wonderful love scene


This is a wonderful film, one of my favourites. And the moment when Joy and Jack are in jack´s bedroom for the first time after she leaves the hospital is the best love scene I have ever seen in a movie. what do you think?

I will write in spanish, sorry but my english is not very good

La escena en la que Jack y Joy están juntos en el dormitorio por primera vez es sencillamente genial. Él se muestra dubitativo y comienza a contar su ritual al acostarse, cómo se pone el pijama, reza sus oraciones, etc y ella le contesta: "Quiero verlo. Haz todo como lo haces siempre y cuando llegues al final yo estaré allí. Eso es lo que hay que hacer" Insuperable. Uno de los mejores momentos que me ha regalado el cine, en la que es probablemente mi película preferida.

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I have to agree: I love that scene. For one thing it’s so untypical for a movie. Here you see two people joining their lives together in a private, quiet way. His uncertainty shows how new this all is for him. It’s charming and touching. I think the way the two double beds were pushed together in a makeshift fashion is also a lovely touch. That’s a nice quote you mention. It goes something like this in the original English version: “Show me. You do everything you’ve always done, and when you get to the end, I’ll be here too. That’s the procedure.” I love how after she tells him to show her he goes over to her and lovingly kisses her and takes her in his arms. You really see how much they love each other. It all rings very true.

I also very much love the scene with Jack and Joy at the barn in the “Golden Valley.” They’re so much in love, yet they have this great burden hanging over them that he doesn’t want to have to face yet. “The pain then is part of the happiness now.”

The scene when he first looks at her “properly” is also a great, moving scene with Jack and Joy.

This is one of my very favorite films too. It’s incredibly moving and touching in an honest, upfront way, not overly melodramatic and maudlin like a lot of tragic romance films.

(BTW, tu inglés es muy bien aqui.)

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That scene struck me too ... but maybe in a different way. I knew a bit of who
C.S. Lewis was from having read Narnia. This movie seemed like such a sentimental
moneymaker. I guess that is fine, but how would anyone know what these people's
real lives were likes or what their first moment alone in the bedroom would be like.

It all just seems so wrong to put stuff like that out about someone's life. Who
would ever know?

The movie was OK, and Anthony Hopkins did his usual professional job ... being
Anthony Hopkins. Debra Winger was good as well. I could not help notice that
almost every scene was pink and green or brown in it. The whole movie was this
old lady pastel colored ... dare I say "rose colored" vision of the world.

Then this started to bug me a little. But the movie is true in its ultimate
message and interesting. I cannot say it is one of my faviorites, I give it a
5.

The scene I got a kick out of was in the beginning when his buddies are in the
pub talking about his book, about how the children have to dig through their
mother's fur before they can be born into the world, and the Freudian symbolism.
And here ... I guess anyway, because there was no information to the contrary
that C.S. Lewis was a virgin ... ie. had not ever been with a woman.

The symbolism and style of this movie was indeed very Freudian .. and that is
what made it interesting for me. I wonder if anyone brought that up in the message
board or said anything about it?

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It’s nice that you read his children’s books, but you could find out a lot more about the subject of this movie by reading Lewis’s A Grief Observed. Then you would see that it was Lewis himself who published to the world the passions and agonies of his marriage. Furthermore, we can know some about their more intimate moments because Joy wrote to some of her friends about them. I would think the published quotes from her letters (some significantly more intimate than this love scene) would be more “wrong” than anything in this movie. I’ve never heard anyone complain about her letters or A Grief Observed either. What I see is that these two people were very much in love, and Jack was devastated by her loss. This the movie portrays accurately. If it’s not perfect in the letter of the facts, it’s at least accurate in the spirit of the true story, which is more than I can say for most movies.

Likewise, this does not strike me as a “sentimental moneymaker” at all. I think it’s very rare for a film to deal with a love story in this quiet, real sort of way. This is not at all a typical popular film (and certainly not like the types of movies Hollywood puts out). I personally love the pastel colors of the film (and I’m not an “old lady”); very fitting. About the being a virgin thing, the movie doesn’t make that clear. In the movie Lewis notes that he had been an atheist when he was younger. I see no reason to assume that he would have lived by Christian ethics and moral restraints as an atheist, but who knows? (From what I’ve read, though, I’d be very surprised if the real Lewis had been a virgin before his marriage.)

I don’t see the message as Freudian at all. Just because Freud is mentioned (and dismissed) by Lewis, hardly makes anything in the film Freudian. Lewis himself did not care much for Freud. What I see as the message of the film is that all people, even intelligent, successful, reserved people, need to open themselves up to love and the vulnerabilities that love brings, even if it means getting hurt in the process. That reminds me of something that Lewis’s stepson Douglas Gresham once said about all relationships ending in pain, because either the couple will break up or eventually one of them will die. The message of the film is, go ahead anyway, love’s worth it. This is true of both the movie and the real life Jack and Joy.

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I appreciate your lengthy answer, and I see you have reason for your beliefs.
I guess I was trying to express and ambivalence ... not knowing all this from
C.S. Lewis' life not sure quite what to make of this movie.

I did enjoy it, and I got something out of it.

It was not all about trying relationships ... as Joy said several times in
the movie Lewis had his life all set up so that nothing can get to him.

There was a lot in that movie whatever C.S. Lewis and Joy were like or whatever
they believed. Personally I think Freud was a genius on the level of Einstein
and there is a lot to be understood about anyone in an objective way.

Perhaps I have just gotten a bit jaded by the manipulations of Hollywood to
the point where everything is just a plot device to make money ... I would not
say it was an "art" type movie because it did look fairly high budget with
a known name star.

I think in order to see this aspect of this man other things have to be
abandoned, as in the reality of two children, and Lewis' earlier life.

This is one of the few movies where someone actually is delivering a sermon
in the movie ... ie. Lewis about pain ... funny that he gave the sermon before
he learned the lesson ... or maybe that enabled him to see it when it
occurred in his life.

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It was not all about trying relationships ... as Joy said several times in
the movie Lewis had his life all set up so that nothing can get to him.
Yes, I didn’t mean to limit the message in that way. I see this aspect as going hand in hand with the love aspect. Lewis has built an emotional wall around himself. Because of the experience of his mother’s death and perhaps other things not mentioned, he decided to try to protect himself from being hurt by carefully situating his life so that no one could hurt him. Joy sees that he’s doing this not only to her, but also to his friends and students. It was his love for her that broke through this wall and, shall we say, made him embrace life and its concomitant pains. So I suppose the message is not only “loving others is worth the pain and joys that it brings,” but also “living and opening yourself up to others in general and not constantly playing it safe is worth it too.”

Of course almost anything can be interpreted in a Freudian way, but I don’t think that’s what anyone making this film intended (and I think Lewis certainly wouldn’t like such an interpretation). However, I see no reason not to look at it in a Freudian way if you want to, I just don’t think that should be one’s primary interpretation of the film. I think you might find this book interesting: The Question of God: C.S. Lewis and Sigmund Freud Debate God, Love, Sex, and the Meaning of Life by Armand M. Nicholi Jr. (Of course, they didn’t actually debate in real life; the author merely compares and contrasts their writings.)

If you see the director, Richard Attenborough, talk about this film in interviews, I think you’d understand that he believed strongly in this project and was very moved by the story. I feel quite certain he was not out just to make a buck with this relatively small English film. The man who wrote the screenplay, William Nicholson, was also the author of the stage play. So the story was not written for the movies. It had a fair amount of success as a play with Nigel Hawthorne in the main role. It had been done as a television movie on the BBC too prior to this movie with the respected thespians, Joss Ackland and Claire Bloom in the leading roles. This is not typical Hollywood garbage. It had a different development as a play from most screenplays, and I think it has a different feel to it than anything I’ve seen Hollywood put out.

This is one of the few movies where someone actually is delivering a sermon
in the movie ... ie. Lewis about pain ... funny that he gave the sermon before
he learned the lesson ... or maybe that enabled him to see it when it
occurred in his life.
I think this is an interesting point you brought up. I think he definitely found it harder to live his sermon than to advise others to live by it (isn’t that always the case?). In the end though I do think his beliefs about pain helped him deal with his own pain, though he still had to struggle hard with it. I do like the way they juxtapose theoretical knowledge vs. personal experience in the film.

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Lewis hints in his allegorical writings to an early loss of virginity,
perhaps with lower-class young women.

What he does not discuss is Mrs. Moore. My guess is that they were not lovers,
but that she manipulated Lewis' senses of frozen grief over his mother and
"survivor responsibility" for his fallen comrade. Hence he became a surrogate son for his comrade while she became a surrogate mother (and exploiter) of Lewis.

In "The Four Loves," Lewis does not sound like an ingenue at Eros.

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