MovieChat Forums > Hornblower: The Even Chance (1999) Discussion > How could Simpson get away with his abus...

How could Simpson get away with his abuse for so long?

posted 15 years ago by mcsmarties
14 replies | jump to latest

I need to say up front that I am just discovering the HH series.
I have only watched The Duel and I have never read the books either.
However, I am a huge fan of Patrick O'Brian's Aubreyad and read all his books.

So with that out of the way here's my question - how could an oldster, a simple midshipman, like Simpson get away with his bullying ways for so long?

This is puzzling me to no end. His abuse - at least in the TV episode - goes far beyond just "hazing" the new kid and is actively hurting the ship's capacity to fight (for example, waking HH every half an hour must have hurt his ability to stand a watch!). How come the officers - at least the lieutenants, if not the captain himself - never became aware of his capers?

Yes the Justinian is an old ship under a "dying" captain, yes she's moored - but still, the discipline goes completely by the board!

In fact, these midshipmen are given far more freedom than I would have expected from my limited understanding of the RN (again based on the POB canon)

Is this plot in the books, or was that just added for the TV series?

[–] Gwasgray 15 years ago

I think perhaps (as was hinted in one scene), it was because the other Midshipmen were too afraid of him to tell any of the senior officers. It was the 18th century and my guess is people got away with a lot of things back then. The Captains and Lieutenants themselves handed out some pretty harsh punishments like flogging, gaunlets, clamping in irons and even hangings for severe offences, so Simpson having Hornblower woken every half hour would have seemed mild in comparison.

[–] CryptMistress 15 years ago

Gwasgray is right. The midshipmen were petrified of Simpson. While I don't know exactly what Simpson had done to Hether or Cleaveland, it is pretty obvious that Clayton and Kennedy had suffered from the abuse. A rumor says that Kennedy may've been SEXUALLY abuse by Simpson. Then again, that's just a rumor. All in all, I think they were afraid.

God help us all-Edward Blake

[–] Conspirator_Slash 15 years ago

Just a rumor?

"You don't know half of what he's capable of." Clayton

"Hello, Archie. Jack's missed you, boy." Simpson

It's pretty obvious. Knowing what Churchill said about the Navy...

Starry Vere, God bless you!

[–] Ezekiel_Stone 15 years ago

I think Simpson was the most senior of all of the other midshipmen and he knew how to kiss an officers ass so he was in pretty good stead with them. Even if you did speak with the lieutenant or the captain they would think that your making trouble and would side with Simpson. For such things to happen on board a ship without the officers knowing it reflects poorly on them and the last thing they want is some big enquirey into the goings on aboard their ship. Also without any concrete proof or testimony from others whom simpson "bullied" you were pretty much left to fend for yourself.

[–] c-huddleston 13 years ago

Military ships were subject to military law: a senior officer could do pretty much what he liked to those junior to him, and seniority of rank was carried further by seniority of service in that rank. So of two midshipmen (equal rank), the senior and therefore ranking officer would be the one who had served longest in that rank. Which left Simpson in control among the Midshipmen - failure to carry out one of his orders, unless countermanded by a more senior officer, carried only one sentence. Death.

That being said, the regulations of 1808 (a little after the time of this story but little will have changed in that one regard) made it clear that only the Captain could order punishments. Whether being on constant duty in full uniform would have been seen as a punishment is another question.

[–] sarahb2 11 years ago

**Which left Simpson in control among the Midshipmen - failure to carry out one of his orders, unless countermanded by a more senior officer, carried only one sentence. Death. **

Not exactly. Failure to carry out a senior officer's order could result in a court-martial, but in the 1800s British Navy only three crimes were punishable by death: treason, murder, and sodomy.

About that last one: I was around when HH first aired, and there was a LOT of discussion of whether Simpson ever raped Archie. There are several clues that point to this - the aforementioned dialogue, plus the dramatic changes in Archie's personality when Simpson is around and the fact that he only seems to have fits when Simpson is either in the vicinity, or the possibility of being around him rises (i.e., in the third episode when Hornblower discovers Archie in a Spanish prison and Archie 'knows' that returning to the Indy means being around Simpson again. Apparently Horatio forgot to tell him Simpson was dead!).

So let's assume the worst, and say that Simpson WAS buggering Archie, clearly against his will. Why didn't Archie report him? The answer is simple: The punishment for sodomy in the British Navy was death by hanging - for BOTH parties. By reporting Simpson, Archie would be signing his own death warrant. Simpson was well aware of this, I'm sure, and knew that he could do what he wanted and nobody would ever rat him out.

Stinks, doesn't it? No wonder Archie had fits!

[–] emp1966 11 years ago

(SPOILER ALERT!) In the book, Horatio fights his duel with Simpson before he goes on the Indy and it is Keene rather than Pellew who advises him to never fight another. Simpson does not die but is in disgrace. Be advised, that all of the first 4 films are based on individual chapters of only 1 book: "Mr. Midshipman Hornblower".

[–] claudecat 10 years ago

Thanks--I just watched the first film, and was wondering if Simpson's storyline was really quite so over-the-top in the book.

[–] jbaddock 10 years ago

In the book, much is made of Simpson's tyranny, which to Hornblower seems to be like the almost whimsical behaviour of Roman emperors like Nero or Caligula - forcing one of the midshipmen to shave off his moustache, for example. The point is made that the Justinian is at anchor in Spithead under an ailing captain and ineffective First Lieutenant, neither of whom seem particularly inclined to do anything about Simpson. It is as a result of constant bullying that Hornblower challenges Simpson to a duel - and it is only his subsequent transfer to the Indefatigable that saves him from any further mistreatment by Simpson, who remains aboard the Justinian (and does not appear again in the book, so we never find out what happened to him in the end).

[–] Bernnard_Black 10 years ago

I've read a good bit of history about this period, and it wasn't at all uncommon for a senior midshipman or masters mate to terrorize the younger ones; the navy was not for the faint of heart, and not just because you might get shot. Fighting in the midshipman's birth wasn't a big deal, and they were pretty far removed from the Captain. The trouble with this particular story was that Simpson doesn't look that much older than the others, and he's supposed to be.

He got away with his abuses because he was older and stronger, and the other's had no recourse. Eccleston and the captain were ineffectual only because no one would tell them what Simpson was doing. Remember how Eccleston found Hornblower all bruised up after their fight, and point-blank asked him who he'd been fighting with. When he refused to answer, he punished him. He can't really do anything to or about Simpson if no one tells him.

Here's to the health of Cardinal Puff.

[–] jkholman 8 years ago

I work at a shipyard in the United States. And with things I had (or thought I had)to put up with were at times intolerable. Bullies thrive on the rigidity of rules and the knowledge that almost all people avoid getting involved in rescuing another person in peril. I am normally good-natured and friendly, but had to learn to behave like a belligerant to certain individuals. It is all bullies understand. They refuse to change their ways.
You have to realize that bullies are of a perverse nature that is intrinsic to their being. They are largely molded at an early age. Their perversity is on different levels and is expressed according to their whims, imaginations and what they think they can get away with. They are also cowards and their greatest fear is that others will find that out. Avoiding a bully is not enough. If anything, it increases their wrath. Bullies have to be spoken down to.
Trying to reason with a bully is a waste of time. They are irredeemable beyond a real religious experience.
As mentioned in an earlier post, the punishment of constantly waking Midshipman Hornblower would have been seen by the commissioned officers as mild punishment. Interference by an officer senior to Simpson would having been viewed as meddling.
Another possibility would be that the senior officers would have judged it to be the responsibility of the midshipmen to rectify their own problems, thus better equipping them to become self-reliant.

[–] victor-41 10 years ago

One word: Hierarchy. From that day to this such abuses were/are common in any hierarchical system. Tattling on one's "betters" is not only useless, but sometimes dangerous. You can see examples of it all around you even today.

[–] jkholman 8 years ago

Victor-41,

you put a better perspective on what I am conveying. Hierarchy is the platform on which a bully operates.

thank you,

JKHolman

[–] wmousie 8 years ago

Bullying featured large in a young man's public (American's read "private") school education. The British schools had a fagging system where the more senior boys were assigned several of the younger boys to do some of their personal chores. In return, the senior boys were supposed to look after the younger boys, to act as a mentor, see that they didn't get into trouble, kept the peace, etc. It worked in theory, provided the senior boy was dependable, upright and sane. If he was a bully, the younger boys suffered.

"Tom Brown's School Days," both the novel written in 1857 by Thomas Hughes, the 1951 film, or the 2005 remake, are all excellent and demonstrate both the advantages and disadvantages of the system.

Charles Dickens also produced a caricature of a private British school -- Do-the-Boys' Hall, run by a Mr. Wackford Squeers, which appeared in "Nicholas Nickelby." The Dickens novel was published first serially between 1838 and 1839. and then in single volume form. There have been a least three mini-series adaptations for television of "Nicholas Nickelby" since 2000.