MovieChat Forums > La Haine (1995) Discussion > Remember, these are the kind of guys who...

Remember, these are the kind of guys who now fight for ISIL.

I very seldom address politics on IMDB, but this is the time for one because it is gets to the heart to the subject of this film.

Daesh, Islamic State, ISIS, or whatever you want to call it that organization, attracts sympathizers from the kind of people that you see in this film.

If these characters were alive and around today, they'd be little different than the people who support or sympathize with these suicide bombers and mass shooters. France couldn't ever assimilate these people and never effectively tried to, so they turn angry towards a society that they can't understand. They think that the country is a conspiracy against them when, really, they just don't fit because they have no education and a third world state of mind. The ideas and values they have learned from their parents are totally contradictory to the society in which they live, so naturally they see society as evil. Police harass them because, statistically speaking, they are the group of people most likely to commit gang related and property crimes because they have no recourse to any real employment. At least, they can't really advance in society. France has been noted to be different from Britain for instance, due to the fact that you often see minority business owners and executives the UK, but very seldom in France.

I never bought the part about Vincent Cassel's character being Jewish. Jewish people in France suffer a lot of anti-Semitic attacks from arabs and moslems living in the country. There has been something of a wave of emigration from France to Israel and elsewhere because of this. Jewish cemeteries are attacked and vandalized. The venue where The Eagles of Death Metal were playing in Paris (they were the band whose fans were massacred) was once owned by jews and hosted jewish functions before it was sold. It is speculated that the shooters didn't know this when they planned the attack. I think that the director of the film was jewish and so he wanted to show solidarity with the underprivileged or something. Either that, or he wanted to divert the viewers' eyes from the fact that these tenements are almost entirely populated by moslems. Moslems definitely make up the street gangs that infest the Parisian housing projects.

I've got no problem with not wanting to encourage racism, but please be realistic. A solitary jewish kid in these projects would get his butt kicked every day until he left. Maybe I'm wrong and there is one jewish person out there somewhere in one of these tenements, but it sure can't be very many. The antisemitic and antisocial currents are too strong in that subculture.

I stayed in Germany for a time some years ago, and I saw some of these same problems featured in La Haine with Turkish guest workers there. The Germans don't fully accept them, and the Turks don't want to assimilate. This has been going on for over thirty years now. In thirty plus years, negative attitudes have not changed but instead have become further entrenched.

Angela Merkel had rocks in her head when she publicly invited hundreds of thousands of people to trample across the nations of Europe and show up at the door. She stared these problems in the face for all of her political life and, like a sane person, she decided to throw gasoline on the fire. Those refugees should have been interviewed by German consular officers in their country of origin (or, at least, in the region) on a case by case basis before they were admitted. Then they could have been settled and provided for in an orderly manner. Now Europe has a humanitarian crisis on its hands. Merkel's public announcement was a totally irresponsible political move. She knew that there would be trouble on multiple levels before she made that announcement, and she chose to grandstand and encourage chaos.


I made a similar comment on the thread "Similar movies that are better".

I suggest remaking La Haine with three Muslim youths some of whom are drawn to ISIL. Those banlieue projects are prime recruiting grounds.


I agree. I think this film would have done much better to show the ideological contrast between french society and islamic philosophy. Secularism and gender equality are contrary to popular islamic thought, or at least to the kind of people who come into the banlieus. The Moslem kids in these projects think that French society is evil because it is in direct contrast to the values of their parents and their religion.

Of course, it doesn't help that many Moslem religious leaders encourage this idea because they are afraid of losing their own influence within islamic society. The more secular people become, the less they listen to religious leaders naturally. I remember going to a local college campus and seeing this stuff on the search history. You could click on the preloaded links to all these radical Islamic websites that you couldn't see if you typed in the URL. It was extremely creepy. I think that NSA surveilance and screening did away with a lot of this stuff, but I'm sure that it's still out there a decade or so after the fact.

I think that a lot of people who were raised listening to punk rock and going to protests see something other than what is actually going on. They want to see some kind of repeat of the movements of the 1960s and 1970s, but this Moslem immigrant unrest is a totally different phenomenon. It's not some kind of class struggle, but just a conflict between people who just can't find common ground. There is almost nothing that French suburban kids have in common with peasant kids from hills of the Atlas Mountains or the Anti-Lebanon. These differences persist into adult life, and it leads to lifetime antagonism. Yes, there are exceptions and nobody wants to tell somebody to leave (except for maybe a few radicals). However, don't expect a whole lot of harmony and understanding between these groups.

I think that including a Jewish gang member was a way for the director to deflect racism or an inadvertant anti-immigrant message. I think he wanted to make the film look a little "punk rock" and anti-establishment, because maybe that is how he sees the world or that is how he wants to communicate the situation of the film with his own peers. American directors do the same thing all the time. However, that's just not what reality is. You really are dealing with a third world, medieval mentality here that just can't wrap its head around the realities of twentieth century France. You are also dealing with people who have no skills, knowledge, or insight that is relevant to the industrialized world. They are going to be alienated. The film misses this point entirely.


Isnt Four Lions basically this but in UK?


From your comment, it's pretty clear that you'r coming from a certain side politically, but of course you're free to comment anyway. I agree with you that the aspect of a Jewish kid being part of this French underclass seems off, but truthfully, I don't know too much about the French banlieues and their demographic composition to say whether that is accurate or not. The situation with people from a migrant background living in Europe is a lot more complex - most people from Turkish origin in Germany live there peacefully and contribute to society, if they would suddenly disappear, the system would immediately collapse. And it's very controversial to say that Merkel alone caused the current migrant situation, as most experts would agree there were a lot more factors playing into the current influx of people.


"but truthfully, I don't know too much about the French banlieues and their demographic composition to say whether that is accurate or not."

Then it's best not to say anything about it at all...


I can see from this post why you seldom address politics on IMDb because you are not very good at the task.

Your entire post is a cold, controlled form of fascistic thinking that imposes itself and inserts its malign thoughts as the truths into people you probably do not know in any personal way. Please note how I am describing fascist thought because I suspect such a word might causes blinkers to be fastened and adjusted so tightly it's impossible to see only the straight and very narrow.

Your post is the flip side of the same coin as daesh. It is cut from the same mould and it achieves nothing but spewing bile.

In the midst of winter, I found there was, within me, an invincible summer


And your post is... You really didn't say anything worthwhile.

-------Gå på disco rulla hatt, med SunTrip varje natt-------


He's right, though.


Since when is insanity right?


Worse, he's the one spewing bile.


I think that's an unfair statement. Sure, more people from segregated areas join Daesh (because they feel betrayed by their own country because of the misfortune they suffer because of un unjust goverment) but it's still a minority that does, I don't think it's likely that these characters will, especially Hubert who was trying to get away from the chaos where he lived. They are victims of circumstance which is one of the main themes in this film.

i very much dont agree with your theory that immigrants don't want to assimilate because that's just not true! I think segregation is entirely the goverments fault along with racism, islamophobia etc.

"France couldn't ever assimilate these people and never effectively tried to"

You're right about the "never effectively tried to" part but it's not at all impossible to assimilate the "these people". The film adressess the issue, and if you think it's the unprivileged's fault that they're not assimilated in the french society you're wrong and missed a lot when watching this.

Also, I can't really say much about the "Jewish people in France suffer a lot of anti-Semitic attacks from arabs and muslims living in the country" comment, because i dont know that much about the situation in France specifically, but I am from another european country. I think it makes a difference when he is a jewish kid in a very multicultural neighberhood. I think they feel togetherness because of their exclusion and socioeconomic status. The characters in this film are also just regular teens, just because the culturally belong to a certain religion doesn't make them extremist who'll attack someone just cause they think differently lol.

I also know that the amount of attacks against muslims and jews from white people are incredibly unrecorded, in france specifically as well! It's not been this bad for a long time, especially after Charlie hebdo and with all the islamophobia around these days. More muslims were killed/hurt as a result after the charlie hebdo incident than journalist killed during that attack, but that doesn't make headlines:( it's so unreported, it's sad how much the priviliged control the image of the ones who don't fulfill their ideals.


What a refreshing comment you wrote.
I am so glad that people like you still exist.
The OP and some of the repliers represent the damaged ones with whom we unfortunately deal nowadays.


Talk about racial stereotyping.


I wish you're sinking in your own disgusting shit.. You piece of crap!