Muddy Sense Of Morality


I really like this film, but the morality of the main characters frustrates me.

First of all, it's a bit hard to root for the "good guys" as they're shotgunning the *beep* out of the "bad guys" for dealing in liquor when prohibition was repealed only a few years after this movie was set. Kevin Costner may give a speech the the start to some cops about how liquor might not be dangerous, but it is against the law, but later on he even admits to breaking laws himself in order to get the job done. At the end when the reporter tells him that prohibition will end soon, it makes the whole bloodbath seem rather pointless. I guess that's why they showed the little girl being blown up at the start, to make the bad guys seem really bad.

Secondly, it clearly shows the accountant Oscar Wallace taking a drink from one of the barrels after shotgunning the *beep* out of some mobsters for dealing in the stuff, and Jim Malone taking out a bottle hidden in his oven and having a drink before he is shot. It's like watching a movie about some DEA agents killing crooks for dealing in cocaine and then going home to snort some after a day at work policing the streets. Pretty hypocritical. At least they both die.

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Are you being serious?

Have you considered that movies aren't necessarily supposed to legitimise whatever morals or values you practice while sitting down watching them? It's not an accident that there's ambivelence. The film-mkaers as well as law-makers and anyone with half a brain is aware of the irony that making liquor illegal only created a violent, organised bootleging industry, whose influence spread into established supposedly moral institutions. And industry that was initially fought with violent means. Ness talks about their duty to uphold the law, primarily to protect the public from criminals. Taking a gulp of whiskey that would otherwise end up down a drain does not pose a threat to the public. Neither is it immoral. The absurdity of enjoying simple pleasures, without harm to anyone else, being immoral as long as they are illegal should be obvious to anyone.

This is not the only film that shows criminals being violently apprehended by the law. I don't believe it's taken The Untouchables to make you aware of this.

At least you'll die some day, morally immmaculate I presume, so you won't have to perpetually suffer this kind of discomfort from watching films like this.


Glasgow's FOREMOST authority Italics = irony. Infer the opposite please.

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I was entirely on the bootleggers' Side.No victim,no crime. I'm glad Ness died broke from cancer.

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What? Violent murdering bootleggers who didn't care if innocent people were exploited or harmed because of their activities which were prompted by prohibition laws.

Ness had nothing to do with the little girl getting blown up at the beginning.

Glasgow's FOREMOST authority Italics = irony. Infer the opposite please.

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The prohibition laws were unjust so good luck to those who resisted them.

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resisted them


Not if that includes the harrasment, murder, and extortion of the public. Not of the organised criminals who "resisted" them are also involved in other activities which leech off, harm and exploit ordinary, innocent people.

Glasgow's FOREMOST authority Italics = irony. Infer the opposite please.

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I was entirely on the bootleggers' Side.No victim,no crime. I'm glad Ness died broke from cancer.

Marmaduke, umm you're being trolled.
Noone with a soul could actually truly believe that.


Cheers

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I basically do.

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No one is forced to drink. I don't.
Would Ness ' defenders have enforced the Fugitive Slave Law?

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He died from a sudden heart attack and still had money in the bank even though he was suffering business failures.

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What? Everyone who uses their products is a victim.

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Secondly, it clearly shows the accountant Oscar Wallace taking a drink from one of the barrels after shotgunning the *beep* out of some mobsters for dealing in the stuff, and Jim Malone taking out a bottle hidden in his oven and having a drink before he is shot. It's like watching a movie about some DEA agents killing crooks for dealing in cocaine and then going home to snort some after a day at work policing the streets. Pretty hypocritical. At least they both die.


I don't know if you've seen The Godfather (you should), but oranges are a death omen in that film. Liquor serves the same purpose in this film. Anybody who takes a drink dies like Wallace and Malone did.

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fyi - the 18th amendment (prohibition) made illegal "the production, transport, and sale of alcohol" ... not drinking it or even possessing it.

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This has been repeated several times in these threads - the Volstead Act (aka "Prohibition") did not outlaw the possession or consumption of intoxicating liquors, it prohibited only the manufacture, transport, or sale of it. Specifically, it said "no person shall manufacture, sell, barter, transport, import, export, deliver, or furnish any intoxicating liquor except as authorized by this act." Notice that it said nothing about possession or consumption. Therefore it was NOT illegal for the accountant or anyone else to take a drink of the beverage that was squirting out of the lawfully seized barrel after the shootout with smugglers at the border. It fact, it was not an uncommon practice back then to smell and taste what was in the barrels or bottles to make sure it was indeed liquor and not just grape juice or whatever. Spitting it out was optional.

That's not to mention the fact that 90% of this movie was pure fiction, including many characters who never existed in real life. The accountant-agent was one of the movie's many fictional characters, and having him take a sip out of the barrel was simply a plot device (foreshadowing).

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Old post, but to emphasize your point;

My father was Italian and made his own wine and beer. Someone reported him to the feds for violation of prohibition. The feds came. They were polite but efficient. They examined his supply and his equipment.

Then they apologized. They said they had to investigate but he was well within the law. And they left, never to return.

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But... making your own wine and beer IS manufacture, which was prohibited....

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No, it was not if it was for personal consumption.

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Yeah, vices aren't really crimes, because they don't harm anyone else. Laws against vices are just one group of people trying to stop another group of people from doing what they want.

But if you outlaw a popular vice, you will create an economic opportunity for some really bad people to get into that business. And a lot of jobs for law enforcement to round them up.

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If you think alcohol abuse does not harm anyone else then you must be like 12.

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Repeal victimless crime laws and release all.those in.jail for them. That would reduce prison overcrowding.

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