MovieChat Forums > Crumb (1995) Discussion > Charles

Charles

posted 14 years ago by kgb383
10 replies | jump to latest

Charles is the most affecting part of this whole movie. He was an amazing person; very intelligent, witty, charming, and funny. He also seemed to be the most talented of the 3 brothers. He basically got Robert going with comics. It's heartbreaking to me that he never got the chance to realize his potential.

I often think what might have become of the man, had he not been so crippled with his mental disturbances. He might have been a great artist or perhaps a prominent thinker and intellectual. He certainly seemed to have the capacity for either. His is a portrait of a life derailed. I don't know if he had some disorder like Asperger's or schizophrenia, as some have suggested. I do think they were all of them - Charles, Robert, and Max - terribly damaged by the severe abuse they received from their parents, who were obviously quite cruel and neglectful toward them.

The children all bore the brunt of physical and mental abuse, the result being their skewed perspectives of themselves and the world around them. It says a lot of the 3 brothers profiled here that Robert seems to have fared the best from that experience. Considering how completely warped and emotionally crippled Robert is, one can only speculate about the terrible demons Charles must have been attempting to medicate away up until his unfortunate passing. Frankly, I suspect Robert might have lived a life quite similar to Charles, had he not been fortunate enough to encounter so many strong women willing to hold him up and support him throughout his life.

I identify with Charles and his plight. I too had an abusive and neglectful parent, which damaged me in ways similar to Charles and Robert. I also contend with problems similar to those of these 3 men; it's a constant, everyday battle to overcome one's own malfunctioning mind. I try to think about Charles whenever I am dealing with something related to that struggle. He's become an inspiration to me; not because of his troubled life or his unfortunate end, but because of who he was in spite of all that. There was a real person of substance and worth there under all that pain and disorder. I am grateful that Mr. Zwigoff and the rest of those involved in this production were able, if only for a brief few moments on film, to capture that part of Charles for the world to see.

[–] italdesign1976 11 years ago

Well said. It's sad, but there are countless talented people like Charles who never realize their potential due to particular circumstances.

My top movies:
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[–] nicklikesmovies 10 years ago

Charles was definitely the most fascinating aspect of this movie, which itself is completely filled with fascinating things. I can relate to him in a lot of ways, too. That said, I kind of feel like he really milked the victim thing too much. He was abused and bullied when younger. So is a huge chunk (majority?) of the human race. He never got over his bad childhood, and deemed himself unfit to work and live a real life despite being a gifted, talented, and intelligent person. It kind of seems narcissistic and a spit in the face to people who have experienced truly traumatic stuff (watching a family member (or your entire family) get killed at a young age, being raped, being born into slavery at a shoe factory, having to live in the middle of a warzone, etc) and chose to go on with their lives. His dad physically abused him and he was bullied in high school. Hardly seems like an understandable reason to give up on life and feel sorry for yourself to no end as though you were given the worse hand in life imaginable.

[–] estocade 8 years ago

Charles made a great impact on me, I really can't be bothered with Robert, yet although things he says are acidic and childish, not once he said something that isn't true. Charles on the other had was far more eloquent while being open. This documentary made me genuinely afraid, at lest for a while. I too was an amateur cartoonist as a kid, and my family too was partly dysfunctional, and poor, which made me depressed later on.

Hard to rationalize against Charles' decision of "getting off".

[–] usernamegoatse 8 years ago

I get paid to draw and design. I was abused physically and emotionally growing up. I also harbor sexually deviant thoughts that I have to hide. Charles didn't have it much worse than me, if at all. He was smarter too and could have lived a life outside of that self-imprisonment garbage. If he were a millennial he would seem like even more of a baby and would probably be a Creed fan. Yeah, he was well read, but his attitude was nothing but white wine.

[–] estocade 8 years ago

I agree. He was well read but certain wisdom comes from certain actions, and his only action was reading old novels and locking himself up from the outside world. Little can be gained from such an existence. Also, once you get hooked on psychotropics it's nearly impossible to come down from it, so that wasn't the best decision.

Of course I'm not judging him, humans are weak, they desire and they pay, sometimes with their own lives, sometimes with the lives of others. He was a casualty like many others.

[–] usernamegoatse 8 years ago

We are all the accumulation of our actions and events that occur to us. Was his bullying by his father and classmates unfortunate? Yes. But domestic abuse and bullying is VERY common and Charles had every advantage to have as much of a career as Robert. I find him fascinating for the life he chose, and the only reason my heart goes out to him is because he controlled his actions and never abused a child, which is commendable, but the whole persecution complex thing is garbage. He would have been fine out in the real world. Smart enough to hide his thoughts and get a job drawing at a desk. NO excuse there, so no sympathy from me.

After a certain point, he isn't a victim and should be seen as being responsible for his own actions and he did CHOOSE that life of living at home reading books and it is an easy one. I also started taking medication at a young age (ritalin in grade school snowballing into antipsychotics in highschool) and have noticed it has inhibited my ability to feel emotion. And, believe it or not, my genitals and ability to orgasm are in shambles as well. But I am also talented, caucasian and have (like Charles) inherited a trust fund from my dead, abusive father, so I don't expect much sympathy, which is reasonable. I have an easy life while most people have to deal with the constant abuse of racism, bigotry, sexism, rape, domestic abuse, etc as adults. My life of doing freelance graphics in a neckbeard room in my neckbeard apartment with action figures decorating my desk is not difficult, so Charles' cross-bearing white whine attitude rubs me the wrong way TBH. I experienced abuse and came from a dysfunctional family but I have to live with what's left of myself and move forward, as staying at my parent's place isn't an option.

[–] estocade 8 years ago

Yea, leaving my smothering psycho mother's home and finding my own place was the best decision I ever made as an individual. His mother with their family house gave him too much security for his own good, and not to mention outdated memories. Too many times I thought to myself "this is it, this is how I will think from now on" and the next day or the other time my mindset changed as new experiences were acquired. He denied himself the opportunity to change and expand, what an unfortunate set of events.

[–] usernamegoatse 8 years ago

Unfortunate, yeah. Maybe not too tragic though IMO. Charles wasn't a jerk but he was so delusional about thinking he would be a target simply for having pedophilloic thoughts. Nobody can read anyone's mind. Nobody would know. It's not like pedophiles can be spotted without you knowing them beforehand. Nobody has a sex offender or pedophile "aura" or anything. What I'm most fascinated with is how, and someone else in another thread mentioned this too, how he was so abused by his father but chose to never leave home. I'll never understand that. It's as mysterious to me as why his mother destroyed his artwork after he died. Why would he stay? On the crumb criterion special features, Robert even mentioned offering to put him up in a place with him and another friend and Charles refused. What drew him to stay in that house for his entire life? TBH I don't think it was mental illness (he seemed more than enough smart and functional), pedophillic thoughts (he had too much heart to act out and couldv'e easily gone through life keeping it a secret), or medication (he said he was on heavy tranquilizers but was more intellectually and emotionally present then many idiot americans - medicated or not - who have jobs). So strange.

[–] estocade 8 years ago

Strange indeed, I guess we had to walk a day in his shoes to know the reasons.

[–] 8 years ago

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