MovieChat Forums > Jackie Brown (1997) Discussion > I know Ordell is supposed to be dumb but...

I know Ordell is supposed to be dumb but.....


.... walking right into the bail bondsmans office with Jackie just sitting there in the DARK? What did he think was going to happen?

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Ordell is NOT supposed to be dumb. He did take a big risk... but trusted Max for some reason. Max was straight with him all along, so he was willing to take the risk to get his money.

I does seem like a dastardly way to get Ordell out of the picture by Jackie (and max)... but Ordell is a killer and arms dealer. he had it coming in a way...and if given the chance or reason, he would have done the same to Jackie or Max.

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His ass was dumb, but he was not supposed to be a dumbass.



"facts are stupid things" - Ronald Reagan

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I must admit, it was a cheap, anti-climatic way to end the film

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The book ends the exact same way. A lot of stuff got changed or cut out. The climax of the story is not one of them.

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I have watched the beginning like 15 times and the middle up to where Louis gets shot but I had never watched all the way to the end.

I can't believe that after Ordell put so much thought into covering his tracks that he would just walk into a dark building where a woman who was scared of him (who held a gun to him before) was waiting. ending was a bit weak. How did Ordell become so stupid.



-We Provide.....Leverage

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I thought so too the first time I watched it ... but, upon the second viewing, it occurred to me that having the lights off didn't effect the way the ending went down. If every light in the office was on, the outcome would have been the same. Now, if having the lights off hid the cops so they could get the drop on Ordell, then I would have had a problem with it - but that wasn't the case.
In fact, it probably wasn't that far out of a way to set the meeting up. It was after hours, dark and its possible that the lights being on may have attracted the attention of some cop who might have come cruising up the street on his rounds, making sure all was quiet - nothing odd or suspicions going down. A cop who knows his 'beat' gets to know the habits of those along it and if Max kept regular hours, closed up shop every evening at the same time, never left a 'nightlight' on etc., it might have stood out, looked unusual to an observant passing cop- think 'The GFII' when the beat cop walks into the bar wondering why the 'open' lights weren't on - 'Hey xyz, ya open or not ...?". What is missing though is Ordell not asking Max 'Why are the lights all off ?' to which Max would reply 'I thought it was a good idea - we don't want a passing cop to come walking through the door, see your gangsta looking a** standing here looking out of place ... could complicate things, no ?" (or something similar :-). In fact, other than for this scenario, I don't see why Jackie would have kept the lights off - its not like the other 3 weren't well hidden or couldn't have been easily discovered by Ordell had he decided to give the place the once over.
I agree that it was out of character for a seasoned outlaw like Ordell to just go walking into a dark room like he did, no doubt. But it wasn't a 'convenient' cheap way to make sure the ending worked out as it did. He wasn't surprised/jumped/attacked for this particular stupid move like say Tippi Hedren in 'The Birds' when she opened the attic door and was immediately set upon by the birds -now THAT was a stupid move written into the story line (contrivance) to set up the next gory attack scene.
I also wondered why QT bothered with that long detailed phone message from Max on Jackies answering machine ... land line, cell phone and beeper. Unless those numbers have some other meaning that I didn't catch, what was the point ?

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Well, you put a lot of thought into that.

correct me if I'm wrong....when Ordell was pulling up with Max, didn't he say that Max would be in front of him @ all times.

Also, Jackie shouted "he's got a gun"...One would think that instinct would kick in and make him duck or something.

I don't know, it just seems that the ending went down very easy for Jackie and the Agents.









Do You Grok

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I'll give ya the part about him telling Max he was to stay in front of him but I still don't think its that odd that he would relax a bit once he was confident things looked/felt like he was the one in control and had nothing more to worry about. No one leaped out and cuffed him when he walked through the door - thats what I think he was suspecting.
The part about Jackie yelling 'hes got a gun ..' ? I would think he would stall for a second or two because he already suspected that she was cooperating with the feds. He shoots one of them, he knows hes just bought a one way ticket to the fed pen. They only had him at this point in time for bringing $$ into the country illegally - nowhere near the same sentencing as for blowing away a fed agent. I'm not saying he knew she was talking to a fed. when she yelled that but the only other players he was worried about was the law. I think that would be his first guess as to who she was yelling to, no ? Just because Melanie thought Ordell was stupid ... I didn't see it. A psychopath yes, plain stupid, nope.

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okay, that has some merit.









Do You Grok

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@Ironman Max giving Jackie three different numbers just shows how much he is falling for her, no other purpose that I'm aware of.

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Another loose end is how could Jackie possibly gamble of Ordell being killed. Make no mistake, she absolutely needed him dead, because if he was arrested and interrogated, he might have spilled the beans about the half million, and then JB would have been on the hook for some kind of crime for sure. But what if cops did hesitate, and did not kill Ordell, what then?

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Yep. This is one of the plot's rough edges. You just have to accept it.

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Ordell is a tough dumb criminal, Melanie said herself that he boasts more than what he actually is.

Even Mr Walker wanted nothing to do with him.

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It's a lucky thing for jackie melanie was dead too.

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It ain't Ordell that's dumb, look in the mirror pal. The lust for lots of money has a definite effect on human beings whereby a momentary tossing of caution to the wind is totally believable within the confines of the structure of the picture.

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He read Max well, and realized that Max was telling the truth, which he was, so he went in. What he didn't considered at the time was that Max was lied to as well by Jackie!

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Louis is really the only dumb character in the movie. Everyone else in the movie has the smarts to figure out the angle, as more cards are revealed.

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