and no evidence or testimony was entered into the record to suggest otherwise.

On the 3rd day, the judge was forced to declare a mistrial right before closing arguments because of comments made outside the courtroom by a couple of my fellow jurors. After the mistrial was declared, I learned that most of us were leaning towards acquittal because the prosecution had not proven their case. Oh, we were all convinced he wasn't completely innocent, but they hadn't proven him guilty of the charges that were brought.

It's as if the prosecutor expected us to jump to the conclusion that "oh, he had to know that car was stolen and he probably had something to do with it too despite the fact that we didn't present one shred of evidence that he did" and that we would completely ignore the whole part about "reasonable doubt".

I wish I could have seen it play out - were they going to ask us for a lesser charge (like receipt of stolen property) if we couldn't find him guilty of auto theft? I don't know and I still wonder about that to this day.

I suspect this was a case of police and prosecutors telling him to plead guilty rather than going to trial and when he refused to play ball, they incarcerated him until his case worked its way through the court system. (I don't know for sure that he was locked up while awaiting trial, but I'd be willing to bet money that he was).

The 2 comments that led to the mistrial?

"I bet he understands English just fine when he wants to" and "It sounds like the car [NOT the defendant, but the car] had been in a 2-week joyride".

Those comments may sound prejudiced against the defendant, but they were made by fellow jurors who were leaning towards acquittal.

The prosecution MUST prove a defendant's guilt and the obvious withholding of potentially exonerating evidence would be enough for me to vote 'not guilty' in any jury I may ever serve on.

What happened to that video tape? Was it a mere mistake that it was on a manifest of items recovered from the embassy? Was it simply a bad copy with no discernible video on it? If the prosecution wants to claim the former, they better have a reasonable explanation to remove my reasonable doubt. If it was the latter, show me the tape that didn't have any evidence at all on it. (And since the camera was still intact, Hodges could have gone a bit further in showing that the camera was still capable of taking surveillance footage since it probably was given that the camera had not been shot and that they were able to recover the videotape.)

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[deleted]

Someone get me a translation dictionary and interpret this post before someone can intelligently try to respond...




HEY DUDE FROM BRASILLIA --- ITS A FREAKING MOVIE NOT REAL LIFE.
THe Director can have it end however he wants

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The fact that the tape is missing is actually a pretty big bit of evidence that could help Childers. Chain of custody is a very big deal regarding evidence for the prosecution; basically because the prosecutors work for the very government authorities who collects such evidence.

In this case the US Government has a chain of custody of a tape that he says will prove his claims. Once it got to the state department (the very people who are trying to prosecute him) it vanishes. That's circumstantial but it does make it look like they deliberately lost the tape because of what it shows. Given that the burden or proof is on the prosecution mysteriously vanishing evidence doesn't bode well for them. Heck in the case of OJ Simpson a slight discrepancy regarding the amount of blood in the sample that they used for DNA testing was used to convince jury members that his blood must have been planted at the scene after the fact by the LAPD.

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So Ironically it was destroying the tape that found him not guilty.

You want to play the game, you'd better know the rules, love.
-Harry Callahan

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[deleted]

The fact that the tape is missing is actually a pretty big bit of evidence that could help Childers. Chain of custody is a very big deal regarding evidence for the prosecution; basically because the prosecutors work for the very government authorities who collects such evidence.


Exactly. The prosecution's excuse was that the building was looted and the tape must've been taken then. But their own record of the items removed from the building included a security tape. This record took place before the National Security Advisor got a hold of it and saw that it proved Childers' story, so they weren't able to go back and change that record.

If there's evidence that could definitively prove or disprove what he's saying, "we lost it" is not an acceptable answer. It's the prosecution's job to prove the charges, and if a vital piece of video evidence goes missing on their watch, that either means they're intentionally withholding evidence because it doesn't support their case or they've conducted an incompetent investigation and their evidence can't be trusted.

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[deleted]

youre unfamiliar with "reasonable doubt"?

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