MovieChat Forums > The Jacksons: An American Dream (1992) Discussion > The scene about the nat'l anthem had to ...

The scene about the nat'l anthem had to be ficticious

posted 13 years ago by Sparky48
25 replies | jump to latest

The scene where the boys are on a plane en route to some ballgame to sing the "Star Spangled Banner" had to be fiction.

While on the plane, Suzanne DePasse informs the boys that they'll be arriving to a stadium in 30 minutes to sing the national anthem. But they inform her that they don't know the words to the song. Frantically, Suzanne, who doesn't know the words to the anthem herself, asks every passenger on the airplane if they know the words, but none of them do (yeah, right).

I mean, come on. Any adult American male who watches major sports on TV on a regular basis, as many do, couldn't help but not know the words to the "Star Spangled Banner," as it is customary to play the national anthem before all sporting events. Also, just about everyone at some point during elementary school has to learn the words to the nat'l anthem. Add to that, there's no way in hell that those kids could have learned the melody and lyrics to the anthem in just 15 minutes.

This scene was just too Hollywoodish.

[–] kickinitwiththekliq 13 years ago

The Jacksons genuinely didn't know the words. Remember they were dragged out of school a lot to perform and being Jehova Witnesses did not salute the flag nor pledge alliegiance.
Granted the fact that no one else on the plane knew it is just Hollywood fodder.
Though Michael used to learn three songs for Jackson 5 albums in 30 minutes so it's possible he learned it in 15 minutes. I think they are a bit iffy on the melody in the actual performance.

"I had an epiphany too! Now I can't spell it but I had an epiphany too!" - Shawn Michaels

[–] Sparky48 13 years ago

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"Granted the fact that no one else on the plane knew it is just Hollywood fodder."
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And that's my point. On a plane consisting of over 20 American citizens--white citizens at that--there's no way in hell that all of them would be oblivious to the lyrics of the nat'l anthem.

Michael, as an obvious child prodigy, could learn the words to songs very quickly, but it's hard for me to imagine that he could have grasped the melody of a song he never heard in just 15 minutes.

[–] furienna 12 years ago

And that's my point. On a plane consisting of over 20 American citizens--white citizens at that--there's no way in hell that all of them would be oblivious to the lyrics of the nat'l anthem.

And why do you assume, that white people would know it better than others?

Intelligence and purity.

[–] Sparky48 12 years ago

This scene took place in the early 70s, during the militant period in black America. During this period, if you were black and patriotic to the U.S., you were deemed a "Tom." That said, not many blacks would have known all of the lyrics to the nat'l anthem because many wouldn't have cared. (During this time when the anthem was played before sporting events, many blacks wouldn't even stand and pledge allegiance.)

But by contrast, whites in America have always been patriotic because they have always had freedom and first-class citizenship in this country. This is what I meant by my statement.

[–] WalkAwayRenee 12 years ago

I see your problems extend from simple rudeness all the way into blatant racism.

[–] Sparky48 12 years ago

Just like I see that if you have else nothing better to do with your life then venture through my profile and stalk me via IMDb, you REALLY need to find something--or someone for that matter--to do, ma'am.

[–] WalkAwayRenee 12 years ago

Actually I never even went near your profile. This post is on the same movie board on which you saw fit to give me an unnecessarily rude answer to one of my posts. You don't have to answer any post you don't want to, but you did, and in a rude manner. I just happened to glean that it probably had little to do with me. You're just a generally socially awkward soul. *shrugs* Has no bearing on what's happening or not happening with me.

[–] queencity86 12 years ago

WalkAwayRenee, His answer wasn't rude, it's true. Don't you know anything about the 70's and the black power movement (not saying the Jacksons were part of the Movement)? That's a known fact and even my parents tried to be part of the movement back in 70's and didn't participate in the national anthem. I think they know it, (they do know it), but don't think they knew it word for word back then.

[–] WalkAwayRenee 12 years ago

The fact that he told me I needed to "find someone to do" rather than "stalk" him was what was rude, not the comment about the national anthem and whether or not black people knew it, and besides, that actually wasn't the comment I was talking about where the poster Sparky was concerned. I made another harmless post on this board and he felt the need to put a rude answer on it. That's the rudeness I was referring to. Then he decided to call me names because I told him if he didn't have a productive answer to a post that wasn't harming anyone then he shouldn't bother to answer. I still am not sure why that particular post bothered him so much. It was only a reference to someone I know having gone to school with Suzanne DePasse back in the day, nothing more. Maybe not that interesting to him, but again, he could have passed up my post without a second thought but he felt it would be more interesting to put a flippant "who cares" answer. *shrugs* And maybe this is irrelevant, but despite being black, I have known all the words to the national anthem since I was eight or nine. This was more in the the late seventies after the so called "movement" but I was too young to be involved in all that. I knew nothing about patriotism and what I was supposed to represent or be as a black person, I just learned it because it was in a book of standards I read at the time. The song didn't represent anything to me other than being the Star Spangled Banner.

[–] Sparky48 12 years ago

Renee,

When you posted that comment about your mom attending college at same time that Suzanne De Passe did. I remarked, "So?" because I couldn't see the significance of it. It seemed to me to be a bit pretentious, and I thought you were saying this to try and impress.

My "find someone to do" remark was a bit harsh I admit, but I thought that you were venturing through my profile. It was also retaliation for calling me a "racist," which I thought was not only unfair but wrong. Bear in mind that YOU were the one who went on the offensive on this particular post board.

Nevertheless, I apologize.

[–] WalkAwayRenee 12 years ago

I have no reason to try to impress anyone here, least of all you. I had no idea who you even were when I posted the thread so why am I trying to impress a bunch of strangers? I don't consider it "pretentious" that my mom happened to go to school with someone who is now, or was at one time connected with Motown records/the Jacksons. As originally mentioned, it was nothing more than a "six degrees" sort of reference. So yeah, not interesting information I guess, let alone pretentious. Other than people who know this movie or any backstory of the Jacksons, probably no one even knows who Suzanne DePasse is. If you perceived me as being defensive it was because I saw no reason (and still see no reason) why it would bother you that a stranger on an internet forum would mention a minor and therefore definitely unimpressive connection to someone from a movie. If in fact it didn't interest you, you didn't have to continue the conversation. As for the racism, I took offense at the implication that black people weren't "patriotic" enough to know the words to the national anthem, an opinion which was then verified as a "fact" by the next poster, but whatever. If you're not racist, then great. However, I made the racism comment based strictly on your post and maybe I misjudged you considering I already had a history of being the victim of your unprovoked vitriolic commentary. But your comment to me about being a stalker who probably wasn't getting any was made only to be mean and hateful. My apologies as well, but that offended me.

[–] sirrap2 12 years ago

As a kid going to American schools we had to 'salute the flag' and sing the Star Spangled Banner every morning before classroom work. Being I'm in my late 30's now and haven't sung the song in years, I can only recall the first couple of verses--like the characters in the movie did.

So it's possible that adults on that plane with, I'm sure, more important things on their minds like seeing their loved ones, concern about their employment, or helping that particular relative get that monkey off their back...the Star-Spangled Banner was probably not even a dust fragment part in their minds. lol

'Life my a$$ motha flucka, this is a bidness.'

[–] WalkAwayRenee 12 years ago

In my school we just did the pledge of allegiance and My Country Tis of Thee. I don't recall ever having to do the Star Spangled Banner when I was in school. I taught it to myself when I was about eight or so, and I'm also in my late thirties and still remember the words. I guess it's just one of those things that stays with some people. lol, for that matter I still remember all the words to some TV sitcoms I haven't seen since about 1983 or 1984.

[–] Sparky48 12 years ago

So, you're nearing 40, eh Renee? Hmm...interesting.

[–] WalkAwayRenee 12 years ago

Indeed, faster than I care to, these days. Forgive me, considering our volatile history, if I'm almost afraid to ask why you think that's of interest. Oh, or is that a tongue in cheek reference to your previous disinterest in my mother's college acquaintances? You don't have to take the opposite approach and now feign intrigue at every minor comment I might make here Many of my attempts at humor or wit often fall flat. I guess all those years at the Academy of Interesting Conversation Starters were for nothing. See, there's another attempt. Don't worry, I have the crickets cued up already.

*crickets*

[–] jefgg 10 years ago

I almost forgot the Jacksons were Jehovah's Witnesses. Did the kids ever get picked on because of it?

[–] FireMinstrel 9 years ago

Probably. Even moreso in L.A. I'd imagine.

[–] deem714 11 years ago

Meh...

I will say one thing... Many Americans don't realize that is not "over the ramparts" It's "o'er".

You really can't expect them to have any experience seeing a baseball game when their entire life is spent on stage, in a bus/van, in school, or asleep.

LOL at learning the National Anthem at school -- uh, NO... I am sorry to say that we don't learn that school (at least by heart). We only started learning God Bless America and America the Beautiful because of 9/11.

She was the moron who didn't even CHECK to see if they even KNEW the song way before the got on the plane.

I had a problem with the continuity of this scene... Here they are on the plane and Michael seems to be fine... The next scene is them at the airport and Michael is freaking out.

Oh Thank you God! Thank you so BLOODY much!Basil Fawlty

[–] 11 years ago

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[–] marbleann 10 years ago

The Star Spangled Banner. Come on. Can the words be more forgettable. Spangle? It doesn't seen so far fetch, The song is difficult and I think unless you sing it the words do not come to you easy. Oh say can you be by the dawns early night, ramparts and bombs bursting in air sounds like a war song. which it was along with a drinking song. It is poem put to the the music of some British pub song.

I really do believe it happened. Also how often do most people actually sing the song after you leave elementary school? It is not like we are living in some communist country and speakers come on in the streets and certain times of day and you have to sing the National Anthem. When I lived in Madrid and they were having civil problems they would do that. I was shocked but I had to stand there and with my hand on my heart and wait. better believe I remember those words real quick and I can't speak spanish. lol

Heck I look at the Baseball, Basketball and Hockey Players when they sing and half of them seems like they don't know the words. I say change it to something so people will remember and can sing with out having voice training to sing it correctly. I say American the Beautiful, Oh Beautiful For Spacious Skies. I bet they would known those words on the plane.

BTW IMO La Marseillaise is the most wonderful anthem. So wonderful people use it for other music. It really gets you going and I am not French. Oh it has nothing to do with some kind of racial strife or radicalism. The song is just difficult. And the something would happen today, probably worse.

[–] Sparky48 10 years ago

Interesting point, Marble.

[–] marbleann 10 years ago

It is a very difficult song. And it is a hard song to sing. This was not our anthem until 1931 when Hoover made it official, what has Hoover done that was any good? lol
I had read before the Our Country Tis of Thee was being used before but it has the same music as God Save the Queen. I also heard America the Beautiful wasn't used because they used the word America and that could mean any of the Americans. Frankly I like that song better. I just read that In March 2005, some poll was taken and it showed that many Americans did not know the words or the history so they started some program for us to learn it. So apparently the scene was true. BTW Suzanne is my grandmother brothers granddaughter. They are Jamaicans. So there is a 6 degree connection. lol

[–] 10 years ago

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[–] Sparky48 10 years ago

Thanks Flowerchild. And I agree with you that this was written for dramatic purposes, because it was VERY unrealistic.

[–] AmyJolamb 8 years ago

That sad truth is if you ask people on the street if they know every single word to the National Anthem they will say know. Most know the key parts and tune but not every single word.