MovieChat Forums > Pi (1998) Discussion > Pi is a mistake

Pi is a mistake

posted 10 years ago by Bob_Brooker
13 replies | jump to latest

A little sidetracking here but I thought this notion is worth sharing.
From http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0118884/board/nest/220255296:

The only reason we use Pi = 3.1415926 is because the first person to calculate it did so using the diameter of the circle. It's defined as Circumference/diameter. In other words, it's how many times the diameter of the circle fits into the circumference of the circle. But the earlier humans who discovered this didn't realize that the diameter is not the fundamental measurement of the circle. It's just easier to measure...hence we get stuck with a convention of Pi = 3.14. And since we do all our math with the radius (the truly fundamental measurement of a circle), Pi only represents half the circle in radians. If we used a unit of diametans, then Pi would actually make some sense.

Surely an advanced, intelligent race of aliens would have defined Pi (or "blork" as they would surely call it) as 6.2831...

Ever notice how 2*Pi shows up in all the math equations? Because you have to have 2 of them to get all the way around the circle. Ever notice how 1/4 of the circle is 1/2 Pi? However, if Pi had been defined as 6.2831 (as Euler occasionally used), 1/4 of the circle would be 1/4 Pi. It's a better convention. History is full of these kinds of "mistakes". We just recognize them, and move on.

I find it hard to believe aliens would be using Pi, unless they were intentionally telling us something about half a circle, instead of a full circle.

A lot of people are recognizing the problem now, but there seems to be too much cultural momentum to fix it.

If this topic interests you, please read these articles.

"Pi is Wrong!" - Bob Palais
http://www.math.utah.edu/~palais/pi.pdf
"What really worries me is that the first thing we broadcast to the cosmos to demonstrate our 'intelligence' is 3.14. I am a bit concerned about what the lifeforms who receive it will do after they stop laughing at the creatures who must rarely question orthodoxy."

http://www.tauday.com
Lots of proofs why Pi is not the right circle constant.

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Last movie watched: Galaxy Quest (10/10)

[–] lkillen 10 years ago

Put down the crack pipe. Push yourself back from the table.

[–] abnormallynormal001 10 years ago

I agree. But so is base ten and other things.

[–] thulk01 7 years ago

What do you mean

[–] KingCobra686 9 years ago

I dont think its a mistake. Like you said, diameter is easier to measure and thats why its defined based on that. It would have been illogical for earlier humans to base it off of radius when diameter was the more practical measurement for them.

[–] Bob_Brooker 9 years ago

That's well acknowledged. The question is if the limitations of earlier humans should continue to define the way we do math. Mathematics should be as elegant and beautiful as possible. Working with a constant that you need to multiply or divide by two all the time to get real results, it backwards.

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Last movie watched: The Rules of the Game (6/10)

[–] KingCobra686 9 years ago

I agree, but unfortunately there is no way that the Pi symbol will ever be reassigned a different value.

A lot of people are recognizing the problem now, but there seems to be too much cultural momentum to fix it.

This is a severe understatement. The amount of money that it would take to change every instance of Pi in the industrial world would be ridiculous. Its pretty much an all or nothing effort, otherwise you will just cause chaos when its no longer clear what the value of that symbol means. Spending money on something like that would suck up a ton of money for no benefit and would directly lead to things layoffs at companys that are forced to waste money on this.

It might be possible to introduce a new symbol to represent 2*Pi and substitute that into formulas, but there's no way that you'll ever change the current Pi symbols value.

[–] Bob_Brooker 9 years ago

Pi can stay as it, they need to introduce Tau. Still a huge task.

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Last movie watched: The Banishment (8/10)

[–] pfr_77 9 years ago

tag

[–] x-e-n 9 years ago

You state that the true number should be 2*pi? 2 is just a constant that can be factored out. Maybe you should take math classes before writing these posts.

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