MovieChat Forums > Hamlet (1991) Discussion > Anyone find the Hamlet/Gertrude kiss jus...

Anyone find the Hamlet/Gertrude kiss just a little bit weird?


So we watched this in English and i was wondering if anyone else finds the kiss between Hamlet and Gertrude in the "Thou hast thy father much offended" scene, just a little bit more than a family kiss?

They have like a makeout session on the bed!


Well yeah, all my friends were looking around at everyone else at that part to make sure they weren't the only ones thinking that in that scene.

Anyone else agree?


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Well duh

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Yeah...
The explanations I've heard have to do with an Oedipal feeling - he discovers in that scene that his mother has a sexuality, and he's kind of on his way to taking on his father's identity.

Still weirds me out a little, though...

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Gertrude's marriage to her dead husbands brother was considered incest in Shakespeare's time. The kiss Hamlet forces upon her is the only imputation of her guilt for this. None of the dialog address this issue. The whole court knows that the wedding should not have occurred but no one says anything about it.

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You're supposed to find it weird. That's the point.

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I thought it was weirder when he was like raping her on the bed.LoL

He was pretending you were a woman? No, that's not gay. Totally fine."

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AFAIK, one of the first Oedipal interpretations of this was the 1922 John Barrymore production. Zefferelli just took it to a new level by having Hamlet illustrate just how vile & guilty he thinks Gertrude is.

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It is funny how the play has gone from Shakespeare originate updating of of the Orestes/Electra plays to Oedipus.

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This was my favorite scene in the whole movie!

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Shakespeare intended for Hamlet to be perceived as having an Oedipal Complex for his mother, so it made sense that the movie showed this. The scene where Hamlet shoves her down on the bed also show that as well. It was definitely meant to be shown as more than a family kiss. In fact, many people familiar with Shakespeare's play hold the belief that the only reason Hamlet was so against his stepfather was because he held sexual feelings for Gertrude.

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Shakespeare intended for Hamlet to be perceived as having an Oedipal Complex for his mother, so it made sense that the movie showed this.


That's quite a lofty statement. I wouldn't say Shakespeare intended [what would now be considered] a Freudian reading of Hamlet. It's certainly one critical interpretation of Hamlet's relationship with his mother, however it is not the definitive reading of the play. There are many Shakespearean scholars who disagree with this reading quite vehemently.

Personally I don't think there's enough evidence in the play to warrant such a reading. Hamlet is certainly disgusted by his mothers sexuality and much of his animosity towards her is caused by her promiscuous nature (i.e. incestuous relationship with his uncle). I don't, however, believe this can be read as Hamlet having an Oedipal Complex, I never have understood how one can come to such a reading.

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The law of universal gravitation seems to have been effective even before Newton. Similarly, if Freud is right that the resolution of the Oedipal Complex constitutes a fundamental element in the development of the human psyche, Shakespeare could have reached an intuition of its mechanics and incorporated it into his play.

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"Shakespeare COULD HAVE," certainly. I think that the point that the previous poster was making is that there's little evidence to suggest that Shakespeare DID consider and insert and Oedipal Complex into this play.

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That's quite a lofty statement. I wouldn't say Shakespeare intended [what would now be considered] a Freudian reading of Hamlet. It's certainly one critical interpretation of Hamlet's relationship with his mother, however it is not the definitive reading of the play. There are many Shakespearean scholars who disagree with this reading quite vehemently.


Well...kinda, but not really. While Shakespeare obviously predates Freud by hundreds of years, the idea of a man supplanting his father by sleeping with his mother/stepmother (and this being a great sin) appears in the Bible and the ancient Greek plays, both of which Shakespeare knew. Since he was obsessed with ancient Roman history, he'd have also known about the Roman obsession with the sanctity of the paterfamilias.

Basically, Hamlet is trapped in a cultural conundrum, partly due to his mother having married his father's brother (which, as has been pointed out, was considered incest in Shakespeare's time)--he is expected to avenge his father or be damned. But if he avenges his father, he *will* be damned, particularly when he thinks he has to take revenge on his mother, as well (though, in this scene, his father's ghost appears and tells him not to harm her). And part of this involves literally replacing his father as King, which means, in a way, emotionally marrying his mother thanks to her unfortunate second marriage to his uncle. His is Orestes and Oedipus' dramatic conflicts wrapped up in one.

There's another wrinkle, in that there was an idea at the time that ghosts were not necessarily who they appeared to be. So, Hamlet wasn't entirely sure at first whether this was really his father's ghost or some demonic spirit, or if there had even been a murder. Hence the whole thing with the play to make sure there really was a crime to avenge.

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Pure rubbish. There is absolutely nothing in the text that even hints at an oedipal complex. Neither is there a kiss, a bed or a bedroom for that matter. Act 3 Scene 4 takes place in Gertrude's closet -a private chamber.

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There is no way Shakespeare intended this scene to be oedipal. Act 3 Scene 4 is not set set in a bedroom and there is no bed. This scene is set in Gertrude's closet. A closet is a private room off the bedchamber.

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its supposed to be reflecting a sort of Oedipus complex..I don't like it.

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[deleted]

You should see the Laurence Olivier version. Gertrude is mushing all over him in the opening scene and Claudius looks at them like wtf and says "Come, Madam!"

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