MovieChat Forums > Planet of the Apes (2001) Discussion > Thade, Lincoln, and the ending (spoiler ...

Thade, Lincoln, and the ending (spoiler alert)

posted 10 years ago by JebbyDiah
10 replies | jump to latest

I think people are taking the ending too 'seriously.' I think Burton, for some reason, for the ending wanted to go a little abstract and give us concepts instead of a usual ending. Which is kinda lame but, for what it's worth I think the ending was supposed to say the following

1. Mankind is doomed. Our hero saw it on the distant planet as a little microcosm teaser and when he went back to earth, saw it 'for real.' Mankind was doomed to be overthrown due to its nature. It tampers and it oppresses.

2. Humans back on earth slave lords (first over blacks and the later I guess over apes) and Thade was able to free (ape) slaves, aka help apes become dominant over their human masters and thus he was the new Lincoln of earth

3. You cant go home again. Our hero should have never gone back to earth

4. Burton is a fan of the Twilight Zone movies, or else his screenwriter was.

[–] savagebiscuits 10 years ago

You make some good points. In some ways, the ending is sort of like the novel (loosely, might I add, before I'm jumped on), in that when the protagonist gets back to Earth, apes have inevitably taken control of his home planet. It's the inevitability of man's downfall that's the issue, and the protagonists in novel and film are both lost, much like humanity.

The thing is, though, that the way it's done in the novel is logical, while in this film we have backwards time travel and the problems of Thade getting back to Earth, etc. I know you mean that Thade wasn't meant literally (or I think you meant that), but it comes off that way. Why not use a statue of a Chimpanzee "Lincoln" without the name "Thade"? The same thing would have been conveyed without the complications.

But, yeah, your points are well made. Pity this film couldn't express itself as well. ;)

[–] JebbyDiah 10 years ago

I agree that its heavy handed and poorly executed. But! Um, actually, no buts about it. I was just explaining my take, people don't seem to understand it. I say, feel free to call it out for being badly BADLY done but, I am just trying to explain the thought behind it..or attempted thought. I agree that making Thade the name for Lincoln was beyond silly. But at least they didnt have glowing ape heads on the tops of cop cars for the lights? :)

[–] savagebiscuits 10 years ago

But at least they didnt have glowing ape heads on the tops of cop cars for the lights? :)

LOL! I did actually laugh at that line. :D

I don't hate this film and just take it as popcorn fare with only an occasional point to make. However, many original PotA fans will say that PotA deserved a more serious take on the theme, which this film failed to do. I can't disagree with them, but I still consider this a sort of guilty pleasure. I'd be even more guilty if the cops had ape-shaped lights.

[–] JebbyDiah 10 years ago

I still remember watching .. which was the one where they looped the monkey saying "da da.. da da.. da da"? .. with friends, and the anger from people over how corny that was still exceeded all the anger I saw from this one.

Lots of guilty pleasures for all the movies except the first one.. I love em all. The new ones are actually as competent as the first one.

-Spoiler!

I remember for "Beneath" how pleased my buddy was.. he was saying ' YEA! you make Heston mad.. he nukes the effin planet!" Don't mess with Heston.

-Spoiler!

My favorite moments were in Battle For when you could see how utterly low budget the fights were. Out of the whole planet they had like what.. 13 people fighting?

Better push that camera in TIGHT.. we literally have more people running craft services right now than the entire human and ape armies! Our bad for agreeing to shoot the whole movie for under 20 bucks!

I do love Burton's version for some of the weirdness and ambiance and plot points. The crashed space ship was genius. The re-appearance of the monkey as a Christ savior figure.. genius. Mark Walburg's uncanny ability to show no emotions for the entire movie as if he couldn't act all at all... GENIUS!

[–] savagebiscuits 10 years ago

I still remember watching .. which was the one where they looped the monkey saying "da da.. da da.. da da"? .. with friends, and the anger from people over how corny that was still exceeded all the anger I saw from this one.

That was in Escape from the Planet of the Apes. The baby ape was saying, "Mama" looped. Yeah, it was pretty badly done, along with the gorilla in a suit in that zoo that kills Milo, but I still consider Escape, warts and all, the second best of the films (starts off humorous, but ends up very dark).

My favorite moments were in Battle For when you could see how utterly low budget the fights were. Out of the whole planet they had like what.. 13 people fighting?

Don't forget the terrifying school bus of war.

Mark Walburg's uncanny ability to show no emotions for the entire movie as if he couldn't act all at all... GENIUS!

I thought he took lessons from that exploding tree in Battle, but without the exploding. You know, the one that keeps coming back to life, then getting blown up again and again. Poor tree. Poor Mark Wahlberg.

[–] JoeKarlosi 10 years ago

Don't forget the terrifying school bus of war.

Made sense. The mutants army was relying on whatever they had left. True, it looked rather weak in execution - but it made sense.

[–] savagebiscuits 10 years ago

Made sense. The mutants army was relying on whatever they had left. True, it looked rather weak in execution - but it made sense.

Sure, I understand. I still think it's funny, though. :D

[–] 10 years ago

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[–] JoeKarlosi 10 years ago

I still remember watching .. which was the one where they looped the monkey saying "da da.. da da.. da da"? .. with friends, and the anger from people over how corny that was still exceeded all the anger I saw from this one.

And yet ESCAPE is a far better movie, and with more heart and feeling, than Burton's misfire.

My favorite moments were in Battle For when you could see how utterly low budget the fights were. Out of the whole planet they had like what.. 13 people fighting?

In BATTLE, it was a struggle for survival with what remained in one little Ape Community. This wasn't supposed to be War World III On The Planet Of The Apes.

Better push that camera in TIGHT.. we literally have more people running craft services right now than the entire human and ape armies! Our bad for agreeing to shoot the whole movie for under 20 bucks!

And yet BATTLE (like the other earlier Apes movies) remain full of introspection and heart, and a message .... with quite the reviewability factor.

I do love Burton's version for some of the weirdness and ambiance and plot points. The crashed space ship was genius. The re-appearance of the monkey as a Christ savior figure.. genius. Mark Walburg's uncanny ability to show no emotions for the entire movie as if he couldn't act all at all... GENIUS!

Can't tell if you're serious, half-serious, or totally kidding. But Burton's PLANET was an abomination, IMO.

[–] JebbyDiah 10 years ago

OK I do like Burton's misfire, I stand behind that. It's a huge mess but I like some of the different ideas in it. But the original series is faaaar superior no question about it. I will watch those again on occasion while I really don't have a desire to see Burton's again. And let's not forget the TV series (live action)) and the TV series (cartoon). I like them both better than the Burton misfire.

The original series is to be admired in particular for the fact that each movie got less money and had to make do.. by the final one, I am only half kidding about the craft services comment hell maybe they got some of the craft services people to throw on ape heads! The final movie in the series has a lot of heart and had it the budget of say Beneath or Escape .. it would have really benefited from it. For example the School Bus of war could have been the Greyhound Rock Band Tour Bus of war!

OK I am just goofin, I really like the final movie, it wrapped things up nicely. I loved how it showed the progress of mankind and their mindset. And I still don't know which way to go on the "did the ending say there was hope or was it saying it was all for naught and the world will be destroyed anyways?" topic.