MovieChat Forums > Jingle All the Way (1996) Discussion > The REAL villain here is......

The REAL villain here is......

posted 7 years ago by dbwhite6450
15 replies | jump to latest

...........Liz!

Ok, ok, thats obviously too strong of a word but I was trying to get you to bite, but here me out.

Clearly, this whole thing with Howard being a workaholic and absent at home a lot is not a new thing. It has been going on for a while. Liz knows this. And yet, she assigns him to secure the top christmas present for the year? Really? And then on top of that, she doesn't follow up with him until late at night on Dec. 23?

Look, she is far from the worst character on this show. Ted is a revolting person. Myron is a putz. Howard is a loser. But my gosh she screwed up big time on this one and never gets called out on it!

[–] strntz 7 years ago

I LOVE MYRON !!!!! Sounds like his father wasn't very attentive to him so I'm giving him a pass.

You're right about Liz not following up on the 23rd given Howard's history, but since she did all the other Christmas shopping anyway, having Howard pick up the doll wasn't asking too much, particularly since she gave him several weeks or more. The fact that even scumbag Ted picked up the doll and kept it safely nestled under his tree proves that asking Howard to pick up the doll wasn't asking too much.

Is Howard a bad father? Absolutely not, but he certainly could have been better with very little more effort.

Is very bad to steal Jobu's rum. Is very bad.

[–] dodgethat 7 years ago

you dont know how often liz could've been reminding him about the D-O-L-L though. for all we know she couldve been been telling him once a night every week?

howard is the bad guy in this movie noway around it

[–] strntz 7 years ago

you dont know how often liz could've been reminding him about the D-O-L-L though. for all we know she couldve been been telling him once a night every week?

We don't know for sure, but from what she said to Howard, I think she told him once and did not remind him. When Howard was telling Liz how he and Chaymee were getting along great and talking about Turboman (after Howard missed the Karate exposition), Liz suddenly told Howard that she hoped that he picked up the doll and that she told him to do so weeks ago. If she had been reminding him since, she wouldn't have worded it that way.

If she had been reminding him every day, that would mean that he hadn't yet gotten it and Liz would have gotten it herself.

Admittedly, she knew that this was Jaimie's big want for Christmas and should have gotten it herself or reminded Howard several times until he did.

Is very bad to steal Jobu's rum. Is very bad.

[–] ThreeMississippi 7 years ago

All we know was that Howard said he would pick it up and then did not. Maybe he offered to and with everything else she forgot to follow up with him it happens. He reminded her about it talking to her about him and Jamie bonding over turbo man.

[–] Purplecover101 7 years ago

To me, it's TED.

He tried to win Liz over by trying to get under her pants!! To me, every generous thing he ever did was to show off and impress the numerous women in the neighborhood!

No dad would go out of his way to give his son a reindeer! (Turboman yes! But not a wild animal). That's a crazy gift since that deer was wild. It doesn't belong in a human household.

[–] motter25420-153-699254 7 years ago

Forget about reminding him, why didn't she just go get one for Pete's sake, he's working, she's......getting hit on by the neighbor.

[–] stephaniiehallberg 7 years ago

Actually. The real villain here is... Noone.
Why? All have great motivations for being like they are.

Is Howard to eccentric is finding a plastic doll?
No, He wants his son to love him again, like when he got him a clubhouse.

Is Myron over the top crazy?
Yes of-course, The last 15min when he chases a boy on roof has no excuses. but he thinks the reason he didn't reach a higher job was because missing a plastic doll. And Howard and Myron represent the effort a Dad would go through to help his son.. kinda charming in a spooky way.

Is Liz to sloppy?
I think Liz is a really good character. Does she ever screams at Howard? Does she ever betray Howard with Ted? The reason I like Liz especially is the car scene when Ted was trying to flirt with her.. but when actions rather then words comes out. She just nail him hard and leaves. She doesn't run away.. She isn't calling a friend to talk about. No. She stays with her son as Him and Howard is her loves in life. You heard the word.. Independent Woman.. Liz is a perfect example of that.

Is Ted a horny old guy?
Well, yes, But he is divorced and helping out in the neighborhood like a handyman he gets attention of the other wife's there. He is also divorced with his son Johnny.. and really wants to get into a relationship again.. so he does crazy things.

Even the Mafioso Santas has explainable reason for their actions.

Its called "Narrative exposition". It is the insertion of important background information within a story.

Something a HELL of lots of movies Lately seems to forget.. totally.

[–] motter25420-153-699254 7 years ago

So you think if someone hits on you whacking them in the head is the proper response rather than just telling them you are not interested?

You have a strange notion of what an "independent woman" should be.

[–] strntz 7 years ago

Ted got off easy...

My wife loves to flirt with the best of them, but if someone made an unwanted move on her like Ted did to Liz, he'd be speaking as a contralto for several days.

Is very bad to steal Jobu's rum. Is very bad.

[–] motter25420-153-699254 7 years ago

Yeah, real funny, that's called assault. You don't have the right to physically harm someone just for flirting with you, a woman kissed me once on New Years and I didn't want her to, so should I have clocked a good one? Guess you're another beta eh?

[–] strntz (10816) 6 years ago

Yeah, real funny, that's called assault.

Well, in today's "enlightened" reality, what Ted did was a rape. Political correctness aside, Ted did corner Liz and put his hands on her. A little eggnog delivered via thermos is hardly an "assault" to a guy that tried to bed the wife of a friend IMO. And how far would have Ted have gone if he didn't get Thermosly nogged?

Me a beta? Hardly. "Secure" is a far more accurate description. If my wife told me that happened to her I'd laugh and pat her on the back. But I have to also say that if anyone hurt or tried to hurt my wife or kids, nothing on this earth would prevent me from delivering retribution in any manner in my power. And I actually mean "hurt", not flirting or saying something suggestive. I'm sure most men are the same way, and I'll give you the benefit of the doubt as well..

[–] Effie21 (105) 5 years ago

I agree with this. Liz drove me nuts with her harping on Howard for working too much, but certainly seemed to love the lifestyle he was able to provide for her. How does she think the fancy house and expensive SUV got paid for? By magic? Maybe she should have gotten a damn job so Howard wouldn't have had to work so much. Very irritating character, imo.

[–] strntz (10816) 5 years ago

A person can work very hard, provide a very comfortable lifestyle for his family, and *still* not be neglectful to his son. All Liz asked for was for Howard to do a couple of things for their son: show up at the karate tournament to see him get his belt and pick up the Turtleman doll, which he could have done on any day off he had weeks beforehand.

Howard was a good guy, a good dad, and a good provider, but he was neglecting his fatherly duties, and he knew it.

[–] Effie21 (105) 5 years ago

Not in this day and age, unfortunately. If one wants to live a lifestyle such as the one Liz and Howard enjoyed in this movie, that means working your ass off, which doesn't leave much time for anything else. I also can't understand why Liz just didn't buy the damn doll herself. It's not like she had a job to go to, or anything else to do all day long. Seems ridiculous to me.

[–] [deleted] 4 years ago

The REAL villain here is......consumerism