MovieChat Forums > Batman: Mask of the Phantasm (1993) Discussion > Its almost 2014 and still no Batman film...

Its almost 2014 and still no Batman film has come close to this.

posted 10 years ago by GameofMoans
19 replies | jump to latest

The grave yard scene? An actual noir/detective story! Joker using salami instead of the knife? The music? Everything about this film is so beyond what any live action Batman film has done its almost pathetic. Christopher Nolan had how much money for Dark Knight Rises? Quarter of a billion? Ridiculous. Sure the dark knight had a great performance by Heath Ledger but its pretty weak everywhere else(hate Aaron Eckhart as Dent. The courtroom scene at the beginning is awful). This needs to be on Blu Ray! The BTAS team should be given a giant budget, free reign, the works! They would deliver a Batman film for the ages. Its almost like Warner Bros wants to bury this movie so more people don't discover it and realize how awesome Batman done right can be. Its a cult favourite right? Maybe the HD remaster would cost too much, I don't know, but I just really wish this film would get a little more respect in the film community. Like "The Iron Giant" it's criminally underrated(guess which company released Iron Giant? No bluray for that yet either)

[–] CroseusProject 10 years ago

Speak for yourself. I'm a huge fan of this movie, but in my book the whole Dark Knight trilogy surpasses it.

It is in need of a blu-ray release, that I agree with. The whole BTAS series should get the blu-ray treatment.

[–] bond_98 10 years ago

I can think of many bat-book that is better than the dark knight. The more i watch it more it seems like a convoluted mess covered up by one good proformance. Im a batman first. I dont about kissing a directors ass.

[–] 10 years ago

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[–] stingingtail 10 years ago

Heath Ledger was that good, and people were fussing over him even before he died. Especially after seeing the trailer of him in December '07.

The Dark Knight is the greatest Batman movie of all time. Not even Mask of the Phantasm can match it. 5 years later and it's still topping the polls, the popularity meters, and being praised by notable names like Steven Speilberg.

You ever see the likes of MOTP get that?

[–] bond_98 10 years ago

I would was say its the most Hyped Batman movie ever made. And Heath Ledger is the only one in the whole cast that kept this from being forgettable. It sure as hell wasnt Maggie Gyllenhaal, Aaron Eckhart or even Bale. If it wasnt for Ledger stealling the show the movie flaws would be far more apparent. Rises didnt have its own Heath Ledger. So its easy for pick up just how average the movie was. Also for a movie that people call the best BATMAN ever made. Batman is hardly in it. Like 89 batman, its mainly about the Joker and too lesser extent Two-face. And ive had enough with batman movie that are not about batman. Frankly i think batman begins was far better. It didnt have ten million unneeded subplots. I mean i think TDK is a good movie. But i dont see it as a flawless masterpiece or someone cant do better.

[–] CroseusProject 10 years ago

It is the most hyped Batman movie ever made, and it lived up to the hype. Ledger, Bale, Eckhart, and Oldman were all memorable in the movie. The flaws are minute.

Rises didn't need a Heath Ledger. It stood on it's own merits. That's why it made over a billion and has a 87% critic rating.

Batman is in TDK plenty. You obviously didn't pay attention to the movie if you believe that. Batman Begins is great but it's actually the weakest of the trilogy. The Dark Knight is the strongest. It's funny how the critic ratings reflect the order of quality for the trilogy. Very apt.

Nobody calls it a flawless masterpiece. Don't exaggerate. No movie is flawless.

[–] geearf 10 years ago

There is no way Begins is the weakest, seeing how Rises is bad whether the other two were not.

[–] GameofMoans 8 years ago

TDK & TDKR have more plot holes than any movie I can think of. TDK has its moments but of the whole I'd say it's pretty average. The action scenes are filmed poorly and are very unimaginative(oh gee another car chase, yay!). Not one scene in TDK can match the graveyard scene in MOTP. that's pathos ladies a gents. Bruce begging at his parents grave for everything to be ok? Come on. Nothing even close to that in TDK.

[–] ignas-emaitis-857-185488 10 years ago

"The Dark Knight is the greatest Batman movie of all time" <--- I lol'ed

polls top, the popularity meters, praise doesnt matter anything,as the most people have unrefined taste. You know what always topping the polls and popularity meters? porn movies.

TDK was just Nolan stealing material from Burton's movies, putting them in a moderan realistic spin, formula-produced hollywood garbage and making the good eye candy out of it which has nothing to do with real batman. With added pseudo-philosophical babble of a mental ability of 12 year old, ending with someone getting shot or killed in a poor attempt of making the film look more "deep" or mature, and saying this is the greatest Batman movie because of all this is quite immature.
Ironic because TDK fans are the ones sometimes calling TDK for being more mature then previous movies.

Overall TDK was pretty boring. Yeah this was not even a batman movie.

[–] 8 years ago

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[–] PreachCaleb 10 years ago

I don't think this needs to be on Blu-ray, but it definitely needs a special edition release.

Straightedge means I'm better than you.

[–] nicos21 10 years ago

I agree. The series contains the joined best Batman (with MK) best Joker and best Alfred.
For a cartoon this is pretty flawless and it's the most moving Batman interpretation.
The Tim Burton films are my favourites even though they are dated now but the Christopher Nolan ones will be dates in 25 years too.

I wouldn't say this is actually "better" than the fore mentioned films though because it's unfair to compare live action and animation.
The Christopher Nolan films and Tim Burton ones are almost too different to compare really, although I prefer the Burton ones.
The acting in the new films is better overall however. All mentioned versions are very good though.
The hype machine these films is more prominent today than in the early nineties that's for sure.

Everyone has to appreciate the 89 Batman broke new ground and was the first thing to properly show Batman the way Bob Kane intended it to be. I personally believe he'd much prefer Burton's films and the cartoon over Nolan's.

[–] spencermalley935 9 years ago

As you can see by my Avatar, I'm a huge BTAS fanboy and I'd happily put TDK trilogy on equal footing with MOTP.

[–] chumpbroni 8 years ago

I'd argue that Batman: Under the Red Hood is just below this Mask of the Phantasm.

[–] Milk_Tray_Guy 8 years ago

I'd argue that Batman: Under the Red Hood is just below this Mask of the Phantasm

Seconded. I rewatched UtRH just yesterday.

MotP 9/10
UtRH 8/10

All for a box of chocolates...

[–] T-eschberger 8 years ago

I can't help but feel that there is a lot of bandwagon jumping when it comes to Mask of the Phantasm.

Nobody remembered it was a thing for ages and then all of a sudden it gets rediscovered and people who fancy themselves "real" Batman fans use it a tool to act high and mighty over the plebs that think Nolan is the end all, beat all of Batman.

That's not to take away from the quality of the film, but this whole thing reeks of dick measuring and it's pathetic.

For the record, the only Nolan film I like is Batman Begins. It's still my favorite Batman movie. Then comes, Phantasm. 

My point is, stop acting like jerks about what you prefer.

[–] Shockwave1242 8 years ago

As one of the people that "rediscovered" the film years later (in my case is was 2012 when Rotten Tomatoes did a few articles recapping the theatrical Batman films in pairs), and has indeed held it as my favorite Batman film upon watching it, I agree.

I really love Mask of the Phantasm, but I also like the Nolan trilogy, and the Burton films for that matter. One film's greatness doesn't determine another film's *beep* They can all be good and beloved.

Now, I can see why people would side with MotP like this. The film's the underdog when it comes to best Batman film discussions, so when people watch and like it, they wanna push it above and beyond everything else. Animation's uphill battle in regards to being taken seriously as mature entertainment plays a part in that as well. However, that doesn't justify getting in this big dick-measuring contest. They're all enjoyable films, and we can all like them.

My personal rankings go:

--GOOD--
1. Mask of the Phantasm
2. Under the Red Hood
3. The Dark Knight Returns
4. Batman Returns
5. The Dark Knight
6. Batman '89
7. Subzero
8. The Dark Knight Rises
9. Year One
10. Gotham Knight
11. Batman Begins
12. The Batman vs. Dracula
13. The Killing Joke
14. Batman vs. Robin
15. Batman: Bad Blood
--BAD--
16. Batman v. Superman
17. Mystery of the Batwoman
18. Son of Batman
19. Batman & Robin

[–] Milk_Tray_Guy 8 years ago

Animation's uphill battle in regards to being taken seriously as mature entertainment plays a part in that as well

That's generally true. That said, the DCAU (of which MotP is a part) is hugely respected in terms of overall quality and for dealing with some very adult themes and issues.

All for a box of chocolates...

[–] LetThemEatCake01 8 years ago

As a Batman movie this is the best movie ever made. As a film of the Batman universe Batman Returns would be the best, but it doesn't focus on Batman, this one does.