And they rant on and on about how life in America is such a living hell and have homes in Europe where they play the great don or country squire, but they still keep their homes here and come back to make the millions they can make nowhere else. It's possible to get rich in other countries, but far tougher and these "enlightened" lands don't have nearly so many rich people, either in numbers and proportions. Somehow that's supposed to be a good thing.
They talk about the oppression of the working man, but the vegetarian ones fire workers for eating meat on their lunch hours (Paul McCartney), offending their political sensibilities (Ellen Burstyn, before she sank into unimportance), or even not applauding them loud enough. Before the sexual harassment laws were enacted, then-single Warren Beatty would have women fired for refusing to mess around with him.
But we shouldn't get off-topic any more. The fact is, "Raising Cain" didn't really punish the unfaithful wife, and her husband was wrong to try to kill her. She lived and will get the house and money, if there is any, and her lover or some new one. What I couldn't stand was making her out to be some kind of victim.
I once saw a TV movie where Tim Matheson killed his worthless wife's lover after she and the lover tried to murder him. Then he buried her alive with the money she wanted so badly. She was an evil woman, but it was a vicious murder and morally wrong. She should have gone to prison, not to such a horrid death.
I preferred an Edward Hermann TV film where he pretended to forgive his slutty wife who had only married him for his money. Then he kicked her out with only bus fare. Adultery is wrong, whether it's by Tiger Woods or Sarah Ferguson or Josh Duhamel or his wife Fergie, who didn't think having lesbian affairs was cheating on her husband. Go figure.
If people don't want to be faithful, they should stay single. You don't have to get married anymore. Single people over 30 are no longer pariahs as in the past. Women can have successful careers and financial independence. But the adulteress witch of a wife in Raising Cain wanted the money. I refuse to believe these women never know what these "unworthy men" are really like until after they marry them.
The husband in Raising Cain was a sick and violent man and should have been institutionalized or imprisoned, but his gold-digging, hot-britches wife was little better. He was a sicko. She didn't have that excuse.
reply
share
IceboxMovies
14 years ago
You guys are trying to engage in a pointless argument about "morality" that can't really help somebody trying to critique a De Palma film- it's that kind of superfluous feedback that's gotten De Palma accused of so many laughable charges: "treason", "mysogony", etc.
Like I said, if you want to see an actual De Palma film where the cheating wife is truly punished for her infidelity, there's always Dressed to Kill or, to an extent, Body Double.
But De Palma's been badly burned by all that neofeminist crap and has since been less harsh on his female characters unless their suffering is there for a specific political reason, i.e. his two most recent films, The Black Dahlia and Redacted. Or, there's Mission to Mars and Femme Fatale which place women in empowered roles. Either way, De Palma is one of the wisest filmmakers around when it comes to navigating your way through gender correctness, so the bickering here is futile.
What I don't understand is how we're going to stay alive this winter.
reply
share
pmiano100
14 years ago
Bickering is a God-given right, even if it solves nothing. My only point is that the wife in "Raising Cain" was an unsympathetic bitch who deserved to be taught a lesson, but not murdered. I have no desire to see anyone, man or woman, murdered just for infidelity. As for DePalma, "The Black Dahlia" and the disloyal "Redacted" both tanked in the box office. The latter proves that he is not so skilled in navigating political correctness.
I don't care about "morality" in films. I would love to fool around with married women, but my wife won't let me.
reply
share
IceboxMovies
14 years ago
As for DePalma, "The Black Dahlia" and the disloyal "Redacted" both tanked in the box office. The latter proves that he is not so skilled in navigating political correctness.
Huh? What do box office results have to do with anything? Many of De Palma's greatest films-
Hi, Mom!, Sisters, The Phantom of the Paradise, The Fury, Scarface, Femme Fatale- were financial lemmons. But they are nevertheless wonderful films that are getting their due.
And what do you mean by referring to
Redacted as "disloyal"?
Anyway, I was referring to his navigation of
gender correctness. His navigation of politics is more in tune to the sensibilities of somebody like Sam Fuller.
What I don't understand is how we're going to stay alive this winter.
reply
share
pmiano100
14 years ago
The reactions of spoiled upper-middle class film critics who do nothing but watch and talk movies all day mean nothing to me. Scarface has become a cult hit, but most of his other bombs remain unseen by ordinary moviegoers. You can't get your meassage across if no one is watching. Besides, not all critics think DePalma is a genius. Their darlings can become pariahs after a few reversals. Remember Wynonna Ryder and Michael Cimino?
reply
share
Altho73
14 years ago
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
'I don't care about "morality" in films. I would love to fool around with married women, but my wife won't let me.'
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
You're a far better person for not doing so pmiano, and you'll also feel much happier and contented - no worries of discovery, no guilty conscience, no stress at having to continue remembering lies etc, etc, etc.
As for my own feelings I do not admire or look up to, nor would I trust people like John F Kennedy, Bill Clinton (yuk that guy makes me sick) and now Tiger Woods. To me their behavior is both sordid and pathetic.
reply
share
IceboxMovies
14 years ago
Besides, not all critics think DePalma is a genius. Their darlings can become pariahs after a few reversals. Remember Wynonna Ryder and Michael Cimino?
Wait... what? Where did this comparison come from? Since when has De Palma ever undergone a trasnformation similar to Ryder's shoplifting or Cimino's transexuality? I don't get this...?
And why do I get the feeling that both of you are ill-educated yuppies who would rather moan about the good old days than discuss cinema? Neither of you seem to much respect De Palma as a filmmaker or cinema in general, either; I therefore fail to see why you hang around the
Raising Cain boards.
Oh, but of course your reply is going to be: "it's a God-given right".
What I don't understand is how we're going to stay alive this winter.
reply
share
pmiano100
14 years ago
My point is that critics are often wrong and very pretensious and fickle. They have not always loved DePalma's work. And bad as "Heaven's Gate" was, it was so reason to turn on Cimino the way they did. That was long before he came out, which is no big deal in Hollywood. And what really did shoplifting have to do with Ryder's professional fall? Actors who've far done worse have managed to salvage their careers.
reply
share
pmiano100
14 years ago
Ryder and Cimino were once darlings of the critics who fell from grace, long before Ryder started stealing or Cimino started cross-dressing. The critics are a fickle bunch who run hot and cold, especially on someone like DePalma. He is a good (but not great) director who has made bad decisions.
reply
share
pmiano100
14 years ago
Not to mention the fact that I will remain alive and in one piece. My wife of many years is a Latina, and does not believe in divorce. She does, however, believe in widowhood. Do you remember Lorena Bobbit of Ecuador? EWWWWWW!
reply
share