MovieChat Forums > Kama Sutra: A Tale of Love (1997) Discussion > Whose morality?

Whose morality?

posted 18 years ago by free_verse_1
20 replies | jump to latest

Comparing the society depicted in the movie with what exists today in the indian subcontinent, one cant help be amazed at the stark irony of it all. Centuries of invasions imposing islamic and victorian values as well as the self-righteous brigade of hindutva leaders redifining 'culture' for ALL and the ceaseless moral policing by persons in position of authority have presented us with the prospect of a hollow, meaningless society where sex and love are taboo and the only way to become 'sexually liberated' is to ape the west. hard to believe that this is the Land of the Kamasutra, where love-making was once an art that sages thought was important enough to be written about in detail great books, not what it has become now - something to hide, curb, curtail and be embarrased about!
Any comments?

[–] jdfrye 17 years ago

Wow. Well spoken. What could the world be like if love-making were less taboo, and killing more so?

[–] johnc72985 17 years ago

I prefer Western Culture personally.

The impact its made on the world is imense, from the Greeks to the Romans to Today.

On top of the fact, that in India, the Caste System has halted the lower class from living a better life, with hospitals and schools being subpar, because the Caste system is meant to the keep the poor poor, and the rich rich.

You don't have to have sex to express love. Sex is a beautiful thing, but not wreckless promiscuity. But I personally believing that doing things like helping the poor and providing good health care are expressions of love.

[–] rogerscorpion 17 years ago

I agree with you about love, John. You're a sensitive individual, but 'immense' doesn't necessarily mean good. Hitler had a rather immense impact--after all.
About the Caste system--it seems to be migrating over here, while a burgeoning middle class is developing in India--both due to outsourcing of jobs to India. India now has our middle class--or on it's way.
I hope we'll be showing some of that love to all Americans, with good health care, in the next few years.
I have to agree w/JD, tho, in that I'd rather see rampant sex than rampant violence in our society.

Carpe Noctem

[–] La_Esmeralda 17 years ago

I prefer a Western culture too.

It's so true. I mean, whenever a discussion on eastern civilisation surfaces, I am always reminded that there can be no doubt that the western culture will always be supremely more useful than its eastern counterpart. After all, the western world is older, more literate, more suffused with the beautiful arts. Far more survives of it.

And after all, look at what the kama sutra encourages - pleasure is almost (if not entirely) synonymous with promiscuity. Really if you think about it, eastern culture is responsible for aids. And sex? Don't even get me started. Why have it unless it's strictly necessary?

Thank goodness that in places like Britain there is no caste system. We don't dream of differentiating between brahmin and untouchable. Our carefully structured class system ensures a fairer society for all. Or think of our American friends, who live and breathe a true equality and freedom - such is my ideal of love.

Oh johnc72985, I really find myself agreeing with your every word. How could an eastern culture ever think to compare itself? What have they ever given us? I shall go join the BNP today and spread the word! Or I hear UKIP are still hiring..

[–] oldbozo05 17 years ago

I so agree with all of you, us western culture don't have aristocrates, middle class and the lower class. And women are treated with great respect, there are also no arrange marriage as we western culture respect LOVE unlike those eastern countries, But we are noble, we didn't invade these countires, walking in their land and treating the local people like dirt. We certainly did NOT destroy/ruined these eastern world's monument, and looting the dead's grave in the name of archeology. Slavery?? what is that??

I LOVE THE WEST no offecne eastern world

[–] random_randomest_randome 17 years ago

Wow, well, I'm going to feel really bad for bursting your bubble.

But whilst all you guys are on a high about Western culture just there, you do realise that India was once part of the British empire? We went in there, occupied it for nearly a century, created a rift between the Muslims and Hindu's and caused the, factually largest, mass migration of people ever through the partition. India split to make Pakistan. And hundreds of thousands were killed. And the English, us, we js pissed off basically, leaving them to their own turmoil.
But ya know. Not saying that makes western culture crap...just merely saying that you guys really need to stop putting us on a pedestal!

Plus, admittedly, western culture is thriving now, very much so. But centuries ago eastern cultures were much more advanced than us, and a very philosphical species. The Mughal Empire, an Islamic class, reigned a substantially large amount of territory and was travelling far. And at its beginning, it was known for being open minded to other religions (which was unusual in those times) and encouraging friendly debates amongst the religions (mainly Islam, Hinduism and Sikhism in the region). Comparitavely to Western society at the time which was struggling through the differences of Catholicism and Christianity, forming wars.
And the east really made an art out of architectural and sculpted pieces. The Taj Mahal has become an architectural icon across the world, which was commissioned by the Mughal Empire.

Really, I think you can't really put one side on a pedestal and disregard the other. I've studied quite alot of history so I could probably go on for a lifetime...but can't really be bothered. The west has adopted plenty of eastern values though, and I don't believe either sects would be anywhere near the same without the other.

The east has contributed to society phenomenally in areas of the arts.
Whereas the west has contributed society in a more technical area.

Clearly, there is quite alot of degeneration consuming the east, or more rather just a halt occuring. And the west is doing well now. But just give it another few centuries and there'll be people on super computers saying 'hey, the west has never done anything for us...'

Sorry if I just bored anyone to death lol.

[–] hnessling 17 years ago

I think you'll find they were being sarcastic...

[–] random_randomest_randome 17 years ago

Haha...

I just noticed...

[–] batistuta47 17 years ago

Blaming Britain for the India/Pakistan split is a hollow argument. Britain did plenty of things to get blamed for in India, but they're hardly responsible for that one.

[–] mosquito86 17 years ago

I can't say they are "hardly responsible" for what happened during Partition. They did play a major factor in why and how the country was split. They just weren't the only factor. but don't say something as "hollow" as "they're hardly responsible."

[–] IAmGisele 10 years ago

[–] ohitsjustavi 17 years ago

I can understand the idea of sex and love being taboo, but kamasutra is not art. I do agree that topics like that should be more openly discussed. There is no greater meaning in watching two OR MORE people having sex.

People who say "OH I EXPRESS MYSELF THROUGH SEX" are nothing but sexaholics or sluts or manwhores or whatever you wanna call them.

If you can explain me what is the higher meaning (other than pleasure) in watching a book full of naked women n men having sex, then I will rest my case.

[–] simian_ninja 17 years ago

I don't know about that, I (and I know others do as well) find the human body to be a piece of art. We are all the same in terms of the body parts that the different sexes have and yet we are so different, each beautiful and unique to itself.

I've never heard people say that they express themselves through sex, and love is certainly not and should never be a taboo subject, it's one of the one things that can help bring this world closer and help bind us together which is something that is definitely needed in the world.

There is a higher meaning in viewing books of naked women and men and that is appreciation for what God has given us. Sure some people get perverse kicks out of it, but I don't think there's anything wrong with that unless there is a certain damage that comes out of it.

The Kamasutra is something that is specifically created for the pleasure between a man and a woman (I know it was meant for a husband and wife), but as long as they are two consenting adults - then what does it really matter?

There can be meaning in watching two people getting it on (as well as reading and discussing). Lots of couples use pornography in order to spice of up their sex lives and too learn a new trick or two. Nothing wrong with that.

Personally, I think the Kamasutra is one of the greatest works to ever come out of India.

The human body is an art form, sex is an art form. So many different ways to achieve one goal!

That's just my two cents.

[–] kitha22 17 years ago

As a North American I find India and her religions and customs to be fascinating. I hate that it has its down sides with castes and such, but there is so much beauty there. I am always disappointed when I get this barrage of Indian men wanting sex from me when I know there is SO much more to the culture and country. Many Indian men are very attractive, such as the man that played Krishna in the Mahabarat, but I'm too scared of being mauled to ever take an Indian man seriously! I love Bollywood films, the clothes, the jewelry, the music, the people, the spices, the creativity, the beauty, and much more, but I could live without the men diving in like I'm a pool of sex. It never occurs to them that even though I am a North American woman, that sex is not happening until I marry. I guess that's true all over the world though.

Holding a grudge is like taking poison and waiting for the other person to die.

[–] 17 years ago

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[–] MissCutiePie 16 years ago

Is the caste system still a formal institution of division and discrimination in India? I thought the fact that India is growing more and more as a 'Democracy' that the caste system was dwindling away to almost non-existence? Also, it appears to me that India has its share of ethnic/racial discrimination with people seeing lighter skinned women more prettier than darker skinned women? Actresses who are naturally dark, being extremely lighten in movies. And young ladies who admire certain actresses attempting to lighten their skin by endlessly applying bleaching agents, etc. It's sad and disgusting all at the same time.

[–] enygma_kitty2003 16 years ago

I think it's funny that all people ever think of as the Kama Sutra is a book with pictures of sexual positions. The actual Kama Sutra has words. It was a book with lessons intended to be taught to young women on how to be a dutiful wife. It was supposed to prepare them for marriage so that they could be the "perfect" wife and cater to their husbands' every whim and pleasure. I've flipped through a copy of the Kama Sutra and, though some stuff seemed a bit outdated for modern society, many of the lessons in there, if followed by both men and women, could vastly improve relationships today. What with the ever growing divorce rate, maybe the Kama Sutra should be a required class prior to marriage.

[–] 16 years ago

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[–] takiko-1 15 years ago

> What with the ever growing divorce rate, maybe the Kama Sutra should be a required class prior to marriage. <

Although I've heard Dr. Phil (no, I don't regularly watch his or Oprah's show) mention that the top 2 things that husbands and wives argue about is sex and money, there are still issues that can't be fixed just in the bedroom. Even if the book has advice beyond that area of the marriage, most people have just considered it a sex book (if it isn't "the" sex book).

There is this recently released documentary, 'How to Divorce and Not Wreck the Kids', and the reasons for divorce aren't about sex, although it may be about money.

I heard this woman even changing the wording for some positions of yoga because as a Christian she didn't like how there was a sense of worshipping another God. I wonder if she would be nervous even being seen with the kama sutra since not only is it generally a "sex book", but it's from India and probably doesn't see God from The Bible as being the only god to worship. I could be taking it too far with that second sentence though.

[–] 15 years ago

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