Just watched an interview with Patrick Stewart on Youtube. He said he didn't like "Trekkies" because he feels the fans are protrayed in an negative light. And he feels that it makes fun of the them instead of celebrating them.
Patrick advocated these people? I thought he had more of a head on his shoulders, and would understand sickness when he saw it.
If anything, I think the film makes light of these people (I guess I'm with him on that), but these people are badly in need of another life. (Or maybe that's what he was getting at?)
Don't get me wrong: I'm a Star Trek fan, I've always loved all the shows, and the movies, and Roddenberry's philosophy.
But there are ways to pursue that philosophy without dressing up and convincing everyone that you're insane. In fact, doing it WITHOUT dressing up would probably go a lot further towards advancing it, and getting people to accept it.
These people work against their own wishes. If there are people thinking that being a pacifist and diplomacist is an anomaly, think how much their "philosophy" is bolstered by the fact that the people most ardently advocating the opposite are wearing costume clothing, spreading their fingers in some weird esoteric way, and speaking an alien tongue? "See? Pacifists are crazy!" And, if Trekkies are the prime people out there, then they're right. (Hmmm...sounds like when I was growing up, and the hippies were doing it! But at least the hippies, as crazy as they were, weren't pretending to be from some other time or planet...at least for the most part.)
I can't actually blame Paramount (which, after all, condemned the concept out and out to an early demise until the late 70's when, on a whim, it tried again...and found itself with a belated franchise), or the celebrities attending the conventions (for the most part who had no other trophies under their belts). If their bread is being buttered by nutcases, so be it, I guess.
But when a judge accepts a woman, in full Trek regalia, who claims to be a starship captain, onto a jury...then things are getting a bit weird.
I remember when that was hitting the press...and her defense was that she was upholding certain high standards of Starfleet. All fine and good...but who on earth appointed her captain of a non-existant starship? No one, not even the judge, thought that her saying THAT was a bit...eccentric? (And, even if no one had an argument with her principles, to allow her to be a jurer IN THAT OUTFIT was more or less admitting that they also allowed her to remain in "command" of that non-existant vessel. THAT isn't weird?) Yeah, perhaps both lawyers thought it would be in their own best interests to have a nutcase on the jury, and therefore never questioned it...but the judge should have taken one look at her and thrown her ass out. The woman is INSANE.
If the definition of insane is not having a grasp of reality, the REAL world around you...then she is totally insane. As are a lot of Trekkies.
It's true that probably the majority of them just dress up and masquerade at the conventions for fun, like it's their Mardis Gras. All good and well...
...but the movie showed a few people that get into it a bit more than that (milady from the jury included), and these people are just sick. For people to continue to humor them does nothing to advance the show, or help the people with such problems as to necessitate them living out this fantasy.
Otherwise...nicely put together movie.
YOu make some great points and I posted similar points in another thread. Nothing wrong with being a diehard trekkie and there's nothing wrong with even dressing up, but when it becomes your whole identity and a way of life, that is just way overboard. As far as him saying the fans are being portrayed in a negative light, Ofcourse they're gonna portray them in a negative light!!! what the hell does everybody expect?? Like that freak that is always stalking brent spiner. She was all surprised and crying foul after the movie came out. How stupid could she be? It doesn't take a genious to figure out that if they show normal people that have lives and don't play dress up, then it would make for a very dull movie. This movie was made to entertain people and give everybody a good laugh and show people just how pathetic and retarded some of these trekkies are and to what extent they go through to live in this whole fantasy world they created for themselves. Again, no disrespect to any fans that dress up or love the show. I love the franchise as well and I'm a diehard fan too. I just think if somebody is living his or her life in a fantasy world like that woman who wore the uniform to trial, then they need to take a step back and consider some form of therapy
shareI mean you personally are angry at these extreme trekkies. You claim they need help but all you do is bully and degrade them/
I think I am taking all of this rather well.
I wasn't bullying anybody. I was just pointing out that the people that acted all outraged over how some were portrayed in the movie, were extremely naive. I posted that 7 years ago and I see now that I used language I shouldn't have and I"m sorry to anybody I may have offended. I just felt that when trek fantasy trumps reality, there's a problem there and I should've been more tactful in the way I phrased that.
shareIf that's your definition of insane, and I would not disagree, then anyone who follows a religion is insane. (There's just as much evidence for her being the captain of a starship as there is for a god or gods). If no "insane" people are allowed to be on juries, then you'd probably have a hard time filling a jury box in the US. Personally, I'd rather have a woman in a Star Trek uniform passing judgement on me than a religious nut.
sharewell i'm definately no "religious nut" but your argument that "there's just as much evidence for her being the captain of a starship..." doesn't really work does it? There is NO starship is there? It's all based on a fictional television series written 50 years ago. Now I call myself an atheist and I am happy to admit I find it very hard to have a serious discussion about say Christianity with a devout Christian because I simply can't comprehend their belief. But I wouldn't dare compare a religion that has existed for over 2000 years to Star Trek....they don't really compare do they?
You would trust someone who has more faith in something that they know fine well is fake than someone who has faith an a religion which may just possibly, might turn out to be true?
He who never makes a mistake, never makes a discovery
Actually the concepts can totally compare. Especially if you're discussing it in the sense of someone taking something on no evidence and believing it passionately, living by it's established tenants, etc.
In fact, in those respects Star Trek is far less contradictory than the Bible ever could be with it still be called the Bible. It also has a vastly finer-tuned philosophy. People throughout history have always grasped onto myth and legend, often times to the point of absurdity to someone who is viewing it from the outside. Entire societies have risen and fallen based upon these concepts. Isolating one person because what they happen to have latched onto isn't embraced by the majority doesn't change the fact that a large portion of the majority is doing the same. Albeit with a far older, cruder philosophy and story.
I guess we'll have to wait 2000 years... of course by then jury lady will be a saint...
shareI think Stewart's point was that this film went out and found some of the craziest folks out there and made a movie about the most off-the-wall stuff that they do. There's nothing wrong with being a fanatic about something (just ask a big sports fan about his favorite team) but they found a woman who's about one step from stalking Brent Spiner, and another person who was dismissd from jury duty because she wanted to be addressed by her role-playing name. Most Trek fans are no different than your average sports fan or music fan; they are big into what they like and there's nothing wrong with that. You can find people who are way too obsessed with something and they chose to make one about those who feel that way about Star Trek.
shareI appreciate the response. But who's to say just how many of these over the top fanatics there really are out there? There may be more than any of us realize. but that's besides the point. the fact that these were the most over the top fanatical fans is what made this such an entertaining movie. BUt I can understand why he'd feel that way. He probably felt it gave all the other trekkies a bad name. Too bad I didn't go to the conventions in the glory days. It would've been pretty entertaining to see some of the real fanatics at these things.
shareMost Trek fans are no different than your average sports fan or music fan; they are big into what they like and there's nothing wrong with that. You can find people who are way too obsessed with something and they chose to make one about those who feel that way about Star Trek.
Two things
#1 Stewart isn't going to shoot his cash cow so of course he would side with the fans
#2 A movie about average middle of the road Star Trek fans that can easily tell the difference between fantasy and reality would just be boring.
On a whim I went to a Trek convention when I lived in Tulsa. I had seen a few of the movies and thought the shows were boring as hell. I have a Geek store in Lomita now and I probably play this DVD two or three times a week. I can watch it over and over without getting bored. These people are so nuts and SO real. They are not the minority, they are the crowd that you see at the convention. They are like intense sports fans, those guys are off the wall too. The best part is when the lady who wore her Trek uniform to Jury duty because it is a uniform like any other uniform. Who ever saw a trial where there was a cop, football player, chef and trash man all sitting on the jury in their work uniform? And since when is a costume a uniform? Classic. All we get in California are the Comic Cons, way less fun. Mostly people who just want to buy or sell junk. The Trek Cons have the people who are there to be with people like them and socialize. If you ever get the chance to go to one you have to go.
shareHit up an anime convention some time, you'll get a fair amount of the same people, but obsessed with Japanese culture instead. There will be a fair amount of regular people there as well, who enjoy conversations about the subject, or only dress up and such specifically at conventions, but there are more than a few loonies there who are Trekkie film worthy.
I think Stewart is somewhat right in his comments. I love Trek as much as the next person, but I also know people who love Trek too much. For me, wearing a 'red shirt' on an average day, just hanging out with my friends, would never be a big deal No more so than them wearing a jersey. Chatting with fellow Treks about it, or watching some of the movies/episodes for fun with them is cool. That's a social thing, having fun, hanging with people who also hold a similar interest. No different than joking around about LotR or BtVS.
But starting a 'star ship', always wearing a uniform, the decals, accessories, and doing nothing else but obsessing about Trek? That's a call for help. And while this movie features people who honestly do desperately need help, it probably should have mentioned that most people who attend the conventions and what not are just your average fan. Sure, they might have every Trek series and movie on DVD, and possibly a few books, a few gadgets or what not (because, let's face it, who hasn't gotten a phaser or two from a friend as a joke?), but they won't be obsessed about it. They would know when to just put the stuff down, and go and do something else for a while.
And that's really the difference between the crazies and the normal fans; a crazy fan will never let it go, and will constantly obsess; a normal fan will enjoy, probably own some stuff, but they will be involved with more in their lives, and have a wider range of interests.
That said, live long and prosper y'all.
You own a ST uniform Shirt, a phaser, read all the ST books and watch all the movies and episodes? Man you are really obsessed and need to get some help. Go get it now. Or they will make a movie about YOU soon. And then who is going to stand up for you? Gene Roddenberry would have.
AND BTW, I see that you state that you have the diagnostic skills to diagnose people just by watching a movie. Can you tell me if you are a state licensed Psychiatrist? Psychologist? Psychiatric Social Worker or even a high school counselor?
Signed,
A Psychotherapist working in the field for 42 years.
I think I am taking all of this rather well.
To the original poster, can you please provide a link to the Partick Stewart interview? I've tried searching on YouTube for it but can't find it.
Not on the rug, man....
I don't think it portrayed them negatively. It simply portrayed them and it's inescapable if to some people they come across as negative.
I think the whole Trekkie phenomenon is primarily nothing but a highly accepting community. People dedicate themselves to it not so much because they love the show but because they love the community. Star Trek is a method of bringing people together.
I agree with Stewart. It would be like making a documentary called "African-Americans" and showing Bloods and Crips for 75% of it. The Trekkers on this are such a small portion of the overall awesome fan base, it's really not fair to the majority.
shareYou know, some of these answers here are very interesting. Interesting in how intolerant some of these oh so tolerant Star Trek fans can be. It's like "Oh, we're tolerant, we tolerate everyone - unless they choose to behave in a way we consider out of the norm or outright crazy."
So what if they wanna wear their Starfleet uniform every day (including all those accessories). So what if they change their homes or work-places to look like a starship. So what if they try to live their fantasy. Even if they are too far "out there" - they could be doing worse. Like blowing up buildings or running amok and shooting dozens of people cos they're unhappy with their lives. So why don't you just let them be happy in their own way? And practice some tolerance which, by definition, means: "The capacity for or the practice of recognizing and respecting the beliefs or practices of others."
So, if someone shows up for jury duty completely naked because she thinks she's Lady Godiva, the judge should be tolerant of that and let her go with it? (By the way, an earlier post, a bit after mine, seemed to have missed the point: the Trek lady in question wasn't kicked off jury duty, she was accepted! Evidently she was kicked later for talking with the press.) Tolerance or no, there is such a thing as propriety. You'd think that a Starfleet captain would know a thing or two about protocol!
Come on, seriously...if you were on trial for something serious, something whose outcome could affect the rest of your life, take you away from your family, cost you a lot of money in reparations, ruin your entire future, or whatever...would it give you comfort to find your jury made up of one person dressed as a Starfleet Captain, one as a Klingon, one as Captain America, one as Dick Tracy, one in a clown outfit, one on stilts, one standing on his head, one in a princess Barbie outfit, one imitating Groucho Marx, one yelling out commands imitating R. Lee Ermey, one as Cleopatra and one naked as Lady Godiva? Would you still, under those circumstances, be pleading tolerance? Or would you maybe, just maybe, be wondering about your future? After all, shouldn't the judge be equally tolerant of all of them?
And what happens if that someone you're referring to is "happy in his own way" BECAUSE he likes "blowing up buildings or running amok and shooting dozens of people?" Just where does tolerance begin and end?
You've effectually admitted that people taking these things to this kind of extreme are probably very unhappy with their own lives; do you somehow think that our being tolerant of them is making them happier, is making their lives more fulfilled? Or could it possibly be making it worse, because the ONLY way they're finding fulfillment is by living out what even they probably see, deep down, is just a futile fantasy?
In short, I'm tolerant as hell towards people having fun with stuff, as long as they don't hurt each other, or themselves. But I think, quite possibly, these people, the extreme people, are feeling a LOT of hurt, and humoring their fantasies is quite possibly only hurting them more, in the long run.
(Oh, Geez...how on earth did this thread suddenly get so serious?)
If I were on a show that was not as relevant as it used to be and made the bulk of my royalties based on there being a continuing audience for my show, I'd want the fans to be treated with respect, too.
I also imagine that he might genuinely feel affection for fans of the show. But the truth is that the people in this film not only agreed to appear, but most seemed genuinely enthusiastic about it.
Nobody said anything derogatory about them, they were mostly left to talk freely and let their opinions and thoughts be filmed.
While some might say it was the editing that ultimately made fun of them, I would say this: you can't edit ANYTHING if there's nothing there to edit. When you agree to be part of a documentary that is about a very
notorious fandom, then you would expect that some humor might be involved.
Bottom line : The people in this film aren't treated poorly, their obsessive fandom is neither given credence nor exploited. It's just shown as is. Frankly, I think it's hilarious and if I were the type of person who lived out my own fandom
via cosplay, fanfiction or the like, I'd certainly not be embarrassed about it. But I think a line can bd drawn between enjoyment of a show and a certain pathology that makes a person want to avoid their life and retreat into the fantasy of a television show.