MovieChat Forums > True Women (1997) Discussion > Question about Tarantula...

Question about Tarantula...

posted 14 years ago by acand187-1
24 replies | jump to latest

He seemed to be portryaed as a good guy. He liked Sarah because of her "flying horse" and her bravery, and Phemie as well. Phemie told Georgia that after encountering him she stopped thinking all Indians were savages.

But...seeing as Phemie said it was his men who kidnapped and tortured her friends...isn't it safe to assume he likely ordered AND participated in the kidnapping, rape and torture of countless women?? Yes, he spared Phemie and Sarah, but I recall when his men were at their house, he only helped Sarah, he left the black woman hanging from the tree.

Does sparing two women make him a good guy??

Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica.

[–] kramwizzy680 14 years ago

I see your point here, and you do make sense. The only answer I can give is that since it was hard for an Indian at that time to understand the white man's language and the white man's ways, we really cannot know what his real intentions were in the movie. He obviously was like all humans. He had feelings and sympathy for people he respected. As for the black woman hanging from the tree, Indians had not seen many black people on the plains and probably didn't know what to think of them. Whites were common enough. Tarantula felt a sense of duty to stop his warriors from killing Sarah because he had seen her before and honored her. He had never seen the black woman before, probably ANY black man or woman.

[–] acand187-1 14 years ago

Thanks for the reply....I didn't think about it that way. I liked the movie, but I guess I was always a bit confused about what were supposed to think of his character. Thanks for the info..:)

Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galactica.

[–] red_rackham_77 14 years ago

That is all good points and none of it ever made senses, I will say this, it is hard to hold so much resentments toward indians when they too lost their women and children to white man's diseases or they kidnapped them for rape and torture too, Worst of all they lost their lands and lost their rights to practice their rituals and traditions because whenever they do, white men think they are ploting something against them and then become paranoied and kill them all.

Sorry, no pity to the whites of those times, I am with Georgia.

[–] Eveningstarz_4 14 years ago

yup, I agree, especially since some of my ancestors, the Beothuk from Canada, became extinct due to starvation mostly but also disease and violence.

Some might say I shouldn't take sides...I had ancestors that were Loyalists and ancestors that were Patriots in the Revolutionary War. I'm part Irish, Scottish, Welsh, English, Beothuk, and another Native tribe that we're guessing is Malecite but we're not 100% sure(Malecite records were destroyed in a fire).

But if it came down to it, I side with the Natives. They were here first. My heart goes out to all of them, and it's been a passion of mine to try to do something...anything...to help them. I may be a tiny percentage Native, but that tiny bit goes a long way.

[–] red_rackham_77 14 years ago

"My heart goes out to all of them, and it's been a passion of mine to try to do something...anything...to help them. I may be a tiny percentage Native, but that tiny bit goes a long way."

Me too, I wish there was more I could do for them, like get ride of these ridiculous reservation. I have heard that some of them live in trailer homes, how about giving them real houses, better schools etc.

[–] Eveningstarz_4 14 years ago

Yeah...what's really sad and frightening is most of the sexual assault/rape cases take place on reservations. People just don't report them because 1) possibility of revenge from the family of the offender, 2) when they do report it, it takes FOREVER because it's "not a priority", 3) reservations have their own police, but the size of the force is so small that they simply can't reach everyone who calls, and even then it's usually too late to do anything.

*NOTE* I got all the above info from a TV special/documentary that took place at one particular reservation. I know that not all reservations are the same, but at the same time I know that what was said on the documentary couldn't have been made up.

[–] red_rackham_77 14 years ago

Good God! That is just messed up, makes you wonder what this country would have been like if there weren't any white paranoid men and women in the past that didn't cause trouble toward the indians.

[–] Eveningstarz_4 14 years ago

Have you seen the mini-series 'Into the West"? You can probably get it on DVD...it's twice as long as "True Woman" but it goes into detail about how the Westward Expansion affected the Natives, from the time of the mountain men and Jedediah Smith all the way through Wounded Knee. I can think of three main reasons based on what was shown in "Into the West" as to why things happened the way they did.

1.) GREED.

2.) LACK OF COMMUNICATION. Not only did the whites not take the time to sit down and get to know the Natives, they hired just anyone that happened to know the language to translate for them, and the "translators" would translate falsely. The scene I'm thinking of is when a cow wandered into a village and disrupted the Natives' homes. A few officers arrived with a drunken "translator" and asked for the cow back. The chief either offered to trade or had sent some men back to the fort with the cow(I can't remember which) and the "translator" lied about what was said. This caused an unnecessary attack.

3.) STEREOTYPING. Also goes along with lack of communication. Based on rumors, stories, lies, and so-called "reporters" making up stories to make the Natives look bad, most people probably felt that once you saw one, you've seen them all. But as Black Kettle said on Into the West, "there are bad Indians, and there are bad white men..." But people didn't stop to think about that.

4.) "JUST FOLLOWING ORDERS". Ok I know I said three but this one's important too. One real-life officer was quoted as to saying something to the effect of "These men were hired[into the army] to kill Indians. I need to keep them busy."

I know that everything happens for a reason and we shouldn't change history, because who knows what would happen to the present if we did, but if there's one thing I wish were different, it would be what happened to the Natives. It's just heartbreaking.

[–] red_rackham_77 14 years ago

Yes I have seen that entire series, it did all right but I look at it now and did my own research on Native American history and the series didn't tell the entire story. They just skip a few things and jumped ahead of thing and plus there were characters I wish I could have heard and seen what happen to them.

One particular is the story of Naomi, she her husband was killed by the Cheyenne then she came to love the chief there and had his child. There should have been the bad side to the stories of the Indian captives as well as the good ones too.

But everything you listed there are all very true and I still love watching it, it shows all of our history and it reminds us of our flaws the worst of it is that it can't be fixed or undone.

[–] Eveningstarz_4 14 years ago

Yeah I plan to go to college next year and major in history. One of the courses I plan to take is Native American history.

"True Women" gave a good perspective on that bad side you mentioned, and I'm reading a book called "In the Hands of the Senecas". While I don't know if the book is based on true stories, it follows each member of a group of captives as they go separate ways. So far, one was taken to Niagara Falls to be sold or traded, one became married to her captive, and one became a slave that was beaten over and over again for over a year, until she finally escaped.

But yeah between the two, "Into the West" is my favorite. I've gotten it out of the library three times now, but I hope to own it someday so I don't have to rush to finish it before the week is up! Probably my favorite scene in "True Women" is when Pheomi gives her horse to Tarantula. I always tear up!

[–] red_rackham_77 14 years ago

In the Hands of the Senecas? I gotta check that out so far I have just finished the story of Cynthia Ann Parker (why hasn't there been a film made about her by now?) I am now reading one called The Captured by Scott Zesch.

[–] Eveningstarz_4 14 years ago

Hmm...haven't heard of either of those two...I'll have to check at the library!

[–] red_rackham_77 14 years ago

You never heard of Cynthia Ann Parker? Oh she was a real person that was taken by the Commanche and lived with them for 20 years, she has been married to the chief Peta Nocona. They had had three children one of which was Quanah Parker who then became a Commanche chief like his father. Here is the funny thing, Cynthia was "Kidnapped" by Texan Rangers during a raid and was brought back to her family but she never reconnected with them and she longed to return to her Commanche family.

You will love reading about her, well love isn't the word but just as fascinated as I was when I first heard of her and started reading about her.

[–] Eveningstarz_4 14 years ago

Oh that does sound interesting! What's the exact title so I can check for/request it at the library?

[–] red_rackham_77 14 years ago

There is the book titled; Cynthia Ann Parker: The Life and the Legend by Margaret Schmidt Hacker then there is Where the Broken Heart Still Beats: The Story of Cynthia Ann Parker by Carolyn Meyer. Just type down Cynthia Ann Parker and it should show a list of books of her, I am still wondering why her story hasn't been made into a film whether in a TV miniseries or a tv program or theater movie.

[–] Eveningstarz_4 14 years ago

Ok thank you! I will definitely check it out! But yeah it does sound like movie material! The only thing is would the filmmakers stick to the facts?

[–] red_rackham_77 14 years ago

I know! It ticks me off when they never stick to the facts, I think it should be made into something for Showtime or HBO.

[–] Eveningstarz_4 14 years ago

Yeah...my library didn't have either of those books, so I had to request them. Hopefully they'll get them soon, despite the huge expansion project that's going on now!

[–] red_rackham_77 14 years ago

I recommend that you buy them from used books online sale, they are usually like cent coast to like a dollar coast.

[–] Eveningstarz_4 14 years ago

Ok I'll check that out!

[–] red_rackham_77 14 years ago

Good luck if you need help finding good price deals let me know and I will send them to you.

Meanwhile what do you think of Rose Byrne as Cynthia Ann Parker?

[–] noblesse_oblige 13 years ago

RIDE THE WIND is a great fictional account of Cynthia Ann Parker's life. It's by Lucia St. Clair Robson. SO entertaining; I highly recommend it. Look it up on Amazon, it's pretty readily available.

[–] red_rackham_77 13 years ago

Thanks, I will look into that.

[–] tallard 13 years ago

I'm in a similar situation, Newfoundland born with Acadian ancestry, probably some Mig'mah and residual Beothuk. I can take no pride in Newfie colonialism, it was harsh. My mom traced roots back to ships from Europe 7 generations ago, but records are conflicting due to illiteracy, bad bible notes, burnt churches, and multiple similarly named gravestones. My only hope at gaining insight into my ancestry is to participate in the Human Genome project. Unfortunately, though they've made huge headway for European populations, evidence for North American First Nations is still too under represented to reach solid conclusions. So I'll wait a couple of years. Hopefully their database of full blood genomes (or at least majority) will attain critical mass in the near future.
I also side against colonialism, it's a disappointing human trait, which we seem keen on repeating over and over again.

***So I've seen 4 movies/wk in theatre for a 1/4 century, call me crazy?**