MovieChat Forums > Saving Private Ryan (1998) Discussion > Steamboat Willie did nothing wrong

Steamboat Willie did nothing wrong


They had no evidence that he killed Wade, but even if he did, so what? That's just what happens in war, soldiers kill each other. I'm sure they killed some of his friends too. I don't think it's a war crime to kill a medic, but even if it was, he still did nothing wrong. He was being shot at from miles away, he couldn't carefully select his targets, he had to take cover and just fire in their direction. What else was he supposed to do? He probably couldn't even see that Wade was a medic. And he did nothing wrong when he rejoined his own men. It's not his fault they managed to pick him up, and when they did, he couldn't leave them, that would be desertion.

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"I don't think it's a war crime to kill a medic"

"According to the Geneva Convention, knowingly firing at a medic wearing clear insignia is a war crime."

"He was being shot at from miles away"

No, he wasn't being shot at from miles away. It has only become feasible to shoot someone from miles away in recent years, and only snipers do it, with modern optics and extremely powerful rifles (.50 BMG). Only one sniper has ever had a kill from "miles away" (~2.2 miles), with a .50 BMG, and that was in 2017. Prior to that, the record was ~1.75 miles, also with a .50 BMG, in 2012.

Here's a .50 BMG cartridge compared to some other cartridges:

https://image.slidesharecdn.com/2131464/95/to-catch-a-50-bmg-bullet-2-728.jpg?cb=1254740383

As you can see, the .30-06 is tiny compared to the .50 BMG (.30-06 being the most powerful cartridge that any of them had in this movie). The .50 BMG has about 5 times the muzzle energy of the .30-06.

Their sniper (Barry Pepper's character), with his .30-06 bolt-action rifle and primitive scope (M1903A4 Springfield Sniper Rifle) would be doing well to make a hit at three-quarters of a mile. The longest recorded sniper kill with an '03 Springfield was in WWI, 1,400 yards (~0.8 miles).

Steamboat Willie was being shot at from probably a couple hundred yards away at the most, and most likely, 100 yards or less.

In any case, even if you excuse his shooting of a medic, he still doesn't come across as an honorable soldier to the audience, due to him saying anything to save his own skin, and not being sincere about it. In other words, he came across as a cowardly weasel.

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Carlos Hathcock did a 1.4 mile kill shot with a Ma Deuce and an 8 power scope in 1967. Granted, that's the farthest confirmed kill at that distance with that hardware. While your point is well taken the idea that a sniper could land a 2 mile shot successfully using WWII technology isn't totally crazy.

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"Carlos Hathcock did a 1.4 mile kill shot with a Ma Deuce and an 8 power scope in 1967."

That's a .50 BMG, not a .30-06-level or less cartridge, and there's a world of difference between the scopes available in 1967 and the ones available in WWII.

"the idea that a sniper could land a 2 mile shot successfully using WWII technology isn't totally crazy."

Yes, it is. Your example is far less than 2 miles with a far more powerful cartridge and 20+ years of optics improvements. As I said, a 2+ mile kill shot never happened until a couple of years ago (some 73 years after the events depicted in this movie took place), and there was a good reason for that.

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"In any case, even if you excuse his shooting of a medic, he still doesn't come across as an honorable soldier to the audience, due to him saying anything to save his own skin, and not being sincere about it. In other words, he came across as a cowardly weasel."

I have never been in combat so this is just my opinion, but I think many of us in his situation would act the same way. He had just been through a brutal firefight, seen two friends die violently right beside him, and when he gets captured they start brutalizing him and make him dig his own grave. I can't help but feel that would be so terrifying I might say anything to not be executed.

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Wade was running right behind Jackson when they attacked the German machine gun. Not sure why Wade didn't stay back with Uphem, but whatever. Its possible the gunner was aiming at Jackson, but missed and hit Wade. Or in the chaos of the moment and thru the smoke and gunfire they didn't see that Wade was a medic.

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He wasn't being shot from miles away, but in the chaos of the firefight, there is no evidence given in the movie that he either killed or targeted Wade.

I agree that he did nothing wrong rejoining the fight - an American soldier would have done the same thing. Bullshitting his way into being let go was just him surviving.

Ironically, it's Upham who blatantly violates the rules of warfare in the end by executing a prisoner of war.

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"Ironically, it's Upham who blatantly violates the rules of warfare in the end by executing a prisoner of war."

And it's the first and only time we see Upham shoot anyone, go figure.

Still, it's dramatically satisfying. Steamboat Willie was spared by Miller, then he kills Miller. It's technically legal but ...

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It doesn’t matter if he did “something wrong” or not. Their friend being killed made all of them extremely emotional and angry, they felt vengeful so they took it out on the only surviving enemy soldier there. They blamed him for their friend’s death, as he was one of the enemy soldiers who attacked them. None of them stopped to think “hey was this enemy soldier actually the one who fired the shot that killed him? Well he was only doing his duty so I better not overreact and kill him.” When someone’s buddy is shot and dies a slow agonizing death in front of them, I wouldn’t really expect them to react rationally toward any of the enemies who were just trying to kill all of them. For them he embodied the reason they were there fighting the war and the reason their comrades were getting killed.

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I agree he didn't exactly do anything wrong. Just a soldier serving their country as best they can. I don't know if it was trying to paint him as something of a bad guy at the end by rejoining his countrymen and helping to shoot down Miller and his team, and that we were supposed to be with Upham in his decision to single him out and kill him, but it didn't work for me. And was that supposed to be some sort of redemption arc for Upham? That he found his balls and shot down the enemy and the man who shot his friends? Again, it didn't work for me if it was. I'd have had more respect for Upham if he'd stuck to his principles and let him go again.

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Upham and Miller spared his life, Willie could have been executed. He was supposed to turn himself in to the Allies and he didn't do it. He had no honor, that was why Upham killed him the second time he had the chance.

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Willie shot the Captain who spared his life. I think that's why Upham decided to stop being friends with the enemy.

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"Only if he doesn't get picked up by his own Wehrmacht first, then thrown back into circulation" as Reiben said and that's probably what happened. He couldn't exactly desert and go looking for an Allied patrol to turn himself into at that point.

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