Did you also notice how the movie tends to associate male-male sex with something negative all the way through?
The board members: Disowning his gay son, having sex with an 11 year old boy and doing whatever ghastly things to his own son.
Bob being shocked at Jay fantasizing about men and Jay going out of his way to prove he isn't a *beep* Same thing with Bartleby when Betthany thinks he's gay, though he isn't quite as negative in his denial.
watch "chasing amy"
ben affleck and jason lee hook up in that movie so i highly doubt that kevin smith hates gay men
"I use lqtm(laughing quietly to my self) insted of lol, its more honest"
Demetri Martin
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Holden and Banky don't hook up in Amy, however, watch the deleted scenes on the Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back DVD. It is made abundantly clear, through both the title of the scene, and the added dialogue, that Banky is gay. Kevin Smith also has an openly gay brother. He has no problem with homosexuality.
share[deleted]
It's only something negative if you are simple minded. And 95% of the world isn't.
share
If the entire population went homosexual and stayed that way, the human race would die out, barring a massive compulsory artificial insemination program or something similar. (Yet another government agency?)
If the entire population went heterosexual and stayed that way, the human race would continue on much as before.
If the continuing existence of the human race is not a positive issue, I don't know what is.
The possible nonexistence of the human race is something negative. And yes I am simple minded, simple enough to see the truth of that.
So, it is clear that the homosexuals depend on the heterosexuals for their very existence, and not the other way around.
Homosexuals are essentially a running joke, a la "You Know How I Know You're Gay" dialog between Paul Rudd and Seth Rogen in The 40 Year Old Virgin, and have been in all my actual life experience. The heterosexuals are expected by political correctness, or whatever you want to call it, to pretend that "gayness" is a legitimate "alternative lifestyle" via the gay media.
Speaking of negative, look at all of the negative expressions that have entered into our vernacular: that sucks, that blows, queer as a three-dollar bill, *beep* etc. each as a pejorative. I can't think of a single non-leering, positive expression that has emerged as a result of the practice of homosexuality or from the homosexual culture.
Also negative in its essence is "gay pride week" and all such efforts to propagandize gayness into legitimacy. Can you imagine "hetero pride week"?
It's no secret, but but something we tend to skirt around or avoid, like discussing sex with our teenage kids.
Shut up and stop discriminating people on what they find attractive. A man's love for another man is just as legitimate as a man's love for a woman.
What's all this shouting? We'll have no trouble here
"The possible nonexistence of the human race is something negative"
Is it?
Is it REALLY?
As long as humans hold hatred against each other for being different, we are doomed anyway. It really wouldn't matter if the world ended tomorrow. At least there would be no more suffering on this piece of dust that floats through space..
''As long as humans hold hatred against each other for being different, we are doomed anyway. It really wouldn't matter if the world ended tomorrow. At least there would be no more suffering on this piece of dust that floats through space..''
Mankind will probably just Cobalt bomb itself to death anyway.
Formerly KingAngantyr
Ok geoh, try to relax.
I won't debate whether the continuation of humanity is a good thing. But here's a thought: We're are now self-centered, rather than species-centered, so we've stopped evolving and we'll soon kill each other off from hatred so many might argue that cutting our losses wouldn't be bad.
Secondly, gay people can and do have children, through artifical insemination and/or surrogacy. Are you suggesting that hetero people who choose not to procreate are negative, or an abomination? Of course not, you accept that as their choice. But maybe it's not just a choice, maybe, these are people who have found like minded individuals and are congenitally programmed to not want kids. I have good friends who have never had children and they just don't get why anyone would want to bring kids into the world.
Next, your examples of pejorative expressions - Sucking and blowing are things that hetero people do too. If that's news to you, look in to it, it's awesome.
"Alternative lifestyle" grates on me too. Is being left handed an alternative lifestyle? No, we got over that little suspicion, and now we don't even think about it, but, look up "sinister" in the dictionary some time.
Queer as a 3 dollar bill comes from the fact that there are no 3 dollar bills, thus to be handed one would be odd, unusual, strange, and, perhaps wrong. "Queer" is a word that had meaning, just like "gay" used to mean happy.
It got used as an insult against homosexuals, implying they are "wrong" and, much like the n-word, was adopted by the targeted community, as in, I'm here, I'm queer, etc.
Finally, Gay Pride is necessary because many homosexuals have to fear people with their narrow and bigoted opinions or are made to feel ashamed of something they have no control over. Gay Pride will not be required when they are finaly accepted. It's just a show to get out in public and be proud of you who are, proud of the way you were made and to show those who are still seeking that they can take heart. We don't have hetero pride week, because every week is hetero pride week.
Anyway, I'm not going to change your mind, of course, but for those of you reading who are gay, ignore that guy, and live your life.
cheers!
"There's poo in there" - Zack
leengee 1 geoh 0
very well said
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If all the people in the world became farmers and stayed farmers, humanity would survive.
If all the people in the world became anything but farmers, humanity would starve.
So the world depends on farmers but farmers do not necessarily depend on the rest of the world. Any 5 year old can see that therefore, any job besides farming land is bad.
Does this argument sound stupid to you? Because it sounds extremly stupid to me.
Truth is, a low percentage of the population is gay and if it gives them happiness, why should we not let them be? Personally, I don't understand modern art or classical music. I think the time of those people would be better spend doing something productive but that is simply my opinion and as long as a behavior does not hurt anybody, I don't mind.
The gay guy who lives across the street from me does not hurt anybody so let him be gay. I am simple, too.
I think humanity should be wiped out and then we can give evolution a second chance.
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Why we can't let them be is because they try to stick it in our faces, discrimination, parades, rights.. & that's without mentioning the moral, social and/or religious, plus ethical, etc. reasons. Honestly I'm aware how I must sound horrible when I speak about ghey people, but I challenge anyone to tell me a SINGLE THING why it would be alright for someone to not be heterosexual (& that's a rhetorical statement, because it's impossible to actually have a valid reason :)).This one was so BS on so many different levels that I just have to repost that gem before I go at it sentence by sentence.
Why we can't let them be is because they try to stick it in our facesI have never seen 2 men kiss in public, but I have seen lots of heterosexual couples kiss in public. If we are going to talk about "in our faces" I think we'll soon discover that it's us, the heterosexuals, who are "in our faces".
discriminationThey fight so they are not discriminated against. Imagine that you would be discriminated because of your sexual preferences.
rightsSee above. Seriously.
that's without mentioning the moralNow here you are right on the money by accident. "Moral" by definition is a group and society thing. Everything that goes against accepted behavior is amoral. So being gay might actually be considered amoral.
socialHere you might be right. Our society produces less and less children. So it is against society to be gay since they don't get children. But by that same logic it would be against society to be childless for whatever reasons. And it would also be against society to have less than 2.3 children (2 to compensate for the parents and 0.3 to compensate for those who die before they can have 2.3 children themselves). And it would be a-social for somebody in China or India to NOT be gay because of their overpopulation problems. I think we'll not go down that argumentative road.
religiousI would like to present you with 2 quotes and 2 questions:
ethical, etcName one.
but I challenge anyone to tell me a SINGLE THING why it would be alright for someone to not be heterosexual (& that's a rhetorical statement, because it's impossible to actually have a valid reason :)).You are right. There is no possible reason why somebody should not be heterosexual.
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***If all the people in the world became farmers and stayed farmers, humanity would survive.
If all the people in the world became anything but farmers, humanity would starve.
So the world depends on farmers but farmers do not necessarily depend on the rest of the world. Any 5 year old can see that therefore, any job besides farming land is bad.
Does this argument sound stupid to you? Because it sounds extremly stupid to me.***
Yes, it sounds stupid to me, because your argument is Ad Hominem in the first place, because....
If all the people in the world became farmers and stayed farmers, humanity would not survive.
I don't think you know what Ad Hominem means.
shareUmm, no slick, I'm pretty frickin certain I do!
I guess you just choose to use the term incorrectly despite knowing what it means then.
shareAgain chief, I am well-versed on the meaning. You presented an incorrect premise (if everyone in the world became farmers, humanity would survive), then worked backwards from there, i.e. a logical fallacy, or more specifically, a fallacy of accident or sweeping generalization, i.e. an Ad Hominem argument.
Do you know how stupid your premise is? Now that is a rhetorical question...or am I now using "rhetorical" incorrectly, jackwagon?
If everyone on the planet was a farmer..who's going to be a doctor and fight your diseases? Or a homebuilder?
Please study up if you are going to re-re-reply, because you are boring me.
My premise? You have me mistaken for another poster. Ad Hominem means against the person, not sweeping generalization.
"who's going to be a doctor and fight your diseases? Or a homebuilder?"
He said that we could survive (because we have food), not that everything would be great.
So that which you hate the most you secretly are? Gotcha.
shareIf the entire population went homosexual and stayed that way, the human race would die out, barring a massive compulsory artificial insemination program or something similar. (Yet another government agency?)
If the entire population went heterosexual and stayed that way, the human race would continue on much as before.
If the continuing existence of the human race is not a positive issue, I don't know what is.
I try not to respond to trolls or the blatantly ignorant, but when I got down to the "gay media" part I couldn't stop laughing. :)
sharehaha, if 95% of the human population was gay, the remaining 5% would have fun populating the world. Also, given the fact that the world can't hold more people I'd say it would be a good thing if 95% can't (or let's say don't want to) reproduce. Wait a sec, many gay couples still want to have babies. All it needs is a single ejaculation and you that doesn't even require intercourse, so ... 95% of the world being gay wouldn't make our species extinct.
shareGiven how many homosexual couples choose to have children these days you're first line points out you're an uninformed idiot who knows nothing on the topic he's talking on...nobody likes the willfully ignorant.
shareIf the entire population was so stupid as you and stayed that way, we would end up as slaves for the apes.
share"If the entire population went homosexual and stayed that way"
I know this is a bit old, but this is an example of what's known as a "slippery slope" fallacy in classical logic...
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*+_Charos_+*
"I have often laughed at weaklings
who thought themselves good because
they had no claws."
"If the entire population went homosexual and stayed that way"
"I know this is a bit old, but this is an example of what's known as a "slippery slope" fallacy in classical logic..."
Not to mention, by that logic he would be against impotent people and people who deside not to have children as well.
geoh777
If the entire population
It's only something negative if you are simple minded. And 95% of the world isn't.
95% of the world isnt gay? omg! please show us your proof and your sources. please. That is all i ask. I dont care who's gay and who isnt. I just like to be shown proof when somebody claims something as fact.
Funniest thing I have read today. Thanks jeff!
"It's only something negative if you are simple minded. And 95% of the world isn't"
ok, i copied and pasted my exact quote. Where does it say anything about 95% of the world being gay or not gay? The only thing I know is that there are probably a lot more straight people than gay people. Just like I thought there were more intelligent people than simple minded people, but now I'm not so sure. My post didn't even include the word "gay" in it.
Glove slap, baby, glove slap!
Glove slap, I don't take crap!
Glove slap, shut your big yap.
LOL. I hope you're trolling. Go to any Muslim country and 'Come out' in public. Be prepared to suffer a long and torturous death.
http://www.last.fm/user/OBLIVIONxSPAWN
Yes Im sure thats somewhat true, which is why those Turkish dudes come to the U.S. to suck d**k
shareI think having sex with an 11-year-old boy IS a pretty negative thing dude!
sharethat is peadophilia NOT homosexuality.
two things that are not even remotely related people!
This is it. This is the moment of your death.
I don't know, man, to interfere with a male of any age is a bit homosexual in my book...
shareso are you saying that if a peadophile rapes a female then that defines him as heterosexual?
and as a heterosexual (as i am sure you are) dont you find comparisons between you and a heterosexual paedophile offensive??
This is it. This is the moment of your death.
No. I meant that a paedophile who has sex with a woman is likely to be interested in young girls, whereas a paedophile who has sex with a man is likely to be interested in boys. Makes sense, yes?
shareI am sure that I don't need to remind you that most pedophiles have families and consider themselves heterosexual. I think I understand what you mean, but you did sound as if any pedophile that is interested in boys is homosexual. Pedophilia is bad regardless of what gender is the victim.
shareAnd DISOWNING your son.
And MOLESTING your son.
Lol, that's not anti-gay.
Heck, they're saying there's nothing wrong with homosexuality, by saying that DISOWNING someone for being gay is BAD!!
They never said the "being gay" is negative, lol.
And I'm with HansLanda (nice name, btw): doing children - especially if you're related to them - is effed up, whether they're your same gender or not.
It's not the gay act is wrong; it's the statutory rape, lol.
Dogma doesn't really strike me as being anti gay. Bart did say that disowning his son for being Gay was wrong and he only really seemed surprised when betthany thought he was gay nothing more. The Jay thing just strikes me as someone who is more insecure then homophobic. As for the last two I have no doubt you could grab any Gay or Lesbian person off the street and they would be deeply offended at be lumped in with those two. Oh and no I’m not Gay ya I know call me insecure if you must.
share[deleted]
I agree.. people are always digging too deep into movies that are made for entertainment purposes... stop creating problems where there isnt any!
Homer- Oh I'm sorry son. I didn't realise you, Jay Leno and a monkey were bathing a clown.
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Loki actually killed the guy for disowning his gay son, so the guy who fulfilled the wrath of God was against anti-gay people. I think the whole "having sex with an 11-year-old boy" thing was more for the fact that some guy screwed a child, not that the child was male. The whole "Bartleby and Loki are gay" thing is probably a joke because some people thought Matt Damon and Ben Affleck were gay.
shareI can sort of see what you're getting at, but none of those moments is definitively anti-gay as you title it.
1. The executive who disowns his gay son is condemned for doing so. There's no point in denying that it doesn't happen; Kevin Smith's brother is gay and he's continually stated he's more than aware, through his brother's experiences, that being gay is to live in oppression.
2. The fact that the eleven year old is a boy isn't the point, it's that it's an eleven year old. I concede it could implicitly strengthen the notion that having sex with an eleven year old girl would be somehow better, but I'm not convinced that's his intention. The emphasis on the 'boy' in that line might be because they're in a conservative, corporate environment that avoids homosexuality at any point.
3. Jay's denial of his homosexuality isn't a comment on homosexuality being negative, but the unnecessary insecurity people feel about their sexuality. Because Jay is so explicitly 'heterosexual' in his behavior, it's hilarious watching him fumble over his closet homosexual tendencies.
I actually think the point of the "abandoning his own gay son" thing was that God wasn't cool with that sort of thing. He was pointing it out as a sin, certainly not anything to be proud of.
shareHow does anyone possibly think that Kevin Smith is a homophobe? In Chasing Amy, the funniest character by far is the black guy who writes a comic book in the style of Malcolm X but in reality is as camp as Christmas? And it's not poking fun at him, you're laughing with him!
sharei agree with false impression ...i'm gay and didn't get any anti gay message.
shareAll the movies make some reference to the fact that jay and bob, randall, dante, and others are just a nudge from having a homosexual experience. In this movie, after the disclosure that jay is fantacizing about men, we wakes up on the train and says, "I didn't cum on you Pete, I swear."
It's just good clean fun. Let's try to relax a bit.
"Plan? There ain't no plan!" - Pigkiller
If anything, I thought it was pretty anti-sex.
o____o
I didn't get much anti-gay vibes from it.
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"I TOLD YOU I WOULD EAT YOU!"